Results 1 to 34 of 34
  1. #1
    LizzardSecond's Avatar
    LizzardSecond is offline Associate Member
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    335

    Not Gaining on Second Cycle and Planning Third

    I am 31, 6' 208lb 11% body fat

    My first cycle was 625mg of Sustanon per week for 12 weeks. I started at around 173lb and 14% body fat and finished at 205lb and 11% body fat. I ate the way I am eating now and gained a ton in 12 weeks. Total weight gain 32lb

    My PCT was
    HCG 500iu EOD for 14 days
    20mg of Novaldex 42 days
    12.5mg of Aromasin for 30 days

    Off for 18 weeks

    2nd Cycle
    10 weeks of Test E 500mg/week
    10 weeks HCG 200iu EOD
    PCT
    100mg ED Clomid
    20mg ED Novaldex
    25mg ED Aromasin. (all 30 days)

    Starting weight 200lb bf 12-13%
    current weight (10 days in) 207lb

    I am now almost 5 weeks in and my weight is fluctuating around 208lb. Up to 210 and then back down. I was hoping to finish around 215lb to 220lb.

    My third cycle i am also planning and have been going back and forth with it. This one I am planning to start the day after my current cycle ends and my PCT begins.

    3 months of HGH (5iu/day) solo
    12 weeks of Test at 585mg/week (injecting Every 3 days 250mg)
    200iu of HCG
    3 months of HGH (5iu/day) continued
    then
    42 days of PCT
    20mg of Novaldex
    25mg of Aromasin
    100mg of Clomid



    My Diet: (2 sample days) I write it all down
    Breakfast:
    1/2 Tub of 0% FAGE yougart
    3/4 cup of Oatmeal with Milk

    Meal 2:
    12oz of Chillian Sea Bass and 1/2 pint Brown Rice

    Meal 3:
    2 slices of double protein bread with Hummess
    2 cans of tuna

    Meal 4:
    1/2 package of smoked salmon
    dry tst pita
    3 slices of tomato

    Meal 5:
    Steam chicken and vegetables
    4 vegetable dumplings (no sauce)
    1/2 pint brown rice

    Meal 6
    8oz of steak
    2 stalks of broccoli
    3 meatballs 8oz
    1 sweet potato

    Breakfast:
    1/2 cup oatmeal
    3/4 tub of 0% FAGE yougart

    Meal 2
    10oz of Grilled dry chicken
    dry toasted pita with roasted peppers

    Meal 3
    10oz of broiled dry swordfish
    1/2 pint of brown rice

    Meal 4
    12oz broiled dry salmon
    1/2 pint of brown rice

    Meal 5
    6oz of multigrain pasta
    7.5 oz of grilled chicken with broccoli

  2. #2
    Big's Avatar
    Big
    Big is offline Retired~ AR-Hall of Famer ~ "Enforcer"
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Posts
    28,651
    why 10 weeks of hcg at 200iu eod?
    why a higher test dose for longer time on cycle 1, then drop it and run it for less time on cycle 2?

  3. #3
    LizzardSecond's Avatar
    LizzardSecond is offline Associate Member
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    335
    I got acne from first. I started this cycle at 650 too and started getting acne again. Iblowrred the dose and the acne Dissapeared.

  4. #4
    PT's Avatar
    PT
    PT is offline DUNAMIS ~ AR-Elite Hall of Famer~
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    United States
    Posts
    12,158
    i was going to ask the same thing as big. i would never use hcg that long, there is no need and it unsafe
    source checks- 200 posts and 6 month membership min. entirely within my discretion
    PT is a fictional character and all posts are for entertainment purposes only.




  5. #5
    LizzardSecond's Avatar
    LizzardSecond is offline Associate Member
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    335
    I have read on this board that keeping your testicles awake during your cycle is more effective for rebounding.

  6. #6
    PT's Avatar
    PT
    PT is offline DUNAMIS ~ AR-Elite Hall of Famer~
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    United States
    Posts
    12,158
    yea shoot it the last 2 weeks of your cycle and 1st week of pct but not eod for 10 weeks. hcg can cause gyno which is why an ancillary is usually used with it
    source checks- 200 posts and 6 month membership min. entirely within my discretion
    PT is a fictional character and all posts are for entertainment purposes only.




  7. #7
    LizzardSecond's Avatar
    LizzardSecond is offline Associate Member
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    335

  8. #8
    adimenia is offline New Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Posts
    48
    yeah i agree and thats maybe the reason your not gaining not to mention that test e only starts to kick in in about 4-5 weeks your PCT in an overkill for the type of cycle your running aromasin nolva HCG and clomid geez man those things are not candy you know

  9. #9
    Big's Avatar
    Big
    Big is offline Retired~ AR-Hall of Famer ~ "Enforcer"
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Posts
    28,651
    Yeah I wonder how many cycles the guy who wrote that article has run? I wonder if he's tried using the hcg at the end of the cycle the way PT, myself, and many, many others have done? I wonder if he realizes when applied to bodybuilding, the desired results can be achieved much sooner than with his method? Come to think of it I don't really wonder, I know what works because I've done it many times.

