Results 1 to 17 of 17

Thread: Dht -- hairloss

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    R.I.P T-MOS ENGLAND
    Posts
    820

    Dht -- hairloss

    Hey guys im back after couple of months off ,been training and stickin to diet but ive been gear free for around 4-6months now. I Still have a large bald patch on the back of my head lucky i can kinda cover it up, doctors said its alopecia... im thinking becuase of the steriods i have used...(d-bol,winni,var {tabs} and also proviron which is intresting)

    Im one of those guys that gets a reaction or side effect to most things, i dont no if im MBP prone as this is the first time my hair has fallen out, i have think hair med background, i found from the above that i am also prove to gyno.

    As you can see i have only done a couple of cycle before and loosing my hair at 22 is not for me, is there a way forward for me using AAS without loosing my hair again or even loosing it for good..? If anyone has advice, or knows more then me please help.
    RoidBoidd

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    The Endless Obsession
    Posts
    772
    i think youll be fine if you continue using AAS just stay away from highly androgenic hormones(DHT's). go for test and deca or something along those lines

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    R.I.P T-MOS ENGLAND
    Posts
    820
    see thats were it gets complicated, im a pro athlete and get tested every 6months so i need detection time down, also would you wait for hair to regrow before starting cycle and also you not reomend me take anythink to combat it suring cycle or pct?

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    The Endless Obsession
    Posts
    772
    well i would assume you are taking something to combat it considering you know your losing hair and you asked your doc about it. i wouldnt take my chances personally if i got tested every 6 mo's bro.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    The Endless Obsession
    Posts
    772
    do a search on this youll find the answers to your questions

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    yo momas house
    Posts
    503
    var and test prop with a 5ar blocker are your best bet, dutastride is supposed to be much more effective than proscar but I cant tell you the results from personal experience. good luck bro

    Anavar ............................................3 weeks
    Anadrol........................................... ..2 months
    Andriol........................................... ...1 week
    Boldenone Undecyclenate...................4-5 months
    Clen.............................................. ...4-5 Days
    DBol ................................................5 weeks
    Deca ................................................18 months
    Ephedrin ...........................................4-5 Days
    Halo.............................................. ....2 months
    Methamphetamin ...............................6-10 Days
    Nandrolon Phenylprop ........................12 months
    Nilevar........................................... ....5-6 weeks
    Parabolan......................................... ..4-5 weeks
    Proviron.......................................... ...5 weeks
    Primo Depot.......................................4-5 weeks
    Sustanon ...........................................3 months
    Spiropent......................................... ...4-5 days
    Test cyp .............................................3 months
    Test enat ............................................3 months
    Test Prop.............................................2-3 weeks
    Trenbolon Acet ....................................4-5 weeks
    *Test supspenison No metabolites. t/e should be back to normal in days
    Equipoise......................................... ....4-5months
    Winny oral...........................................3 weeks .
    Winny inj.............................................2 months

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    yo momas house
    Posts
    503
    more info bout hair loss
    http://www.hairloss-research.org/steroids.html

    STEROIDS AND HAIR LOSS


    HAIR LOSS AND "JUICE"


    It used to be thought that having a full healthy head of hair and a muscular ripped body were contradictory, if not mutually exclusive propositions, after all if hair loss was related to DHT, and high male hormone levels, how could anyone maximize their own anabolic potential and not have to simultaneously deal with hair loss?? I am personally self absorbed and narcissistic enough to demand both, and have dedicated a great deal of time investigating just how I could have both. All I can tell you is that, after talking to literally hundreds of athletes and bodybuilders, and my own personal experience, it is possible, but you have to know what you're doing.

    In this piece I will delve into what effects certain "anabolic agents" consistently have on scalp hair, so you won't inadvertently compromise your hair, or perhaps miss out on some beneficial anabolic agents for fear they will. It may seem to some like I'm advocating the use of certain steroids or stacks, and perhaps I am. I've been training for more then 20 years, and have rally been around the block in this business. I have never had a desire to compete, but have successfully (and unsuccessfully at times) used various "anabolic agents" to stay in top shape, and will continue to do so.

    My commitment is simply to tell you in a straightforward, no B.S. way and which ones are safe to use. The medical and legal considerations and ramifications are obviously yours to deal with on an individual basis. As always, consult a "physician".

