coming to the end of long cycle!what to do!

[sitries]

age 26, height 6ft, 2 previous cycles both of test enanthate for 12weeks.

been on -

wk1-16 test enanthate 500mg per week
wk1-10 deca 400mg per week
wk11-14 superdrol 30mg per day.
wk16-19 superdrol 30mg per day
wk16-19 hcg 3x500iu shots per week
wk19-25 clomid and nolvadex pct

im currently in week 16, got 1 more shot of test and have been on the superdrol for 1 week. so far i have gained 20lbs from the cycle. i had to have 2weeks off mid cycle as i had an operation so couldnt train so i lost a bit then but iv since made that up. i also think that having to use letro for a month held me back a bit but it cleared up the gyno that had flarred up on 1 side.

heres the problem, summers now fast approaching and im gna be looking to really lean out to get the 6pack ripped look going on. iv got 60 caps of ECA stack to use for the cut and i plan on dropping the carbs low and doing cardio 4x per week. problem is i dont want to lose much muscle whilst doing the cut and undo all the hard made gains over the last cycle fo bulking. Originally i planned to cut whilst on gear, but due to the operation, this cycle has gone on longer than the planned original 12 weeks, so i havent got time now to come off for time on+pct = time off and then get back on to cut whilst on ASS

therefore here are the proposed options....

1 - continue this cycle on for another 6 weeks and use the ECA satck to do a serious cut and get ready for summer.

2 - continue bulking through pct stay of the ASS and then cut naturally during my time off stage.

i dont want to lose muscle from the cutting phase but i also dont want to saty on gear too lonmg and **** myself up!!! iv already been on too long as far as im concerned. hope you guyscan offer assistance with my dilemma.

[Critical Mass]

Its up to you,but I personally dont think you can cut much in 6 weeks. Go for number 2.

[jamyjamjr]

age 26, height 6ft, 2 previous cycles both of test enanthate for 12weeks.

been on -

wk1-16 test enanthate 500mg per week
wk1-10 deca 400mg per week
wk11-14 superdrol 30mg per day.
wk16-19 superdrol 30mg per day
wk16-19 hcg 3x500iu shots per week
wk19-25 clomid and nolvadex pct

im currently in week 16, got 1 more shot of test and have been on the superdrol for 1 week. so far i have gained 20lbs from the cycle. i had to have 2weeks off mid cycle as i had an operation so couldnt train so i lost a bit then but iv since made that up. i also think that having to use letro for a month held me back a bit but it cleared up the gyno that had flarred up on 1 side.

heres the problem, summers now fast approaching and im gna be looking to really lean out to get the 6pack ripped look going on. iv got 60 caps of ECA stack to use for the cut and i plan on dropping the carbs low and doing cardio 4x per week. problem is i dont want to lose much muscle whilst doing the cut and undo all the hard made gains over the last cycle fo bulking. Originally i planned to cut whilst on gear, but due to the operation, this cycle has gone on longer than the planned original 12 weeks, so i havent got time now to come off for time on+pct = time off and then get back on to cut whilst on ASS

therefore here are the proposed options....

1 - continue this cycle on for another 6 weeks and use the ECA satck to do a serious cut and get ready for summer.

2 - continue bulking through pct stay of the ASS and then cut naturally during my time off stage.

i dont want to lose muscle from the cutting phase but i also dont want to saty on gear too lonmg and **** myself up!!! iv already been on too long as far as im concerned. hope you guyscan offer assistance with my dilemma.

that's a pretty long cycle.. i would do a more rig. pct to get your hpta back in natty goodness... go with number 2

[MMArmour]

Only gained 20lbs on ALLL that shit???

Waste.

[Polska]

I wouldn't cut right after a PCT. Just run a good PCT and train and eat to maintain what you've gained. Catabolism is too rampant after a cycle, even with a good PCT to cut IMO.

[Phate]

go with number 2

ephedrine increases cortisol levels which will shift you into an even more catabolic state then you normally would be in during pct

[BIG_TRUCK]

Only gained 20lbs on ALLL that shit???

Waste.

20lbs is a lot of weight for that cycle.

[jamyjamjr]

go with number 2

ephedrine increases cortisol levels which will shift you into an even more catabolic state then you normally would be in during pct

im gonna have to argue against this one phate...

i was under the impression that ephedrine, when stacked with caffine and asprin, has a good anti-catabolic effect..

iv read articles on this matter myself because iv used eca with success in the past..

ephedrine by it's self would be catabolic though

[hankdiesel]

That is a long time to bo on superdrol. That stuff is pretty harsh.

[romo6]

I wouldn't cut right after a PCT. Just run a good PCT and train and eat to maintain what you've gained. Catabolism is too rampant after a cycle, even with a good PCT to cut IMO.

Exactly.

