what dose of clen is anabolic?

[gettingjackedandtan]

i will be done with pct in 2 days and ordered some clen to

a get super cut up like 3% bf
b its rumored to have some anabolic help

the pills are 40mcg , should i start at 20mcg a day see how it goes? is there an ideal anabolic dose of clen?

already got taurine ordered.
166 , 22 8% bf

[MASTER]

I forsee a debate arising

[Immortal Soldier]

i will be done with pct in 2 days and ordered some clen to

a get super cut up like 3% bf
b its rumored to have some anabolic help

the pills are 40mcg , should i start at 20mcg a day see how it goes? is there an ideal anabolic dose of clen?

already got taurine ordered.
166 , 22 8% bf

3% bf? Bro that is extremely diffcult and very unhealthy. Anything below 7% is unhealthy unless you are competing for a show.

Clen is not "anabolic", it is slighty anti-catabolic when on a restricted calorie diet.

If Clen is a true beta 2 receptor agonist, there is no reason for it not to be anabolic. Human muscles are full of beta 2 receptors ready to react under the order of Clenbuterol. Intense exercise can increase the beta 2 receptor density in muscles, creating a potential synergy. This would mean that training should increase the muscle sensitivity to Clen. The problem is, such results have not been observed, even in animals. In fact, animals given Clenbuterol and then intensively trained show very poor results. Later researchers demonstrated that the muscle building properties of Clen were not derived from a specific activation of beta 2 adrenoceptors as previously thought. Rather, Clen acts on a still unidentified atypical beta receptor. Then, it was thought that Clen would act on the newly discovered beta 3 receptors. Next, action on beta 4 was hypothesized. Both proved to be wrong as far as anabolism is concerned. In order to explain the lack of effect of Clen on anabolism in humans I think it is safe to conclude that we do not possess a significant amount of those atypical beta receptors in our muscles.

Of course, animal studies were performed with huge dosages starting with a rough equivalent of 50-60 tablets of 20 mcg a day. But even in increasing the dosages close to unsafe amounts (using a beta 1 receptor antagonist to minimize the side effects of Clen on the heart), no one ever experienced the strong anabolic action of Clen.

[Swifto]

i will be done with pct in 2 days and ordered some clen to

a get super cut up like 3% bf
b its rumored to have some anabolic help

the pills are 40mcg , should i start at 20mcg a day see how it goes? is there an ideal anabolic dose of clen?

already got taurine ordered.
166 , 22 8% bf

I've posted some studies, do a search.

Its in a thread about Clen and PCT.

[RA]

Bingo

3% bf? Bro that is extremely diffcult and very unhealthy. Anything below 7% is unhealthy unless you are competing for a show.

Clen is not "anabolic", it is slighty anti-catabolic not enough to make major changes.

[JiGGaMaN]

its not anabolic, never will be.

[Dobie-BOY]

its not anabolic, never will be.

Yep^

[Swifto]

Yep^

its not anabolic, never will be.

Beta-2 agonists have been shown to have some anabolic effects in humans.(1)

Clen has been shown to have some "therapeutic potential in the treatment of muscle-wasting conditions.(2)"

That would suggest its mildly anabolic of some sort. Therfore, anti-catabolic.



(1): Arch Phys Med Rehabil. 1995 Jan;76(1):55-8.
(2): Clin Sci (Lond). 1993 Jun;84(6):651-4

[Immortal Soldier]

Beta-2 agonists have been shown to have some anabolic effects in humans.(1)

Clen has been shown to have some "therapeutic potential in the treatment of muscle-wasting conditions.(2)"

That would suggest its mildly anabolic of some sort. Therfore, anti-catabolic.