    Deca Durabolin - I've never had a problem with my hair on this one, neither have hundreds of other guys I've talked to. The safety of this steroid, as far as hairloss is concerned, stems from the fact that 5-alpha-reductase enzyme, instead of converting it to a stronger androgen like DHT, converts it to a very mild androgen called DHN. Taken in dosages of up to 300-400 mg weekly it shouldn't produce any hairloss problems, this is due to the fact that, being a highly HPTA supressive androgen, 300-400 mg are no more androgenic than our endogenous testosterone (supressed while we are taking it) would be.. One BIG word of caution: While you are taken Deca Durabolin never ever take 5AR blockers such as Proscar/Propecia, for it would block the conversion of nandrolone to DHN in tissues such as the scalp and the prostate, resulting in hairloss and BPH, which is what we are trying to avoid taking Deca.

    Testosterone cypionate, propionate, etc., androderm, sustanon 250: All of these are different testosterone preparations, they all have the same properties as far as hairloss is concerned: they convert to DHT via 5-alpha-reductase enzyme. That's the main reason why testosterone is so androgenic. However, if one takes testosterone along with a 5AR blocker such as Proscar it's not nearly that harmful for your hair. So, if you are concerned about hairloss and are taking testosterone, always use it along with Proscar. Take into account that DHT is an anti-estrogen and blocking it while your body has supraphysiological levels of testosterone might lead to gynecomastia, so it's advisable to combine Proscar with Arimidex (an aromatase inhibitor).

    Anadrol\50 - If you value your hair, don't touch this one with a ten foot pole. Nothing seems to control its negative effects on hair. Not Proscar, Not Nizoral, nothing...

    Dianabol -Same as Anadrol\50.

    Primobolan - One of the less androgenic steroids. If you are concerned about hairloss this steroid is for you. It's much more anabolic than it is androgenic.

    Oxandrolone (Anavar) - It's the safest steroid for your hair along with Primobolan and Deca.

    Boldenone (Equipoise) - After the Primo, Anavar and Deca this is probably one of the safest for your hair. Although it undergoes 5-alpha-reduction, its affinity for this enzyme is minimal, so there is very little conversion. Moreover, its 5-alpha-reduced form is not as androgenic as DHT.

    DHEA - Does not negatively affect hair in men. May help prevent hair loss by offsetting the binding of DHT to follicles. The product is a Disaster for women with hair loss. DHEA causes hair loss in women much like DHT in Men. DHEA discriminates against women.

    Androstenedione - The worst of all prohormones in the market. It has a low conversion to testosterone, around 5%, which is damn too low. Worse yet is the fact that, before converting to testosterone, androstenedione directly interacts with aromatase and 5AR, thus converting to estrogen and DHT prior to conversion to target hormone.. You will be far better of using testosterone than this scum.

    1-testosterone - A legal steroid, at least for the time being. It's very androgenic and very anabolic. Although it's a 5-alpha-reduced steroid it converts to DHT through an unknown pathway, so using Proscar along with it won't avoid DHT conversion. Its anabolic/androgenic ratio (~(1.5-2):1) is slightly higher than that of test (1:1). Be wary while using this product if you value your hair.

    As time goes on, certainly cleaner, anabolic agents will be developed. The vast majority of users I talked to, have been on Prpecia/Proscar and Nizoral, myself included (amongst many other things).

    Finally, take into account that you should also use topical spironolactone (2-5%) while juicing. This product directly antagonizes scalp ARs when used topically, hence it will be useful with any sort of steroid, even those that do not undergo 5-alpha-reduction.

    Conclusion: The safety stack as far as hairloss is concerned would be a cycle consisting of Primobolan, Oxandrolone and Deca. Take into account that Deca, although being very mild for your hair, is not nearly as safe as oxandrolone and primobolan as far as HPTA supression and gynecomastia is concerned. If you want to play it completely safe when using steroid and avoid jeopardizing your health (and not only your hair) use cycles consisting of Oxandrolone and Primobolan.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    R.I.P T-MOS ENGLAND
    Posts
    820
    thanks, good read and helps, my hair is growing back but still breaking off as alopecia does, would you let it grow back before commencing a cycle with the appropriate hair loss products, its been 2 months, the patch is 2/3 of the back of my head and th last 2 weeks has stopped getting bigger.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    New England
    Posts
    74
    My sister in law has her PhD in Pharmacy from University of RI and is now the managing director of an international pharmaceutical firm that specializes in consulting on drug interactions.

