First cycle (Sustanon 250)

[fixUPlookSHARP]

i've planned out my first cycle like this, any suggestions would be great. more guidance on my PCT would be even more greatly appreciated

anyways, on to the gear. i'm planning to take 250mgs/week of sustanon 250 for 8 weeks. but i've also read somewhere else that another option would be 250mgs/5days, still iffy on this so please comment if you will. as far as my PCT goes, i'm still trying to get my hands on clomid but can easily get some novladex. at the dose i'm taking and for the given duration, will novladex suffice by itself or should i really shoot for both? how do they compare separately?

so what i really want to know on top of all that is, is this a safe route to go? when should i expect to see noticeable gains (i imagine third week?) and how can i properly execute my PCT? first week high dose, then triangle downwards?

thanks in advanced

[sigman roid]

stats please
age
weight
height
bf

[fixUPlookSHARP]

stats please
age
weight
height
bf

21
140lbs (cause of boxing, i like to have my bouts in this division. i'm taking a couple of months off so i don't consider juicing any form of cheating. )
5'9
i imagine my bf to be pretty low because of my cardio regimen

[sigman roid]

bro at 21 your still a bit young for steroids,and at 5'9 and 140lbs its your diet that needs fixing you definatley dont need steroids yet,at your age you have loads of natural test floating around your body you can grow naturally

[fixUPlookSHARP]

bro at 21 your still a bit young for steroids,and at 5'9 and 140lbs its your diet that needs fixing you definatley dont need steroids yet,at your age you have loads of natural test floating around your body you can grow naturally

i appreciate your concern, and mind you i work to keep at 140lbs. i'm probably 155 if i don't train to keep my weight at a certain level.

i will be doing my cycle regardless of how many people tell me i shouldn't. i'm not a teenager anymore, i've got a grip on how i feel about my body and i've been physically active for my whole entire life. i know how to train, i know how to diet and i have as much discipline as any other athlete on this site. with that said, can anyone guide me in the right direction of properly executing this cycle. once again, thank you very much for your concern

[T-MOS]

welcome to AR

do you have any desire to see 5'10" ??

what are your goals for this cycle if you don't want to get bigger ?

8 weeks is too short for using Sust. Sust needs to be shot EOD (every other day) not once a week

[Hunter]

AAS does very little for combat sports, really. Almost all mma fighters who test positive lost the fight in which they failed the test. Boxers its really not that much different and if you were old enough and the weight was right I wouldnt advise test as the base of your cycle.

[amcon]

lol ... nobody likes to here this stuff... but bro these guys know there stuff

[WARMachine]

AAS does very little for combat sports, really. Almost all mma fighters who test positive lost the fight in which they failed the test. Boxers its really not that much different and if you were old enough and the weight was right I wouldnt advise test as the base of your cycle.

Especially with Cyp. Which has a LONG detection time.

But ill let TMos handle this one. :

[sigman roid]

i appreciate your concern, and mind you i work to keep at 140lbs. i'm probably 155 if i don't train to keep my weight at a certain level.

i will be doing my cycle regardless of how many people tell me i shouldn't. i'm not a teenager anymore, i've got a grip on how i feel about my body and i've been physically active for my whole entire life. i know how to train, i know how to diet and i have as much discipline as any other athlete on this site. with that said, can anyone guide me in the right direction of properly executing this cycle. once again, thank you very much for your concern

i hear you bro ,all i can give is my opion as i have done, what i would say is for a first cycle i would use a single ester like test e instead of a multi ester like sustanon

[fixUPlookSHARP]

welcome to AR

do you have any desire to see 5'10" ??

what are your goals for this cycle if you don't want to get bigger ?

8 weeks is too short for using Sust. Sust needs to be shot EOD (every other day) not once a week

i honestly don't think i'll grow much more. my mother's barely 5 feet and my father's average.

i didn't say my goal for this cycle wasn't to get bigger. i'm taking boxing off so i don't have to worry about keeping at 140. plus, i'd rather chill out..it's summer haha. i'd like to eventually fight at 160 so i imagine, without training i'm naturally 150-155lbs. meaning i'd like to hit about 175lbs, maintain the weight and then few months prior to returning to boxing, drop down to 160.

so right now, i just wanna focus on hitting 170lbs. as far as how much i should take. i keep getting too much conflicting info. i was going to do 250mgs/week then i was told i should do 500mgs/week then someone else told me, "no no! do 250mgs/week" then i heard somewhere else that i should 250mgs/5 days...so how should i do this, and why this dose for this duration of time.