(1): Arch Phys Med Rehabil. 1995 Jan;76(1):55-8.
(2): Clin Sci (Lond). 1993 Jun;84(6):651-4

The potent anabolic effects of the beta 2-adrenoceptor agonist clenbuterol on skeletal muscle have been reported to be independent of actions on beta-adrenoceptors. In the present study clenbuterol, presented to rats in the diet (4 mg/kg), caused significant increases in gastrocnemius muscle mass, protein, and RNA content and a decrease in epididymal fat pad mass. These effects were not mimicked by oral administration of the beta 2-adrenoceptor agonist salbutamol even at high dose (52 mg/kg diet), and the effects of clenbuterol were not inhibited by addition of DL-propranolol (200 mg/kg diet). However, the selective beta 2-antagonist ICI-118,551 (200 mg/kg diet) reversed the anabolic effects of clenbuterol, and a high dose of DL-propranolol (1,000 mg/kg diet) also inhibited these actions of clenbuterol. Furthermore, continuous infusion of salbutamol (1.15 mg.kg body wt-1.day-1) via miniosmotic pumps did cause significant increases in muscle mass, protein, and RNA content. These results indicate that the anabolic effects of clenbuterol are dependent on interaction with the beta 2-adrenoceptor. However, a long duration of action appears to be required to induce the anabolic effects of beta 2-agonists.


http://ajpendo.physiology.org/cgi/co...ract/263/1/E50

[canadian meat]

Great posts Immortal Ive had my share of arguments with people on this site claiming clen is anabolic. Now I acually have a thread to reference next time.

[JiGGaMaN]

The potent anabolic effects of the beta 2-adrenoceptor agonist clenbuterol on skeletal muscle have been reported to be independent of actions on beta-adrenoceptors. In the present study clenbuterol, presented to rats in the diet (4 mg/kg), caused significant increases in gastrocnemius muscle mass, protein, and RNA content and a decrease in epididymal fat pad mass. These effects were not mimicked by oral administration of the beta 2-adrenoceptor agonist salbutamol even at high dose (52 mg/kg diet), and the effects of clenbuterol were not inhibited by addition of DL-propranolol (200 mg/kg diet). However, the selective beta 2-antagonist ICI-118,551 (200 mg/kg diet) reversed the anabolic effects of clenbuterol, and a high dose of DL-propranolol (1,000 mg/kg diet) also inhibited these actions of clenbuterol. Furthermore, continuous infusion of salbutamol (1.15 mg.kg body wt-1.day-1) via miniosmotic pumps did cause significant increases in muscle mass, protein, and RNA content. These results indicate that the anabolic effects of clenbuterol are dependent on interaction with the beta 2-adrenoceptor. However, a long duration of action appears to be required to induce the anabolic effects of beta 2-agonists.


http://ajpendo.physiology.org/cgi/co...ract/263/1/E50

this is a study done on animals, not humans. dosage is insane as well.

[jimmyinkedup]

The potent anabolic effects of the beta 2-adrenoceptor agonist clenbuterol on skeletal muscle have been reported to be independent of actions on beta-adrenoceptors. In the present study clenbuterol, presented to rats in the diet (4 mg/kg), caused significant increases in gastrocnemius muscle mass, protein, and RNA content and a decrease in epididymal fat pad mass. These effects were not mimicked by oral administration of the beta 2-adrenoceptor agonist salbutamol even at high dose (52 mg/kg diet), and the effects of clenbuterol were not inhibited by addition of DL-propranolol (200 mg/kg diet). However, the selective beta 2-antagonist ICI-118,551 (200 mg/kg diet) reversed the anabolic effects of clenbuterol, and a high dose of DL-propranolol (1,000 mg/kg diet) also inhibited these actions of clenbuterol. Furthermore, continuous infusion of salbutamol (1.15 mg.kg body wt-1.day-1) via miniosmotic pumps did cause significant increases in muscle mass, protein, and RNA content. These results indicate that the anabolic effects of clenbuterol are dependent on interaction with the beta 2-adrenoceptor. However, a long duration of action appears to be required to induce the anabolic effects of beta 2-agonists.