    I asked about the long term effects of Avodart and the hormonal effect on testosterone, etc. Here is her response:

    Since Avodart is also used to treat enlarged prostate, it does have similar side effects as Propecia. Detailed below:


    * Since it is used to treat enlarged prostate it would most likely alter your PSA levels, which is a measurement specific to your prostate. (when your prostate is enlarged, the PSA is higher and results in urinary retention and other symptoms. Also, elevated PSA is often a marker for prostate cancer, so when you use Avodart for enlarged prostate it helps relieve the urinary retention and decreases the PSA).
    * Guidelines recommend that you DO NOT donate blood while taking Avodart or for at least 6 months after discontinuation due to risk of fetal harm (birth defects) for pregnant women who receive transfusions with the blood. Also, I don't think that you're planning on having any more babies () but just in case Avodart is contraindicated due to the risk of fetal harm
    * Possible sexual dysfunction problems and breast enlargement (based on effects on testosterone). (The drug works by inhibiting the enzyme that converts testosterone to DHT). In clinical trials, it did not have a statistically significant effect on estrogen levels, cholesterol levels or bone mineral density (ie. Test for osteoporosis); however, it did have significant effects on testosterone and TSH (a thyroid hormone)- Your doctor could test this with a simple blood test to ensure it is not altered. After discontinuation of Avodart, these blood levels returned to normal.
    * It is heavily metabolized through the liver so could be concerns with long-term use (no data seems alarming and they don't recommend any blood test for monitoring, but it could be of concern- since you were asking for long-term risks). (Also, lots of drug interactions so if you ever take any other medications ask the pharmacist/doctor about possible interactions)

    I couldn't find anything on fluid retention and based on the drug's mechanism of action it shouldn't cause a problem. There are rare reactions that can cause localized edema (swelling) but you would have already experienced that if it were going to happen.

    So far, it seems like you are not experiencing the side effects experienced with Propecia and usually if these side effects are going to happen it occurs in the beginning and resolves by 3-6 months. If you are concerned about your general practitioner monitoring any blood levels, they could test your PSA, TSH, testosterone and liver enzymes to make you feel better about any risks it may potentially have on blood levels.

    ****************

    So I followed up with this question to which you will see her response:


    "however, it did have significant effects on testosterone and TSH (a thyroid hormone)"

    The effects on testosterone: did it lower the testosterone level ? and what did it do to the TSH ? How will this impact me ? If my testosterone level is lower I think my sense of overall well being is altered and my workouts will be impacted as well ?

    Response:

    Decreases testosterone thus effects on libido and sexual dysfunction. I would think could effect your stamina/energy for workouts. If you experience a decreases in TSH could make you feel tired and could also make you end up gaining weight but TSH changes are less common.

    *****************************

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    662
    Quote Originally Posted by nicnitro View Post
    My sister in law has her PhD in Pharmacy from University of RI and is now the managing director of an international pharmaceutical firm that specializes in consulting on drug interactions.

    I asked about the long term effects of Avodart and the hormonal effect on testosterone, etc. Here is her response:

    Since Avodart is also used to treat enlarged prostate, it does have similar side effects as Propecia. Detailed below:


    * Since it is used to treat enlarged prostate it would most likely alter your PSA levels, which is a measurement specific to your prostate. (when your prostate is enlarged, the PSA is higher and results in urinary retention and other symptoms. Also, elevated PSA is often a marker for prostate cancer, so when you use Avodart for enlarged prostate it helps relieve the urinary retention and decreases the PSA).
    * Guidelines recommend that you DO NOT donate blood while taking Avodart or for at least 6 months after discontinuation due to risk of fetal harm (birth defects) for pregnant women who receive transfusions with the blood. Also, I don't think that you're planning on having any more babies () but just in case Avodart is contraindicated due to the risk of fetal harm
    * Possible sexual dysfunction problems and breast enlargement (based on effects on testosterone). (The drug works by inhibiting the enzyme that converts testosterone to DHT). In clinical trials, it did not have a statistically significant effect on estrogen levels, cholesterol levels or bone mineral density (ie. Test for osteoporosis); however, it did have significant effects on testosterone and TSH (a thyroid hormone)- Your doctor could test this with a simple blood test to ensure it is not altered. After discontinuation of Avodart, these blood levels returned to normal.
    * It is heavily metabolized through the liver so could be concerns with long-term use (no data seems alarming and they don't recommend any blood test for monitoring, but it could be of concern- since you were asking for long-term risks). (Also, lots of drug interactions so if you ever take any other medications ask the pharmacist/doctor about possible interactions)

    I couldn't find anything on fluid retention and based on the drug's mechanism of action it shouldn't cause a problem. There are rare reactions that can cause localized edema (swelling) but you would have already experienced that if it were going to happen.

    So far, it seems like you are not experiencing the side effects experienced with Propecia and usually if these side effects are going to happen it occurs in the beginning and resolves by 3-6 months. If you are concerned about your general practitioner monitoring any blood levels, they could test your PSA, TSH, testosterone and liver enzymes to make you feel better about any risks it may potentially have on blood levels.

