Proviron

**Muselz** · 02-28-2009, 07:29 AM

When is the best time to use proviron ? On cycle, off cycle or as a bridge between cycles?

**The Deuce** · 02-28-2009, 08:37 AM

I use it while I am ON only... at 50 mgs ED with TEST and something else NPP/TREN /MAST/EQ/ ETC.... Ya know?? Never alone... with a blend of other ingredients...

***T-MOS*** · 02-28-2009, 08:48 AM

depends on your goals, as it can be used at any of the times you mentioned

**Ashop** · 02-28-2009, 08:11 PM

Originally Posted by Muselz

When is the best time to use proviron? On cycle, off cycle or as a bridge between cycles?

Only while ON your cycle. Bad idea during PCT because of effect on HPTA.

**jimmyinkedup** · 02-28-2009, 09:02 PM

^^^^Nonsense at doses of 100mgs or less per day it doesnt effect hpta...
Proviron is useful on cycle at times and IMO in pct as well if not using aromasin as part of your pct...
BTW - some studies of provirons "effects" on hpta.....

Varma TR, Patel RH.

Department of Obstetrics & Gynaecology, St. George's Hospital Medical School London, U.K.

Two hundred fifty subfertile men with idiopathic oligospermia (count less than 20 million/ml) were treated with mesterolone (100-150 mg/day) for 12 months. Seminal analysis were assayed 3 times and serum follicle stimulating hormone (FSH) luteinizing hormone (LH) and plasma testosterone were assayed once before treatment and repeated at 3, 6, 9 and 12 months after the initiation of treatment. One hundred ten patients (44%) had normal serum FSH, LH and plasma testosterone, 85 patients (34%) had low serum FSH, LH and low plasma testosterone. One hundred seventy-five patients (70%) had moderate oligospermia (count 5 to less than 20 million/ml) and 75 patients (30%) had severe oligospermia (count less than 5 million/ml). Seventy-five moderately oligospermic patients showed significant improvement in the sperm density, total sperm count and motility following mesterolone therapy whereas only 12% showed improvement in the severe oligospermic group. Mesterolone had no depressing effect on low or normal serum FSH and LH levels but had depressing effect on 25% if the levels were elevated. There was no significant adverse effect on testosterone levels or on liver function. One hundred fifteen (46%) pregnancies resulted following the treatment, 9 of 115 (7.8%) aborted and 2 (1.7%) had ectopic pregnancy. Mesterolone was found to be more useful in patients with a sperm count ranging between 5 and 20 million/ml. Those with severe oligospermia (count less than 5 million) do not seem to benefit from this therapy.

PMID: 2892728 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

***********************

Effect of non aromatizable androgens on LHRH and TRH responses in primary testicular failure.

Spitz IM, Margalioth EJ, Yeger Y, Livshin Y, Zylber-Haran E, Shilo S.

We have assessed the gonadotropin, TSH and PRL responses to the non aromatizable androgens, mesterolone and fluoxymestrone, in 27 patients with primary testicular failure. All patients were given a bolus of LHRH (100 micrograms) and TRH (200 micrograms) at zero time. Nine subjects received a further bolus of TRH at 30 mins. The latter were then given mesterolone 150 mg daily for 6 weeks. The remaining subjects received fluoxymesterone 5 mg daily for 4 weeks and 10 mg daily for 2 weeks. On the last day of the androgen administration, the subjects were re-challenged with LHRH and TRH according to the identical protocol. When compared to controls, the patients had normal circulating levels of testosterone , estradiol, PRL and thyroid hormones. However, basal LH, FSH and TSH levels, as well as gonadotropin responses to LHRH and TSH and PRL responses to TRH, were increased.

**Muselz** · 03-01-2009, 07:37 AM

I plan to do a bulker;

Dianabol 50mg ed 1-4
Test E 500mg ew 1-12
Deca 400mg ew 1-11

What are the advantages of running proviron throughout this cycle? Will i still be able to bulk if i added the proviron?

**BIG_TRUCK** · 03-01-2009, 07:42 AM

Proviron really didn't do much for me.

Save your money and buy more test or a real anti-estrogen.

**LATS60** · 03-01-2009, 07:45 AM

Originally Posted by Muselz

I plan to do a bulker;

Dianabol 50mg ed 1-4
Test E 500mg ew 1-12
Deca 400mg ew 1-11

What are the advantages of running proviron throughout this cycle? Will i still be able to bulk if i added the proviron?

Of course you can still bulk. Just what are you wanting to add prov for?

**Muselz** · 03-01-2009, 07:47 AM

Originally Posted by LATS60

Of course you can still bulk. Just what are you wanting to add prov for?

I hear it makes the test work better and keeps the water weight down.

**LATS60** · 03-01-2009, 08:24 AM

Originally Posted by Muselz

I hear it makes the test work better and keeps the water weight down.

Prov alledgedly free's up test thats bound to shbg, it has mild anti aromatase properties, ive used it on cycle at doses between 50-150mg daily and personally found it a waste of money.