http://ajpendo.physiology.org/cgi/co...ract/263/1/E50

good study and these statements are not directed twords you...but it is meaningless IMO. 4mg/kg dosege??? are you kidding me???? Also the study is on Rats. Also not to mention the last statement - long duration of action required to induce anabolic effects. I in not way would consider clen a viable anabolic compound. I think personally ...and this is just my theory ...that clen by its mechanism is muscle sparing and due to its effects on BMR it increases protein synthesis slightly....just as any compound that increases BMR - but most are not muscle sparing by there mechanism of action. I still consider clen anti catabolic and personally believe that is only so when adeqaute protein ingested alongside.... JMO

[M302_Imola]

^^^Good stuff, Jimmy!

[Immortal Soldier]

this is a study done on animals, not humans. dosage is insane as well.

Exactly, that was the whole point, look at the dosages needed in animals to acheive even close to anabolic results. So in humans it will never be anabolic for a variety of reasons.

good study and these statements are not directed twords you...but it is meaningless IMO. 4mg/kg dosege??? are you kidding me???? Also the study is on Rats. Also not to mention the last statement - long duration of action required to induce anabolic effects. I in not way would consider clen a viable anabolic compound. I think personally ...and this is just my theory ...that clen by its mechanism is muscle sparing and due to its effects on BMR it increases protein synthesis slightly....just as any compound that increases BMR - but most are not muscle sparing by there mechanism of action. I still consider clen anti catabolic and personally believe that is only so when adeqaute protein ingested alongside.... JMO

Exactly, this was meant to show that Clen cannot be anabolic in humans both because humans and the beta 2 receptors and the fact dosages are extremely low. Also I don't see the big deal on the study being done on rats, most pharmacuetical drugs are tested on rats before they are put into human trials, obviously they aren't going to take a human and give them 4mg/kg dosage of Clen just to prove it isn't anabolic.

[gettingjackedandtan]

As update, after first 2 weeks, starting at 20 up to 120 mcg. i gained 1.6 lbs. i NEVER gain weight and I didnt intentionally up calories, though i was hungry very often!

didnt see huge change in abs/bodyfat to date but my BF is pretty low to start with.

also got a PR on deadlift 340 for 2 reps last week! , the tiredness went away on 2nd week. altho concentrating on clen (like driving) is hard.

2 weeks off and ill report any new further results

also as bad side effect, clen definitely seems to make me more aggressive which is bad. (already take a med to control anger)

[Phate]

As update, after first 2 weeks, starting at 20 up to 120 mcg. i gained 1.6 lbs. i NEVER gain weight and I didnt intentionally up calories, though i was hungry very often!

didnt see huge change in abs/bodyfat to date but my BF is pretty low to start with.

also got a PR on deadlift 340 for 2 reps last week! , the tiredness went away on 2nd week. altho concentrating on clen (like driving) is hard.

2 weeks off and ill report any new further results

also as bad side effect, clen definitely seems to make me more aggressive which is bad. (already take a med to control anger)

doubtful, placebo effect anyone?

[gettingjackedandtan]

I am bipolar. Tons ofotc meds others take affect me badly.

Or maybe I just needed to dump my slut ex gf

[The Deuce]

I am bipolar. Tons ofotc meds others take affect me badly.

Or maybe I just needed to dump my slut ex gf

dump slut EX !!! GF ???? sounds like u did if shes ur ex....

[Jfew44]

^^ I'd be doing my best to fix/control that problem before taking AAS.

[(1*)]

dump slut EX !!! GF ???? sounds like u did if shes ur ex....

[(1*)]

i'm still having trouble getting past the 3% bf statement.

[gettingjackedandtan]

ya I did!!! She's history. I can do muchbetter.

I dont mind violence. I actually love it.
I thgought about a military career, put my fighting to use
still deciding.
In the meantime ive got boxinglessons once a week. Unfortunately. In the 2 fights ive been in since starting I didn't use a darn thing I learned!