[WARMachine]

Maybe you should research a cycle since you do not want to listen to us and have us help you reach your goals naturally.

And btw, those are VERY obtainable goals naturally.

[fixUPlookSHARP]

Maybe you should research a cycle since you do not want to listen to us and have us help you reach your goals naturally.

And btw, those are VERY obtainable goals naturally.

i want to do the juice, i'm making my decision. as far as cycle, i can only get my hands on sustanon 250 and like i said, too much conflicting info. again, thanks for your input. anything is greatly appreciated

[T-MOS]

ok, just cause your mom is short doesn't mean you have to. I am 5'11, my son's mother is only 5'8 and both sets of grandparents are NOT tall either, BUT my son sprouted when he was 18, to 6'3, so go figure.....

This really isn't something you want to do just for "summer" it doesn't work that way and your goals are ALL within your NATURAL reach, so what do you think the benefits are of using steroids to get there? It won't happen faster, and then you are just gonna want to lose what you gained to box back at 160.

Sorry, it just doesn't make sense with the risks involved. and like I said, your growth plates do not fuse NATURALLY until the mid 20's and I don't know anyone what would be happy being ONLY 5'9 if there was a chance they may get a few more inches or a little wider in the shoulders
Women like TALLER men more then they like big muscular ones. but hey its your body, we are just trying to give you your options and RISKS here

you do what you want to it, but don't say we didn't warn you when you come back with issues from using too early.

Sust can be taken at either 250 (low but not bad for first cycle) or 500 (average beginner cycle, but more sides will be involved) but again it NEEDS TO BE SHOT EVERY OTHER DAY.....NOT once a week

[T-MOS]

here you go, educate BEFORE you medicate

http://forums.steroid.com/showthread.php?t=355742

[WARMachine]

^ Good thread.


OP, good luck, youll need it.

-WAR

[fixUPlookSHARP]

ok, just cause your mom is short doesn't mean you have to. I am 5'11, my son's mother is only 5'8 and both sets of grandparents are NOT tall either, BUT my son sprouted when he was 18, to 6'3, so go figure.....

This really isn't something you want to do just for "summer" it doesn't work that way and your goals are ALL within your NATURAL reach, so what do you think the benefits are of using steroids to get there? It won't happen faster, and then you are just gonna want to lose what you gained to box back at 160.

Sorry, it just doesn't make sense with the risks involved. and like I said, your growth plates do not fuse NATURALLY until the mid 20's and I don't know anyone what would be happy being ONLY 5'9 if there was a chance they may get a few more inches or a little wider in the shoulders
Women like TALLER men more then they like big muscular ones. but hey its your body, we are just trying to give you your options and RISKS here

you do what you want to it, but don't say we didn't warn you when you come back with issues from using too early.

Sust can be taken at either 250 (low but not bad for first cycle) or 500 (average beginner cycle, but more sides will be involved) but again it NEEDS TO BE SHOT EVERY OTHER DAY.....NOT once a week

see, i've heard a lot about "eternal growth stunt" but i'm yet to find any source or report that backs that up..especially in a dose that i'll be dipping my feet into (less aromatization, less side effects) . many of the steroids you guys use (anavar, deca..) only to name a few, are actually used in some cases to induce growth in your plates. the science behind stunting growth plates due to steroids is elevated levels of estrogen, right? isn't that one of the reasons why you PCT with novladex/clomid/hcgs..etc?

once again, i thank you for only looking out for a complete stranger.

aside from this, what do you mean every other day if you're agreeing to 250mgs/week?

[Chopperbox]

First i agree with T, that 8 weeks is too low to see results, usually incurables take around 4-5 weeks to kick in and see the results... plus Sust for your first cycle.... oh well.

If you can get more test get it, nolva is good and clomid as well its a pretty safe cycle in my opinion. 250mg is a pretty low dosage and just clomid should be enough.

And like other said just diet alone will help you quite a bit!
Good luck.

[jbm]

Just don't use sustanon for 1st cycle...
still young to cycle

[Hunter]

see, i've heard a lot about "eternal growth stunt" but i'm yet to find any source or report that backs that up..especially in a dose that i'll be dipping my feet into (less aromatization, less side effects) . many of the steroids you guys use (anavar, deca..) only to name a few, are actually used in some cases to induce growth in your plates. the science behind stunting growth plates due to steroids is elevated levels of estrogen, right? isn't that one of the reasons why you PCT with novladex/clomid/hcgs..etc?

once again, i thank you for only looking out for a complete stranger.

aside from this, what do you mean every other day if you're agreeing to 250mgs/week?

Actually I believe its the pct compounds the stunt the growth plates. Also you realize you could do severe damage to hpta becouse its still developing?

[T-MOS]

see, i've heard a lot about "eternal growth stunt" but i'm yet to find any source or report that backs that up..especially in a dose that i'll be dipping my feet into (less aromatization, less side effects) . many of the steroids you guys use (anavar, deca..) only to name a few, are actually used in some cases to induce growth in your plates. the science behind stunting growth plates due to steroids is elevated levels of estrogen, right? isn't that one of the reasons why you PCT with novladex/clomid/hcgs..etc?

once again, i thank you for only looking out for a complete stranger.

aside from this, what do you mean every other day if you're agreeing to 250mgs/week?

there are plenty of threads here on Growth Plates, and YES one cycle WILL shut down your HPTA, no matter what your dose, so premature fusion IS a very good possibility

you can search here for the threads, I am too tired to look for you

PCT is to help you recover your natural production of test and to prevent estrogen rebound. there is NO guarantee that you will fully recover your levels

when I say you have to inject EOD, thats what I mean. If you are doing a total of 250 mgs/week, then you will have to do the math and break down the ml to how much you need in each shot.

.3 of a ML will give you about 75 mgs/ of sust. take that times 3.5 and you get approx 262 mgs of sust per week

you will have to be able to break up the shots. OH, and since Sust has the PROP ester in it, it tends to be a MORE painful shot, so expect to have very sore muscles for about 3 days after EACH injection

[fixUPlookSHARP]

Actually I believe its the pct compounds the stunt the growth plates. Also you realize you could do severe damage to hpta becouse its still developing?

pct compounds consist of antiestrogen, which is why one would use PCT after a cycle..to prevent gyno and other sides. as far "do severe damage to HPTA" what do you mean? during my cycle my body will be running on androgens and then my HPTA will be supressed of natural test, which is where clomid comes into play. a natural test booster

[fixUPlookSHARP]

there are plenty of threads here on Growth Plates, and YES one cycle WILL shut down your HPTA, no matter what your dose, so premature fusion IS a very good possibility

you can search here for the threads, I am too tired to look for you

PCT is to help you recover your natural production of test and to prevent estrogen rebound. there is NO guarantee that you will fully recover your levels

when I say you have to inject EOD, thats what I mean. If you are doing a total of 250 mgs/week, then you will have to do the math and break down the ml to how much you need in each shot.

.3 of a ML will give you about 75 mgs/ of sust. take that times 3.5 and you get approx 262 mgs of sust per week

you will have to be able to break up the shots. OH, and since Sust has the PROP ester in it, it tends to be a MORE painful shot, so expect to have very sore muscles for about 3 days after EACH injection

and can you briefly break it down why i should split my shots like that as opposed to just doing 250mgs every monday of the week? will i get more out if it doing it this way? how and why?

[Hunter]

pct compounds consist of antiestrogen, which is why one would use PCT after a cycle..to prevent gyno and other sides. as far "do severe damage to HPTA" what do you mean? during my cycle my body will be running on androgens and then my HPTA will be supressed of natural test, which is where clomid comes into play. a natural test booster

As in your hpta may never recover full, i.e hrt. Pct correct is to jumpstart your hpta system again. Your not going to be supressed your gonna be shutdown as in your body will not be making testerone period. Shutting down your hpta system at such a young age means you may not every getting your natty levels back to where they were previously or you may end up on hrt early in life.

[T-MOS]

and can you briefly break it down why i should split my shots like that as opposed to just doing 250mgs every monday of the week? will i get more out if it doing it this way? how and why?

well, see here, this is where YOUR research into what you are sticking into you body comes into play.

YOU need to know this stuff and should have researched it BEFORE hand

there are steroid profiles here and you should spend time there

sust has 4 different esters

esters are what the compound is suspended in and determine the release times of the compound

sust has short and long esters because it was initially invented for TRT use only, not bodybuilding

The KEY to doing cycles properly is to keep your blood plasma levels as stable as possible. not fluctuating all over the place.

so with sust releasing Testosterone at 4 DIFFERENT times, it is VERY hard to keep your blood levels stable so you need to go by the shortest ester which is the Prop ester

in order to keep the prop ester level, you need to inject it EOD

(its a good thing for you that I have Tren Insomnia and can't sleep)

[fixUPlookSHARP]

As in your hpta may never recover full, i.e hrt. Pct correct is to jumpstart your hpta system again. Your not going to be supressed your gonna be shutdown as in your body will not be making testerone period. Shutting down your hpta system at such a young age means you may not every getting your natty levels back to where they were previously or you may end up on hrt early in life.

i don't see how it's possible in the dose i'll be taking. my androgen levels aren't going to be so high that my HPTA is just gonna shut down.

[WARMachine]

pct compounds consist of antiestrogen, no they do not.

which is why one would use pct after a cyclethat makes no sense. You do not know what youre talking about...to prevent gyno and other sides.no. Pct is used post cycle, to aid in the recovery of your hpta.

as far "do severe damage to hpta" what do you mean? your hpta might not fully recover! Ever! Thats what we mean!

during my cycle my body will be running on androgens and then my hpta will be supressed of natural test, which is where clomid comes into play. A natural test boosterclomid is not a natural test booster. And are you implying you want to run clomid during the cycle?

bolds

[fixUPlookSHARP]

well, see here, this is where YOUR research into what you are sticking into you body comes into play.

YOU need to know this stuff and should have researched it BEFORE hand

there are steroid profiles here and you should spend time there

sust has 4 different esters

esters are what the compound is suspended in and determine the release times of the compound

sust has short and long esters because it was initially invented for TRT use only, not bodybuilding

The KEY to doing cycles properly is to keep your blood plasma levels as stable as possible. not fluctuating all over the place.

so with sust releasing Testosterone at 4 DIFFERENT times, it is VERY hard to keep your blood levels stable so you need to go by the shortest ester which is the Prop ester

in order to keep the prop ester level, you need to inject it EOD

(its a good thing for you that I have Tren Insomnia and can't sleep)

i love you t-mos. probably the most helpful answer i've gotten in the past week. no one can explain why i should take this dose for this long. all i got was "cause you should". and please don't take away the fact that i'm researching. i guess i've just been researching in the wrong places and talked to the wrong people. i'm glad i stopped here though

[T-MOS]

i don't see how it's possible in the dose i'll be taking. my androgen levels aren't going to be so high that my HPTA is just gonna shut down.

please tell me WHERE you got this information???

your body produces an average of 70mgs of test /week. you are taking more than that, your body will see that and say, hey, i dont' need to produce any, your testicles WILL atrophy cause they are NOT producing endogenous testosterone.

YOU WILL BE SHUTTING DOWN COMPLETELY !!!! P E R I O D !!!

[Reed]

(its a good thing for you that I have Tren Insomnia and can't sleep)

I am right there with you bud

Gonna watch this one unfold

[WARMachine]

i don't see how it's possible in the dose i'll be taking. my androgen levels aren't going to be so high that my HPTA is just gonna shut down.

LISTEN VERY CAREFULLY.


YOU ARE SUPPLEMENTING WITH ARTIFICAL TESTOSTERONE.

YOURE NATURAL TESTOSTERONE PRODUCTION WILL SHUT DOWN AS SOON AS YOU BEGIN INJECTING DOSES OF ENDOGENOUS LEVELS OF TESTOSTERONE!

[T-MOS]

I am right there with you bud

Gonna watch this one unfold

I think I am close to being out of patience here, so I may step out for a while !!

GOOD LUCK OP

[fixUPlookSHARP]

bolds

pct compounds consist of antiestrogen, no they do not.

pct stands for post cycle THERAPY. this isn't just constricted to one form of aid. one pct is novladex, right? novladex contains anti estrogens. it's lumped in the same category as proviron

which is why one would use pct after a cyclethat makes no sense. You do not know what youre talking about...to prevent gyno and other sides.no. Pct is used post cycle, to aid in the recovery of your hpta.

PCT isn't just used to aid recovery of your hpta. it's to deal with gyno as well.

as far "do severe damage to hpta" what do you mean? your hpta might not fully recover! Ever! Thats what we mean!

again, how can my dose shut down my hpta completely? if were worried about that, you guys wouldn't even be doing juice in the first place.

during my cycle my body will be running on androgens and then my hpta will be supressed of natural test, which is where clomid comes into play. A natural test boosterclomid is not a natural test booster. And are you implying you want to run clomid during the cycle?

no, running clomid during the cycle would be completely useless. you'd have to wait til all your androgen levels are at their lowest..



BOLDS

[fixUPlookSHARP]

I think I am close to being out of patience here, so I may step out for a while !!

GOOD LUCK OP

i don't get it? why is everything acting so fed up. i came to a forum that is supposed to help me with said topic. but everyone just seems to...blah. maybe i just came to the wrong place?

[WARMachine]

pct compounds consist of antiestrogen, no they do not.

pct stands for post cycle therapy. This isn't just constricted to one form of aid. One pct is novladex, right? Novladex contains anti estrogens. It's lumped in the same category as proviron

NO. Again youre talking out of your ass. Nolvadex is not an anti-estrogen. It is a SERM! However, yes PCT is used post cycle. Obviously. Sorry i misread that previous post. IDK why i thought you said the opposite. Sorry for the confusion there.

which is why one would use pct after a cyclethat makes no sense. You do not know what youre talking about...to prevent gyno and other sides.no. Pct is used post cycle, to aid in the recovery of your hpta.

pct isn't just used to aid recovery of your hpta. It's to deal with gyno as well.

again. Talking out of your ass. That was by far one of the dumbest comments ive ever read.

as far "do severe damage to hp$ta" what do you mean? Your hpta might not fully recover! Ever! Thats what we mean!

again, how can my dose shut down my hpta completely? If were worried about that, you guys wouldn't even be doing juice in the first place.

omg! Im done. Youre just ignorant. Go do w/e you want. Youre a fool. You dont wtf youre talking about. My patience has run out.

during my cycle my body will be running on androgens and then my hpta will be supressed of natural test, which is where clomid comes into play. A natural test boosterclomid is not a natural test booster. And are you implying you want to run clomid during the cycle?

no, running clomid during the cycle would be completely useless. You'd have to wait til all your androgen levels are at their lowest..



bolds

reds

[fixUPlookSHARP]

please tell me WHERE you got this information???

your body produces an average of 70mgs of test /week. you are taking more than that, your body will see that and say, hey, i dont' need to produce any, your testicles WILL atrophy cause they are NOT producing endogenous testosterone.

YOU WILL BE SHUTTING DOWN COMPLETELY !!!! P E R I O D !!!

then how do i properly do this? 250mgs/week EOD. what about pct? you guys are completely aware of the risks of your HPTA shutting down, so how do you guys aid yourself through it?

[fixUPlookSHARP]

seriously, if i'm talking out of my ass then i'm misinformed. aren't you guys in these forums to help? i don't get all of this attitude, sorry that i came off arrogant? i didn't intend on that. i'm trying to be as polite and as sincere as possible but all i'm getting is "PISS OFF"

[Reed]

Nolva is a SERM buddy it blocks the estro from binding to the sites but will not decrease estro in the blood, estro will still circulate with no place to go

I don't know what you don't understand about a exogenous hormone shutting down your natural production. Your dose of 250mg will shut down your HPTA and you will need a PCT, thats why we use PCT to recover the HPTA. I just don't get it, what do you think PCT is for

[WARMachine]

I did just noticed i misread something you posted.

PCT is used post cycle. IDK why i thought i read you said it was not used post cycle.

I apologize for that, i misread your statement. Sorry for that confusion.

[T-MOS]

then how do i properly do this? 250mgs/week EOD. what about pct? you guys are completely aware of the risks of your HPTA shutting down, so how do you guys aid yourself through it?

I didn't start cycling until I was 35, so my levels were already on the decline, IF my HPTA doesn't come back up now at the age of 44, I really dont' care as I am old enough to do TRT for the rest of my life, I am fixed so I dont' have to worry about not being able to have kids like you will......

we take the same risks as you are doing, BUT you have a LOT more to lose then most of us do......