  10. #10
    LizzardSecond's Avatar
    LizzardSecond is offline Associate Member
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    335
    So your saying to run the HCG only at the end. So many conflicting articles about this stuff. I tried it at the end of my last cycle. My test production was a bit low during my bloodwork that was done 18 weeks after cycle. I read alot about this method and was curious to see if there was a benefit to running this way. How many IU's do you run in the last two weeks of cycle and first week of pct.

    My pct is overkill? Everyone says that its a good PCT.

    The diet? Plus I have the same or similar workout routine.

  11. #11
    rich1234's Avatar
    rich1234 is offline Associate Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Posts
    294
    Listen to the big guys...

  12. #12
    PT's Avatar
    PT
    PT is offline DUNAMIS ~ AR-Elite Hall of Famer~
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    United States
    Posts
    12,158
    if your doing a long cycle with 19nors then yes you may use it every 3rd, 4th week or whatever but for a cycle like yours the end is the only place hcg is needed
    source checks- 200 posts and 6 month membership min. entirely within my discretion
    PT is a fictional character and all posts are for entertainment purposes only.




  13. #13
    LizzardSecond's Avatar
    LizzardSecond is offline Associate Member
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    335
    OK. How much at the end? More than 200, no? I have read 500 2x per week.

    So why am I not gaining?

  14. #14
    fitguy is offline Anabolic Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Posts
    2,355
    your gear didnt kick in yet i believe and i dont see the problem of using 200iu each week during the cycle i know that guys use it 250iu twice per week from the start to the end and some just use it in the end..

  15. #15
    redz's Avatar
    redz is offline Knowledgeable Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    GTA
    Posts
    14,260
    Not trying to change the subject but I have some doubts about this claim.

    started at around 173lb and 14% body fat and finished at 205lb and 11% body fat.
    That would be about 40lbs of lean muscle gained in 12 weeks.

  16. #16
    Kratos's Avatar
    Kratos is offline I feel accomplished
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    CT
    Posts
    34,255
    Quote Originally Posted by redz View Post
    Not trying to change the subject but I have some doubts about this claim.



    That would be about 40lbs of lean muscle gained in 12 weeks.
    haha, yeah, that didn't happen

    205x.11=22.55pounds of fat
    173 x .14 = 24.22 pounds of fat
    gain 32 pounds while losing 2 pounds of fat
    damn newbies always streatching the truth
    "son, you don't lie to me, you lie to girls." --rodney dangerfield
    Last edited by Kratos; 01-15-2009 at 10:18 AM.

  17. #17
    LizzardSecond's Avatar
    LizzardSecond is offline Associate Member
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    335
    I am not lying. No reason to do that. My body fat % is an estimation based on measuring my fat at the gym before the second cycle started.

    I gained Alot because I was not eating right before my cycle started. I also had been lifting again for only six months.

    Anyhow, even if it is not lean muscle mass it is weight gained. I am not seeing these gains so far this cycle. I do think it may be the compound being used. The sustanon did have a faster and sooner pump feeling.

    Is it safe to begin the third cycle this way?

  18. #18
    sitries is offline Associate Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Posts
    484
    add an oral into the last 6weeks of your cycle and maximise the cycle your on! no need to jump straight into another 1. tbh, if you do i doubt you will gain well on it at all eather.

  19. #19
    redz's Avatar
    redz is offline Knowledgeable Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    GTA
    Posts
    14,260
    if you do i doubt you will gain well on it at all eather.
    x2 something is wrong with your diet or taining if you arent gaining at all. Test is Test.

  20. #20
    sitries is offline Associate Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Posts
    484
    yeah, plus his body wont be ready or primed for another cycle and the gains will be minimal!!! throw in an oral to give you a boost and up your calories.

  21. #21
    fitguy is offline Anabolic Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Posts
    2,355
    i wouldnt advise running an oral at this time,test p can be a better option run it till pct then start your pct.

  22. #22
    Phate's Avatar
    Phate is offline Got Diet? ~VET~ AR Hall of Famer~
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    texas
    Posts
    10,940
    Quote Originally Posted by LizzardSecond View Post
    I am 31, 6' 208lb 11% body fat

    My Diet: (2 sample days) I write it all down
    Breakfast:
    1/2 Tub of 0% FAGE yougart
    3/4 cup of Oatmeal with Milk
    what are the stats on the yougart? i would change it to 8-10egg whites
    Meal 2:
    12oz of Chillian Sea Bass and 1/2 pint Brown Rice
    stats on the rice?
    Meal 3:
    2 slices of double protein bread with Hummess
    2 cans of tuna

    Meal 4:
    1/2 package of smoked salmon
    dry tst pita
    3 slices of tomato
    stats on salmon, whole wheat pita? probably gonna double this meal
    Meal 5:
    Steam chicken and vegetables
    4 vegetable dumplings (no sauce)
    1/2 pint brown rice
    stats on dumplings?
    Meal 6
    8oz of steak
    2 stalks of broccoli
    3 meatballs 8oz
    1 sweet potato
    stats on meatballs? how many oz is the potato?