[Phate]

im gonna have to argue against this one phate...

i was under the impression that ephedrine, when stacked with caffine and asprin, has a good anti-catabolic effect..

iv read articles on this matter myself because iv used eca with success in the past..

ephedrine by it's self would be catabolic though

interesting....studies please, i'm interested now as i've never ran eca or ecy and am not as versed in it as i am in other sympathomimetics

[sitries]

i dont think 20lbs is bad going considering the 2week layoff and the letro usage which i feel hindered me. total time on superdrol will be 6weeks but there is a break in between so i diodnt htink it would be too bad. i doubt superdrol is any worse that anadrol or dbol .

[jamyjamjr]

interesting....studies please, i'm interested now as i've never ran eca or ecy and am not as versed in it as i am in other sympathomimetics

The effects of the ECA stack in weight loss are primarily due to the ephedrine component. Ephedrine acts both as a beta agonist and stimulates the release of norepinephrine. Increased circulating norepinephrine in the body then acts on white adipose tissue by increasing cAMP levels. This causes a thermogenic effect, raising body temperature and increasing the user's metabolism in conjunction with the rest of the stack.[citation needed]

However, the body's negative feedback system then activates to normalize the metabolism. This is done via the production of phosphodiesterase inside the cells, and prostaglandins outside the cell, which both lower cAMP levels within the cell.
Caffeine inhibits the production of phosphodiesterase inside the cell and therefore slows cAMP breakdown. It also binds with and competitively inhibits adenosine receptors in the brain, triggering the release of epinephrine and increasing cAMP levels further.

Aspirin inhibits prostaglandin production outside of the cells, which, in conjunction with caffeine, greatly prolongs the thermogenic effects and increased metabolism by sustaining elevated cAMP levels.[citation needed]

Ephedrine also has an anorectic, or appetite-suppressing, effect. However, these effects only last for about two weeks if the stack is not cycled, as the body becomes tolerant to ephedrine to some degree.[citation needed] It is estimated that 60%–75% of the weight loss from using the ECA stack comes from the anorectic effect, and the remainder from thermogenesis.[citation needed]

The final component in weight loss of the ECA stack is that of a simple stimulant; the higher epinephrine and norepinephrine levels result in increased aerobic exercise performance and less fatigue.[citation needed]

[c-Z]

Another for number 2

[Phate]

The effects of the ECA stack in weight loss are primarily due to the ephedrine component. Ephedrine acts both as a beta agonist and stimulates the release of norepinephrine. Increased circulating norepinephrine in the body then acts on white adipose tissue by increasing cAMP levels. This causes a thermogenic effect, raising body temperature and increasing the user's metabolism in conjunction with the rest of the stack.[citation needed]

However, the body's negative feedback system then activates to normalize the metabolism. This is done via the production of phosphodiesterase inside the cells, and prostaglandins outside the cell, which both lower cAMP levels within the cell.
Caffeine inhibits the production of phosphodiesterase inside the cell and therefore slows cAMP breakdown. It also binds with and competitively inhibits adenosine receptors in the brain, triggering the release of epinephrine and increasing cAMP levels further.

Aspirin inhibits prostaglandin production outside of the cells, which, in conjunction with caffeine, greatly prolongs the thermogenic effects and increased metabolism by sustaining elevated cAMP levels.[citation needed]

Ephedrine also has an anorectic, or appetite-suppressing, effect. However, these effects only last for about two weeks if the stack is not cycled, as the body becomes tolerant to ephedrine to some degree.[citation needed] It is estimated that 60%–75% of the weight loss from using the ECA stack comes from the anorectic effect, and the remainder from thermogenesis.[citation needed]

The final component in weight loss of the ECA stack is that of a simple stimulant; the higher epinephrine and norepinephrine levels result in increased aerobic exercise performance and less fatigue.[citation needed]

i'm still not seeing where this says that using a stack lowers the production of cortisol vs. ephedrine alone

[Darksyde]

what was your weight at the end of that circus?

[Knockout_Power]

Lots of posts that state clen helps to lower cortisol, must be a bit of truth?

[sitries]

what was your weight at the end of that circus?

circus??? you dont like the cycle??

went from 180-200lbs

[Immortal Soldier]

that's a pretty long cycle.. i would do a more rig. pct to get your hpta back in natty goodness... go with number 2

Just curious what your idea of a "rigorous" PCT is, when he mentioned he is doing 6 weeks of Clomid/Nolva therapy.

If done at the right dosages that is a good PCT in my book, he is running HCG as well which will bring back the old boys, he could throw in an AI, but he stopped test/deca usage on week 16 and continued running Superdrol which doesn't convert to estrogen due to the structure of the compound so estrogen shouldn't be a major issue.

[Darksyde]

circus??? you dont like the cycle??

went from 180-200lbs

honestly i think that much of the oral ph superdrol may have some lingering detrimental effects in regards to your lipid profile. and have you read the reports of delayed onset gyno attributed to long sd cycles? well you did it man so i hope it works out for you. i think a simple test e cycle could easily net someone 20+ pounds if their training and diet regime is good but hey its your body. not to mention you could easily surpass 200 at 6'0 naturally.

[leanmuscle]

Im a little concerned that you only put on 20 lbs with that long of a cycle. I would stay off the AAS for a while and do natural cutting. I think if your train hard and have a good diet you can do it.