I like to separate everyone at gym into
a I could beat the hell out of
B prob would beat hell out of me

Aas moves more people into a. This makes me happy

[bluesman]

As update, after first 2 weeks, starting at 20 up to 120 mcg. i gained 1.6 lbs. i NEVER gain weight and I didnt intentionally up calories, though i was hungry very often!

didnt see huge change in abs/bodyfat to date but my BF is pretty low to start with.

also got a PR on deadlift 340 for 2 reps last week! , the tiredness went away on 2nd week. altho concentrating on clen (like driving) is hard.

2 weeks off and ill report any new further results

also as bad side effect, clen definitely seems to make me more aggressive which is bad. (already take a med to control anger)

If you are getting distracted, angry and are on psych meds, you ought to stay away from clen, and most other drugs. Not sure what you are taking, antianxiety, SSRIs etc, but a lot of them have a LOT of contraindications. Broncho dialators and CNS stimulants can play all kinds of problems with other compounds.. Please be careful.

The weight gain is kinda weird, too.

[gettingjackedandtan]

i take seroquel (once a day in theory, more like 2x a week in reality)

i admit its weird i gained weight, maybe due to increased appetitte? at any rate, 3-2 week clen cycles @ 1.6 lbs gain would be 4.8, free 5 lbs of weight! ill take it

toward end of week 2 on clen i was flipping out pretty regularly, my best friend/ lifting partner instituted a "call me b4 u do anything crazy' policy which helped

[Kratos]

Beta-2 agonists have been shown to have some anabolic effects in humans.(1)

Clen has been shown to have some "therapeutic potential in the treatment of muscle-wasting conditions.(2)"

That would suggest its mildly anabolic of some sort. Therfore, anti-catabolic.



(1): Arch Phys Med Rehabil. 1995 Jan;76(1):55-8.
(2): Clin Sci (Lond). 1993 Jun;84(6):651-4

Those are pretty poor studies swifto, no offense. But they are very small sample sizes, have other variables and at best the conclusions are overstated.

There is no known dose where clenbuterol becomes anabolic or even anti-catabolic. Not to say it doesn't in humans, just nobody has done a proper study.

[Swifto]

Those are pretty poor studies swifto, no offense. But they are very small sample sizes, have other variables and at best the conclusions are overstated.

There is no known dose where clenbuterol becomes anabolic or even anti-catabolic. Not to say it doesn't in humans, just nobody has done a proper study.

I agree.

There poor studies, but they may show some insight into possible effects.

What do you think Kratos?

[chuckt12345]

ya I did!!! She's history. I can do muchbetter.

I dont mind violence. I actually love it.
I thgought about a military career, put my fighting to use
still deciding.
In the meantime ive got boxinglessons once a week. Unfortunately. In the 2 fights ive been in since starting I didn't use a darn thing I learned!

I like to separate everyone at gym into
a I could beat the hell out of
B prob would beat hell out of me

Aas moves more people into a. This makes me happy

You got penitintary written all over you. Good Luck,,, keep the butthole tight

[DEE151]

i will be done with pct in 2 days and ordered some clen to

a get super cut up like 3% bf
b its rumored to have some anabolic help

the pills are 40mcg , should i start at 20mcg a day see how it goes? is there an ideal anabolic dose of clen?

already got taurine ordered.
166 , 22 8% bf

some were around 18days or 3weeks it becomes a mild anabolic

[aestheticmind]

i take seroquel (once a day in theory, more like 2x a week in reality)

man i was on seroquel for a while... i was a strung out 135lbs (at 6'3") and seroquel launched me up to 250lbs. yea. you read right.

i got off that shit and discovered the best cure for depression was running my ass off and lifting. releases endorphins AND gets the aggression out. i have never been happier or healthier.

[sigman roid]

We have everything that a real man needs.
We will guard your health day and night.
Enhance your life with these products!

fvck off

[Kratos]

I agree.

There poor studies, but they may show some insight into possible effects.

What do you think Kratos?

Based on my understanding of the drug.
Most likely with the right diet it's good for body composition.
I think with a high fat diet no.
Probably muscle sparing during a healthy cutting diet.
Probably helps shift the balance from carbs to ketone bodies and the increased heart rate will up the use of free fatty acids.
So, I would say a good addition to a strict cutting diet or lean bulk. I would think where it really shines is after 3 days of caloric deficency in a cut.
With this drug probably much more diet dependant then anabolics, I'm sure it has some contribution to the balance between fat and muscle on the users body. It would be interesting if a pure study were done, esp if they could take diet out as a var.

I shake like a drug addict on the stuff so can't really experiment with it. My mom thought I needed to go to re-hab when I went over my parent's house for dinner lol.

[Kratos]

i take seroquel (once a day in theory, more like 2x a week in reality)

i admit its weird i gained weight, maybe due to increased appetitte? at any rate, 3-2 week clen cycles @ 1.6 lbs gain would be 4.8, free 5 lbs of weight! ill take it

toward end of week 2 on clen i was flipping out pretty regularly, my best friend/ lifting partner instituted a "call me b4 u do anything crazy' policy which helped

Just a little friendly advise...you really souldn't mix stims like caffine and clen with seroquel and you should take it as your doctor told you (for example everyday). It isn't something to be messing around with...your mental health. It's not worth swimming off the deep end to loose 1%bf. You aren't getting 5 pounds of muscle in 3 weeks from clen if that's what you think, chances are you're eating more...you working out?

[DEE151]

i will be done with pct in 2 days and ordered some clen to

a get super cut up like 3% bf
b its rumored to have some anabolic help

the pills are 40mcg , should i start at 20mcg a day see how it goes? is there an ideal anabolic dose of clen?

already got taurine ordered.
166 , 22 8% bf

For fat loss, Clenbuterol seems to stay effective for 3-6 weeks, then it's thermogenic properties seem to subside.
This is noticed when the body temperature drops back to normal.
Its anabolic properties subside much quicker, somewhere around 18 days.

Clenbuterol is attractive for its pronounced thermogenic effects as well as Mild Anabolic Properties.

A number of medical reviews have cited its outstanding potential to promote muscle gains as well as fat loss and weight loss.

[jimmyinkedup]

For fat loss, Clenbuterol seems to stay effective for 3-6 weeks, then it's thermogenic properties seem to subside.
This is noticed when the body temperature drops back to normal.
Its anabolic properties subside much quicker, somewhere around 18 days.

Clenbuterol is attractive for its pronounced thermogenic effects as well as Mild Anabolic Properties.

A number of medical reviews have cited its outstanding potential to promote muscle gains as well as fat loss and weight loss.

Those would be a very interesting read. How about posting just a few of the several ? If it isnt too much trouble.....

[Immortal Soldier]

Those would be a very interesting read. How about posting just a few of the several ? If it isnt too much trouble.....

There aren't studies out there (that I know of), physically speaking the dosages need to reach close to anabolic levels in humans is proposterous and even then when those dosages were given to rats the rats beta 2 receptors (if I read correctly) downregulated too quickly to measure a true anabolic effect and thus it could be theorized that in humans it would be even worse since the human body doesn't have the amount of beta 2 receptors needed.

[gettingjackedandtan]

Just a little friendly advise...you really souldn't mix stims like caffine and clen with seroquel and you should take it as your doctor told you (for example everyday). It isn't something to be messing around with...your mental health. It's not worth swimming off the deep end to loose 1%bf. You aren't getting 5 pounds of muscle in 3 weeks from clen if that's what you think, chances are you're eating more...you working out?

i was super hungry on clen, im doing standard 2 weeks on 2 weeks off. i was saying if i gained 1.6 lbs per 2 week cycle after 12weeks. 3-2 week cycles i would have gained 5 lbs.

ill give it another go in one more week off see how i react, hard to tell with new things, sometimes just takes getting used to it