test and winny first cycle

**{{HEAVYDUTY}}** · 02-20-2009, 02:56 PM

Frontload 750mg test c. 1st shot - 250mg 2nd
2-10 wks 500mg test (250 x 3.5 days) and 50mg oral of winny EOD for 8 weeks (really wanna throw this in there cuz i have 50 of them for free)i know i need to run some milk thistle,nolva and clomid but im not sure how much or how long and should i run some letro as well or just keep it on hand? and just to let you know i have been reading up on this for months and getting good ideas so im not just jumping into this but i kinda want to know if this sounds good or should i not use the winny at all and just use test? Thanks for all your help!!

***T-MOS*** · 02-20-2009, 02:58 PM

What are your stats?

Not sure I understand how you are frontloading? You are doing one shot of 750, then the rest 250?
oral winny for 8 weeks is kind of harsh. I would go 6 weeks especially since its your first cycle, also, winny is an ED not an EOD dose, and if oral you should break up the dose at least twice a day

How long do you plan to run the cycle?

What do you have on hand for PCT?

**johnnybigguns** · 02-20-2009, 03:12 PM

Too frontload you double your dose until the first half life

**redz** · 02-20-2009, 03:15 PM

Winny needs to be ran ed not eod.

**{{HEAVYDUTY}}** · 02-20-2009, 03:27 PM

[QUOTE=T-MOS;4448257]What are your stats?

Not sure I understand how you are frontloading? You are doing one shot of 750, then the rest 250?
oral winny for 8 weeks is kind of harsh. I would go 6 weeks especially since its your first cycle, also, winny is an ED not an EOD dose, and if oral you should break up the dose at least twice a day

How long do you plan to run the cycle? 12 weeks

What do you have on hand for PCT nothing yet that y i was asking about?

well after reading alot i have seen this front loading done quit a bit with good results but this is deff not set in stone just an idea i had so do u thing i should just start with the 250 test twice a week and the winny for the first 6 weeks or the last 6 weeks?
and what about the the other meds. so the winny i should split 25mg twice a day 4 6 weeks at the end or beginning?

**Mammon** · 02-20-2009, 03:36 PM

not sure your ready yet but id run the winny at the end.. id run it 18 days past the cyp and jump right on pct.

**CHUCKYthentic** · 02-20-2009, 03:36 PM

id throw the winny at the end of your cycle. if you do it in the beginning then ur guna basically be running a winny only cycle with no test until your test c kicks in around week 4 or 5

**{{HEAVYDUTY}}** · 02-20-2009, 03:37 PM

also do u know if the test combined with the winny would be good for losing fat% as well as strength gains?

**{{HEAVYDUTY}}** · 02-20-2009, 03:43 PM

Originally Posted by Mammon

not sure your ready yet but id run the winny at the end.. id run it 18 days past the cyp and jump right on pct.

im not sure what ur meaning 18 days past cyp?

**Mammon** · 02-20-2009, 03:51 PM

you start pct 18 days after your last cyp injection.. the next day after winny tabs.. so you can run the winny say the last 4 weeks while still on the test continuing it for another 18 days after you stop the test .. jump right on pct day after winny.

***T-MOS*** · 02-20-2009, 03:53 PM

Originally Posted by {{HEAVYDUTY}}

im not sure what ur meaning 18 days past cyp?

I think we would like your stats before we go much further here please.

age
height
weight
bodyfat %
diet
training
GOALS
PCT

What he was saying is that PCT starts 18 days after last CYP shot, and next day after last winny dose, so you run the winny 18 days after your last winny shot and start PCT the next day

You do have PCT don't you??

Losing fat is 89% DIET and about 5% steroids
Winny will dry you out, including your joints, and harden you up, but if your bodyfat is above 10% then you will not see much from it

**{{HEAVYDUTY}}** · 02-20-2009, 04:07 PM

29 yrs old
6'2
265lbs
body fat not sure when i did it at the gym about 2 mnths ago it was 24%
all r estimates for diet
cals 1200 ed
fat 30-40 grms
pro 100-150grm
carbs 80-100

This has been my diet for over 2 months and i have lost about 25lbs so far

goals lose fat% gain mass then after cycle cut with clen

Pct nothing on hand still asking around for best soulition any help is great

**redz** · 02-20-2009, 04:13 PM

You should not be cycling at 24% bf also fat should be melting off your body at 1200 cals per day.

**{{HEAVYDUTY}}** · 02-20-2009, 04:14 PM

here is a pic from about a month ago

**{{HEAVYDUTY}}** · 02-20-2009, 04:15 PM

so what is a good bf% to start a cycle and do u think some clen would help the fat % now

***T-MOS*** · 02-20-2009, 04:17 PM

you risk many health issues if you use steroids with high bodyfat

high blood pressure
man boobies

just to name two.

it would be better if you could diet down to under 15%

**redz** · 02-20-2009, 04:17 PM

15% or less is a good point. You have a much higher chance of gyno and estrogen sides cycling with that high a bf%

***T-MOS*** · 02-20-2009, 04:18 PM

Winny will be a waste at your % you won't notice a thing from it.

you can use clen on a cutting diet

I suggest you check out the diet section under "how to diet" and "Cutting diet"

only if you want to be safe while doing this

**{{HEAVYDUTY}}** · 02-20-2009, 04:21 PM

Ok thats not really what i wanted to hear(LOL) but thts ok cuz then thats what i will do is work harder like i said i have lost 25lbs already so a little more just means more work which is ok with me and get my body fat% down then go from there ,do u guys think clen would be great to add into my routine?? i work out 5 days a week with atleast 45 min of cardio a day and a hour of racquet ball twice a week.

**Mammon** · 02-20-2009, 04:23 PM

clen is an aid and can help.. as long as the diet and training/cardio are in check.
but its not a wonder drug

**{{HEAVYDUTY}}** · 02-20-2009, 04:23 PM

Thanks alot for your help guys i deff want to do this the right way and not fuk it up and regret it later but i will deff keep my progress updated and then when i reach that point i can go from there. Thanks again

**{{HEAVYDUTY}}** · 02-20-2009, 04:26 PM

Originally Posted by Mammon

clen is an aid and can help.. as long as the diet and training/cardio are in check.
but its not a wonder drug

LOL im not like some people who think that there is a wonder drug but i have heard that its better than otc like hydroxycut hardcore so i figured i would go with the clen itstead of wth the otc. I work hard so i know it will pay off!!! thanks

**{{HEAVYDUTY}}** · 02-20-2009, 10:24 PM

how much clen should i use as far as dosage and lenght of time any help is great thanks

***T-MOS*** · 02-20-2009, 10:27 PM

Originally Posted by {{HEAVYDUTY}}

how much clen should i use as far as dosage and lenght of time any help is great thanks

do some research...its all here

most do two weeks on two weeks off

you need to gradually build up to the dose that works for you

start with about 20 mcg first day and see how you are with the sides

then work your way up to about 120 max

research it, sides can be harsh !!!

**{{HEAVYDUTY}}** · 02-21-2009, 10:41 AM

Originally Posted by T-MOS

do some research...its all here

most do two weeks on two weeks off

you need to gradually build up to the dose that works for you

start with about 20 mcg first day and see how you are with the sides

then work your way up to about 120 max

research it, sides can be harsh !!!

Thanks alot for your input T-MOS and everybody else u have been great help!!

**redz** · 02-21-2009, 10:48 AM

Yeah definitely be careful with the clen , I thought I wouldnt be affected and I stupidly tried 80mcg right away wow it kicked my ass with cramps and over just feeling crappy, start low and gradualyl up the dose, 120mcg was as high as I went.