    ****************

    So I followed up with this question to which you will see her response:


    "however, it did have significant effects on testosterone and TSH (a thyroid hormone)"

    The effects on testosterone: did it lower the testosterone level ? and what did it do to the TSH ? How will this impact me ? If my testosterone level is lower I think my sense of overall well being is altered and my workouts will be impacted as well ?

    Response:

    Decreases testosterone thus effects on libido and sexual dysfunction. I would think could effect your stamina/energy for workouts. If you experience a decreases in TSH could make you feel tired and could also make you end up gaining weight but TSH changes are less common.

    *****************************
    wait, what does this mean? does it mean that if i have a kid there's a greater chance for the baby to be handicap??

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    R.I.P T-MOS ENGLAND
    Posts
    820
    lol :S bump

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    R.I.P T-MOS ENGLAND
    Posts
    820
    ive looked for the last couple of months but i thought that i cant be the only one who has suffered hair loss/alopecia from steriods, my first cycle was d-bol orals so i think i know why my hair has fallen out, ill steer clear of the harsh ones and hopefully cycle on without it happening again..

    from reading up ive looked at all products to block dht, would this combination be to much to take to block the DHT? ..
    MINOXIDIL=CREAM
    DUTASTERIDE=TABLETS
    NIZORAL=SHAMPOO
    TACROLIMUS=CAPSULES
    (maybe saw palmetto )
    Im doing everythink possible to stop this from happening again, i also want to carry on using AAS in order to help me achieve my goals.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    yo momas house
    Posts
    503
    bro sorry to break this to you but if your genetically prone to MPB, your hair will fall out eventually all you can do is slow it down. Steroids and working out in general will aggravate your mpb, I dont know what sport you play but if you are at the pro level, you are eventually going to have to make a choice. It will get to a point where you cant have hair AND a sick body.

    nizoral is the shit and you should use it from now on regardless of cycle. I personally haven't tried proscar but have had great luck with dutasteride. Some of the hair I lost before I even tried gear has come back. I take .5mg EOD regularly and plan to increase to ED when on cycle. Another risk of using test is an enlarged prostate, and dutasteride happens to be fda approved to treat it.

    If I were you I would stick to a short quick mild test prop cycle, nizoral, duta and maybe a little var or primo. good luck bro
    Last edited by MR_T; 12-27-2008 at 03:21 AM. Reason: asdas

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    R.I.P T-MOS ENGLAND
    Posts
    820
    cheers, u reckon that primo and test would be a good cycle, i mean ive only done a couple of cycles and was wrongly advised, my hair is crucial for me, and if it starts falling out people ask questions, so even if i took the above as i stated i still have a strong chance of getting alopecia again? and next time could it be permanent?

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    London
    Posts
    605
    Quote Originally Posted by MR_T View Post
    var and test prop with a 5ar blocker are your best bet, dutastride is supposed to be much more effective than proscar but I cant tell you the results from personal experience. good luck bro

    Anavar ............................................3 weeks
    Anadrol........................................... ..2 months
    Andriol........................................... ...1 week
    Boldenone Undecyclenate...................4-5 months
    Clen.............................................. ...4-5 Days
    DBol ................................................5 weeks
    Deca ................................................18 months
    Ephedrin ...........................................4-5 Days
    Halo.............................................. ....2 months
    Methamphetamin ...............................6-10 Days
    Nandrolon Phenylprop ........................12 months
    Nilevar........................................... ....5-6 weeks
    Parabolan......................................... ..4-5 weeks
    Proviron.......................................... ...5 weeks
    Primo Depot.......................................4-5 weeks
    Sustanon ...........................................3 months
    Spiropent......................................... ...4-5 days
    Test cyp .............................................3 months
    Test enat ............................................3 months
    Test Prop.............................................2-3 weeks
    Trenbolon Acet ....................................4-5 weeks
    *Test supspenison No metabolites. t/e should be back to normal in days
    Equipoise......................................... ....4-5months
    Winny oral...........................................3 weeks .
    Winny inj.............................................2 months

    What is this bud? Cycles you have run with duration without any hairloss problems?

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Posts
    102
    i thought it was detection times because hes a drug tested athlete i think

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    London
    Posts
    605
    Quote Originally Posted by lozza89 View Post
    i thought it was detection times because hes a drug tested athlete i think
    Yes, it is. I missed the post stating the relevant info.

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Download FREE 396 Page Steroid Book/Guide!!

396 Pages of Anabolic Steroid resources, techniques and facts. Discover the best types of Steroids to use to reach specific goals and outcomes.