    Breakfast:
    1/2 cup oatmeal
    3/4 tub of 0% FAGE yougart

    Meal 2
    10oz of Grilled dry chicken
    dry toasted pita with roasted peppers

    Meal 3
    10oz of broiled dry swordfish
    1/2 pint of brown rice

    Meal 4
    12oz broiled dry salmon
    1/2 pint of brown rice

    Meal 5
    6oz of multigrain pasta
    7.5 oz of grilled chicken with broccoli
    bold

  23. #23
    LizzardSecond's Avatar
    LizzardSecond is offline Associate Member
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    335
    The FAGE 0% yougart I eat is in 1/2 tub of 0g of fat, 9g of carbs, 20g of protein.

    1/2 bag of multi-grain brown rice is 1g of fat, 33g of carbs, 4g of protein

    I don't know on the salmon. It's from the supermarket, I always get the potatoes that are just smaller than a fist

  24. #24
    Phate's Avatar
    Phate is offline Got Diet? ~VET~ AR Hall of Famer~
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    texas
    Posts
    10,940
    My Diet: (2 sample days) I write it all down
    Breakfast:
    1/2 Tub of 0% FAGE yougart
    3/4 cup of Oatmeal with Milk
    add 6egg whites to this meal
    Meal 2:
    12oz of Chillian Sea Bass and 1/2 pint Brown Rice
    double the brown rice and drop the sea bass to 10oz(or around 50-60g of protein worth)
    Meal 3:
    2 slices of double protein bread with Hummess
    2 cans of tuna

    Meal 4:
    1/2 package of smoked salmon
    dry tst pita
    3 slices of tomato
    double the salmon
    Meal 5:
    Steam chicken and vegetables
    4 vegetable dumplings (no sauce)
    1/2 pint brown rice

    Meal 6
    8oz of steak
    2 stalks of broccoli
    3 meatballs 8oz
    1 sweet potato
    i would do this meal earlier and have a pro/fat meal here

  25. #25
    LizzardSecond's Avatar
    LizzardSecond is offline Associate Member
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    335
    What is a pro/fat meal? Why should I double the carbs. Some people believe carbs are bad. Than others I know say 100g carbs 50g of protein.

    Thanks for the help.

  26. #26
    Phate's Avatar
    Phate is offline Got Diet? ~VET~ AR Hall of Famer~
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    texas
    Posts
    10,940
    Quote Originally Posted by LizzardSecond View Post
    What is a pro/fat meal? Why should I double the carbs. Some people believe carbs are bad. Than others I know say 100g carbs 50g of protein.

    Thanks for the help.
    and those people are morons, carbs are essential to weightlifting and growth

    a pro/fat meal is a meal that has protein and fats

  27. #27
    LizzardSecond's Avatar
    LizzardSecond is offline Associate Member
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    335
    Example? Steak? Fish?

  28. #28
    LizzardSecond's Avatar
    LizzardSecond is offline Associate Member
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    335
    Can I eat pasta, bread. I eat Italian bread and 6 eggwhites many times as a snack.

  29. #29
    Phate's Avatar
    Phate is offline Got Diet? ~VET~ AR Hall of Famer~
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    texas
    Posts
    10,940
    Quote Originally Posted by LizzardSecond View Post
    Example? Steak? Fish?
    steak and 1/4cup of nuts

    full fat cottage cheese

    lean meat with fish oil caps

  30. #30
    Phate's Avatar
    Phate is offline Got Diet? ~VET~ AR Hall of Famer~
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    texas
    Posts
    10,940
    Quote Originally Posted by LizzardSecond View Post
    Can I eat pasta, bread. I eat Italian bread and 6 eggwhites many times as a snack.
    italian bread is not all that good as it's white bread, whole wheat or ezekiel bread is okay

    whole wheat pasta is okay

  31. #31
    LizzardSecond's Avatar
    LizzardSecond is offline Associate Member
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    335
    Why full fat?

  32. #32
    Phate's Avatar
    Phate is offline Got Diet? ~VET~ AR Hall of Famer~
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    texas
    Posts
    10,940
    Quote Originally Posted by LizzardSecond View Post
    Why full fat?
    because if you eat non-fat cottage cheese then it's not a pro/fat meal, it's a protein meal

  33. #33
    lovex is offline Associate Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Posts
    213
    Quote Originally Posted by LizzardSecond View Post
    I have read on this board that keeping your testicles awake during your cycle is more effective for rebounding.
    as u r using HcG during the cycle ..do it really helping you from avoiding testicular degeneration....
    can u pls say your experience

  34. #34
    LizzardSecond's Avatar
    LizzardSecond is offline Associate Member
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    335
    My testicles feel and look full. I also had a problem reaching ejaculation with the first cycle. Not orgasm but ejaculation. This cycle I have experienced less. Although it is not advised I will be continuing the 200iu EOD.

    After my cycle I am going to do a comparison on my natural test production.

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •