Stack for starting out

[Gexus]

Hello,

I'm looking at taking Clen, Winn 50 and Tren 75. My primary goal is to reduce body fat while at the same time gaining muscle mass. I've never taken any of these, only currently take protein and creatine. Would you say these 3 combined are a good start?

Thanks!

[romo6]

Are you talking about the stuff on the banner up above?

[G4R]

Welcome,

Stats-
Age?
Height?
Weight?
BF%
Diet (details please)*
Cycle Exp?
PCT Knowlege
Training Exp

*Diet Summary Example:

Meal 1
xxxxxxx ( Cal xxg, Fat xxg, Protein xxg, Carbs xxg)
xxxxxxx ( Cal xxg, Fat xxg, Protein xxg, Carbs xxg)
xxxxxxx ( Cal xxg, Fat xxg, Protein xxg, Carbs xxg)

Meal 2
xxxxxxx ( Cal xxg, Fat xxg, Protein xxg, Carbs xxg)
xxxxxxx ( Cal xxg, Fat xxg, Protein xxg, Carbs xxg)
xxxxxxx ( Cal xxg, Fat xxg, Protein xxg, Carbs xxg)

Meal 3
xxxxxxx ( Cal xxg, Fat xxg, Protein xxg, Carbs xxg)
xxxxxxx ( Cal xxg, Fat xxg, Protein xxg, Carbs xxg)
xxxxxxx ( Cal xxg, Fat xxg, Protein xxg, Carbs xxg)

Meal 4
xxxxxxx ( Cal xxg, Fat xxg, Protein xxg, Carbs xxg)
xxxxxxx ( Cal xxg, Fat xxg, Protein xxg, Carbs xxg)
xxxxxxx ( Cal xxg, Fat xxg, Protein xxg, Carbs xxg)

Meal 5
xxxxxxx ( Cal xxg, Fat xxg, Protein xxg, Carbs xxg)
xxxxxxx ( Cal xxg, Fat xxg, Protein xxg, Carbs xxg)
xxxxxxx ( Cal xxg, Fat xxg, Protein xxg, Carbs xxg)

Meal 6
xxxxxxx ( Cal xxg, Fat xxg, Protein xxg, Carbs xxg)
xxxxxxx ( Cal xxg, Fat xxg, Protein xxg, Carbs xxg)
xxxxxxx ( Cal xxg, Fat xxg, Protein xxg, Carbs xxg)

Totals: Cal xxg, Fat xxg, Protein xxg, Carbs xxg

By the way.... that stuff is junk....

[Big]

Welcome.
we need your stats to help you.

[organized_konfusion]

That stuff above on the banner will get you jacked bro...........................right.....

[Gexus]

Age? 26
Height? 5' 11"
Weight? 192lbs
BF% 18.9%
Diet (details please)*
Don't have a strict diet. Generally don't eat sugars. Mostly chicken/fish/vegies.. I have nuts for snacks.. Diet is generally high protein... I don't cut out carbs, I'll have turkey sandwiches on whole grain bread...
Cycle Exp? No experience. I take creatine, protein, and a pre-workout formula, basically b-vitamine and amino acids.
PCT Knowlege - none
Training Exp - Workout 5 days a week... well rounded workout, light cardio on bike.


Hope this helps, and yes I was talking about the stuff from the banner... total newbie when it comes to this.

[G4R]

Alright, here is what I want you to do.....

First, check out this link, http://forums.steroid.com/forumdisplay.php?f=6 , post up that you need a diet, and what your goals are. Let them critique it to help you out.

Second, check out this link, http://forums.steroid.com/forumdisplay.php?f=88 , start reading about lifting for size.

Third, read all the stickies on this site, lots of great info to get you the knowledge you will need when you are actually ready for steroids.

You have lots of natural growth left in you. Dont hurt your body because you are not ready.

[ninesecz]

There are ome really ood products out there but not sure about the ones from the banner!
never touched them b4

[Gexus]

Thanks going4******, Just posted about a diet plan. I'll start reading the thread you posted and read up.

[hankdiesel]

Those are not steroids you are refering to.

[Gexus]

I've done some more research... Here's what I'm looking at now as a 12 week cycle.

400mg/wk - Deca Durabolin - Decabolic
400mg/wk - Testosterone Enanthate - Enanthbolic
50mg/Day Dianabol - Methanabolic

[G4R]

I've done some more research... Here's what I'm looking at now as a 12 week cycle.

400mg/wk - Deca Durabolin - Decabolic
400mg/wk - Testosterone Enanthate - Enanthbolic
50mg/Day Dianabol - Methanabolic

Well, its better now that you are researching. But give your diet thread some time for people to look at it and help you out. If you take our advice, it will be a few years before you start cycling anything.

[Gexus]

Thanks, I'll wait before I jump into it. But a few years? Hm.. I'm hoping to build up muscle mass fast, ideally to the point that I can pretty much eat whatever I want and have a fast enough metabolism... I could do this naturally, but like I say, looking for a jump start. I think one 12 week cycle would be all I would do, then I would just maintain - At least this is the plan, at this point... still more research.

[G4R]

Thanks, I'll wait before I jump into it. But a few years? Hm.. I'm hoping to build up muscle mass fast, ideally to the point that I can pretty much eat whatever I want and have a fast enough metabolism... I could do this naturally, but like I say, looking for a jump start. I think one 12 week cycle would be all I would do, then I would just maintain - At least this is the plan, at this point... still more research.

Do you want to trade me your cow for these magic beans?

It takes a lot of hard work to get what you are wanting, it isnt going to happen in one 12 week cycle, especially if your diet and training is not what it should be.

[lovbyts]

Do you want to trade me your cow for these magic beans?

It takes a lot of hard work to get what you are wanting, it isnt going to happen in one 12 week cycle, especially if your diet and training is not what it should be.

Agreed, if you diet and workout routine is not 100% you will be worse off than you are now and more disappointed due to water wait gain, bloating among other sides and they you will loose any of your gains you do make right away after cycle and if you dont do a proper PCT....

OK stick with reading some more. Work on that diet and working out. You really dont want to do a cycle until you are already in great shape, then you will be impressed with the results and they are more keepable gains.

[Gexus]

Ok, thanks for the responses.. I'll take the advice and get diet down good.. I'm going to get a trainer next week to help with my workout.

[lovbyts]

Ok, thanks for the responses.. I'll take the advice and get diet down good.. I'm going to get a trainer next week to help with my workout.

You like flushing money down the drain dont you? OK it's not a waste if you can afford it and you really need one but personally I think MOST personal trainers dont know sh*t

[Gexus]

You like flushing money down the drain dont you? OK it's not a waste if you can afford it and you really need one but personally I think MOST personal trainers dont know sh*t

Well I'm sure they'll know more than I do... Would like to work with someone to at least help get a starting routine down. Once I learn the basics, I should be better equipped to come up with my own routine through research.

[anabolictonic]

Haha i was like this guy when i first started.

Gexus you will be surprised how much you will grow in the first 6 months definately WITHOUT steroids!! Alot will come down to your diet but if your committed it will work wonders. Youl grow the first 6 months no matter what!

Steroids work mainly on people who have been working out for a few years because they have built up a number or receptors which is where aas does alot of its work. Without a solid foundation you dont have many of these receptors and will not benefit anywhere near as much from steroids now than if you did it in 2 years.

Its not a quick shortcut to gain 30 pounds and then maintain. You have to learn the ins and outs of dieting and working out, listening to your body etc... without any of this steroids will be useless and ul lose most if not all of what you gained.

It is great to workout naturally for a few years so you know how to take full advantage of steroids when the time comes, but if you cant get it right naturally steroids will be of no benefit.

And from experience from someone who did a cycle after only 3 months of working out i severely regret it and have jumped up and down in weight I AM NOW AT A POINT THAT I COULD HAVE GOT TO NATURALLY IN THE SAME AMOUNT OF TIME!!! Without wasting thousands of dollars and all the ups and downs in weight and people saying during cycle "wow you look big man" and then 2 weeks after pct "shit youve lost alot of size" its very disheartening to hear that second one...and i would still have all the excitement and anticipation of using steroids for the first time. Everyone remembers the first time they inject because its exciting to take that next step, and its something to look forward to while you workout for the next few years.

I know its exciting/tempting to have all this gear that is meant to turn you super human, who wants to just workout with rice and chicken gaining slowly when you could be on gear!!
My advice is spend that money on quality workout drinks and high quality protein powders, post workout recovery drinks, bcaas etc and youl still make great gains and have the excitement of trying out new products. I love nano vapor by the way but its pricey!!

You could even a bit down the track use ephedrine before a workout for added energy, things like that exciting to try.

Bottom line tho you wont see the same gains as someone who was been working out for a few years because
a) you dont know how your body reacts to different workout programs
b) you dont know how your body responds to different foods ( and you dont know how to eat properly)
c) receptors baby!!! you aint got enough to benefit from gear.

Sorry about the rant but i really do regret using gear to early so i hope you listen.

cheers,
tonic.

[Gexus]

Haha i was like this guy when i first started.

Gexus you will be surprised how much you will grow in the first 6 months definately WITHOUT steroids!! Alot will come down to your diet but if your committed it will work wonders. Youl grow the first 6 months no matter what!

Steroids work mainly on people who have been working out for a few years because they have built up a number or receptors which is where aas does alot of its work. Without a solid foundation you dont have many of these receptors and will not benefit anywhere near as much from steroids now than if you did it in 2 years.

Its not a quick shortcut to gain 30 pounds and then maintain. You have to learn the ins and outs of dieting and working out, listening to your body etc... without any of this steroids will be useless and ul lose most if not all of what you gained.

It is great to workout naturally for a few years so you know how to take full advantage of steroids when the time comes, but if you cant get it right naturally steroids will be of no benefit.

And from experience from someone who did a cycle after only 3 months of working out i severely regret it and have jumped up and down in weight I AM NOW AT A POINT THAT I COULD HAVE GOT TO NATURALLY IN THE SAME AMOUNT OF TIME!!! Without wasting thousands of dollars and all the ups and downs in weight and people saying during cycle "wow you look big man" and then 2 weeks after pct "shit youve lost alot of size" its very disheartening to hear that second one...and i would still have all the excitement and anticipation of using steroids for the first time. Everyone remembers the first time they inject because its exciting to take that next step, and its something to look forward to while you workout for the next few years.

I know its exciting/tempting to have all this gear that is meant to turn you super human, who wants to just workout with rice and chicken gaining slowly when you could be on gear!!
My advice is spend that money on quality workout drinks and high quality protein powders, post workout recovery drinks, bcaas etc and youl still make great gains and have the excitement of trying out new products. I love nano vapor by the way but its pricey!!

You could even a bit down the track use ephedrine before a workout for added energy, things like that exciting to try.

Bottom line tho you wont see the same gains as someone who was been working out for a few years because
a) you dont know how your body reacts to different workout programs
b) you dont know how your body responds to different foods ( and you dont know how to eat properly)
c) receptors baby!!! you aint got enough to benefit from gear.

Sorry about the rant but i really do regret using gear to early so i hope you listen.

cheers,
tonic.

Thanks man, that was definitely helpful. So, I'm going to really just focus on diet right now and workout, see how it goes for 4-6months, and look into various supplements as I go along.

Thanks!

[ninesecz]

Get yourself some creatine ! Creatine is a good safe supplement to take while training and a good multi vitamin

[anabolictonic]

Yer good job man youll still find it exciting to try different creatines and post workout drinks and most of all youl see gains you can keep. No one wants to have to endure pct if they dont have to! haha good luck mate hope to see you lookin bigger and bigger every month

[Zoonk]

Great informative post thanks

[Nooomoto]

Don't get a trainer, dude. Thats a WASTE of money. Whatever the trainer is going to tell you can be found for free if you just invest some time in yourself. Go buy Arnold Schwarzenegger's The New Encyclopedia of Modern Bodybuilding : The Bible of Bodybuilding. Read it cover to cover and you'll probably end up knowing more than any trainer you'd run into. You can get it for about $20.