**tinytom777** · 03-01-2009, 08:30 AM

hey musclez just started the exact same cycle this week! but as has been said go with an ai like arimadex proviron bit of a waste imo

**Immortal Soldier** · 03-01-2009, 03:22 PM

Originally Posted by jimmyinkedup

^^^^Nonsense at doses of 100mgs or less per day it doesnt effect hpta...
Proviron is useful on cycle at times and IMO in pct as well if not using aromasin as part of your pct...
BTW - some studies of provirons "effects" on hpta.....

Varma TR, Patel RH.

Department of Obstetrics & Gynaecology, St. George's Hospital Medical School London, U.K.

Two hundred fifty subfertile men with idiopathic oligospermia (count less than 20 million/ml) were treated with mesterolone (100-150 mg/day) for 12 months. Seminal analysis were assayed 3 times and serum follicle stimulating hormone (FSH) luteinizing hormone (LH) and plasma testosterone were assayed once before treatment and repeated at 3, 6, 9 and 12 months after the initiation of treatment. One hundred ten patients (44%) had normal serum FSH, LH and plasma testosterone, 85 patients (34%) had low serum FSH, LH and low plasma testosterone. One hundred seventy-five patients (70%) had moderate oligospermia (count 5 to less than 20 million/ml) and 75 patients (30%) had severe oligospermia (count less than 5 million/ml). Seventy-five moderately oligospermic patients showed significant improvement in the sperm density, total sperm count and motility following mesterolone therapy whereas only 12% showed improvement in the severe oligospermic group. Mesterolone had no depressing effect on low or normal serum FSH and LH levels but had depressing effect on 25% if the levels were elevated. There was no significant adverse effect on testosterone levels or on liver function. One hundred fifteen (46%) pregnancies resulted following the treatment, 9 of 115 (7.8%) aborted and 2 (1.7%) had ectopic pregnancy. Mesterolone was found to be more useful in patients with a sperm count ranging between 5 and 20 million/ml. Those with severe oligospermia (count less than 5 million) do not seem to benefit from this therapy.

PMID: 2892728 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

***********************

Effect of non aromatizable androgens on LHRH and TRH responses in primary testicular failure.

Spitz IM, Margalioth EJ, Yeger Y, Livshin Y, Zylber-Haran E, Shilo S.

We have assessed the gonadotropin, TSH and PRL responses to the non aromatizable androgens, mesterolone and fluoxymestrone, in 27 patients with primary testicular failure. All patients were given a bolus of LHRH (100 micrograms) and TRH (200 micrograms) at zero time. Nine subjects received a further bolus of TRH at 30 mins. The latter were then given mesterolone 150 mg daily for 6 weeks. The remaining subjects received fluoxymesterone 5 mg daily for 4 weeks and 10 mg daily for 2 weeks. On the last day of the androgen administration, the subjects were re-challenged with LHRH and TRH according to the identical protocol. When compared to controls, the patients had normal circulating levels of testosterone, estradiol, PRL and thyroid hormones. However, basal LH, FSH and TSH levels, as well as gonadotropin responses to LHRH and TSH and PRL responses to TRH, were increased.

Intresting, I agree.

I want to take proviron in my PCT because I heard it helps "muscle hardness" and doesn't effect the HPTA (at low doses) and I won't be running an AI so this could also help in that area.

Also I can get proviron for cheap.

**Muselz** · 03-02-2009, 03:34 PM

What is the optimal dosage for proviron whilst on PCT?...and what is a good dose when cycling?

**ralph4u2c** · 03-02-2009, 03:49 PM

50mg ED works great for me and i do notice better muscle hardness and much greater libido. it has quickly become a staple in my cycles

**Muselz** · 03-02-2009, 03:58 PM

Originally Posted by ralph4u2c

50mg ED works great for me and i do notice better muscle hardness and much greater libido. it has quickly become a staple in my cycles

Do you run it in your PCT too? What is a good dose?

**ralph4u2c** · 03-02-2009, 06:25 PM

50mg works fine and is the most common dose, smaller (25mg) doses have been used commonly for libido problems during a cycle and 100mg+ doses have been used in hopes to get better gains/hardness. i have found 50mg to be perfectly fine for both, as do many other people.

i commonly use hCG then a proper PCT following all cycles. That typically includes torem. or nolva along w/ a mild AI and a natural test booster (Thermolife T-bol to be exact) but this may be tweaked depending on the type of cycle. I would not suggest using proviron during your PCT, there are better options for recovery IMO.

**Indymuscleguy** · 03-02-2009, 06:28 PM

Originally Posted by Muselz

Do you run it in your PCT too? What is a good dose?

Agreed! Man all I have to do is think about se...damn there goes another boner! Didn't even have time to finish the word!

From what I have learned, Proviron is a weak steroid and has very little anabolic properties when used alone. I have heard of a lot of guys using it during pct to help with libido. JMO