Newbie, serious about goals.

[Damienm05]

Alright, to start off, I am 22 and currently in school. I used to play Junior A hockey and had a span of about 2 years where I trained hard. I am 6'1" and at that time I was about 210 with a 250 lb bench press max, 11% body fat. I let things slip for about a year, gained 60 lbs and all but completely stopped lifting. I've lost almost all of that weight over the past 6 months, while gaining a lot of muscle. I'm 213 with 16% or close to it at the moment but I'm finding that all the running I did slimmed out my form a lot and I notice a serious drop off in my lifting, especially with bench-press and squats. I'm not looking to get huge but I want to jump back to where I was and then some while continuing to shed 5% or so body fat. Am I a viable candidate to begin a cycle? I know my reasons may sound shortsighted because I admit that I'm not at my natural potential but I just feel like I'm beginning to plateau (I work a lot and I can't dedicate for than 60-90 minutes a day to training).

In terms of diet, I am currently using a generic variety of the popular "N0Explode" (creatine, energy, arginine). I don't know if that is complimentary or even compatible with any steroids. I take a bodybuilding specific multivitamin, drink whey protein with my first 2 meals but never eat after 5 PM. I only eat about 1200-1600 cals per day of lean protein, smoothies, and green vegetables usually, starches are wheat breads, sometimes pasta/rice). I would say I do over 100g a day of protein but if I were to start a cycle, I'd probably use a diet of mainly lean grilled meat and green vegetables, complex carbs (minimal), and up protein intake to 150+g per day and up my calorie intake to 2500-3000 (gradually over the first week or 2).

Sorry for the novel, just wanted to be thorough now. Any advice is much appreciated. Thanks!

[TITANIUM]

Alright, to start off, I am 22 and currently in school. I used to play Junior A hockey and had a span of about 2 years where I trained hard. I am 6'1" and at that time I was about 210 with a 250 lb bench press max, 11% body fat. I let things slip for about a year, gained 60 lbs and all but completely stopped lifting. I've lost almost all of that weight over the past 6 months, while gaining a lot of muscle. I'm 213 with 16% or close to it at the moment but I'm finding that all the running I did slimmed out my form a lot and I notice a serious drop off in my lifting, especially with bench-press and squats. I'm not looking to get huge but I want to jump back to where I was and then some while continuing to shed 5% or so body fat. Am I a viable candidate to begin a cycle? I know my reasons may sound shortsighted because I admit that I'm not at my natural potential but I just feel like I'm beginning to plateau (I work a lot and I can't dedicate for than 60-90 minutes a day to training).

In terms of diet, I am currently using a generic variety of the popular "N0Explode" (creatine, energy, arginine). I don't know if that is complimentary or even compatible with any steroids. I take a bodybuilding specific multivitamin, drink whey protein with my first 2 meals but never eat after 5 PM. I only eat about 1200-1600 cals per day of lean protein, smoothies, and green vegetables usually, starches are wheat breads, sometimes pasta/rice). I would say I do over 100g a day of protein but if I were to start a cycle, I'd probably use a diet of mainly lean grilled meat and green vegetables, complex carbs (minimal), and up protein intake to 150+g per day and up my calorie intake to 2500-3000 (gradually over the first week or 2).

Sorry for the novel, just wanted to be thorough now. Any advice is much appreciated. Thanks!

Your to young to cycle. You should be a walking testube of natty test right now.Gear is not a logical option at this time.Good Luck.

[TheBerryhillMonster]

Not ready for it. esp without having dedication.

[BokBok]

1200-1600 calories per day? Are you sure you're alive at the moment?

[anabolictonic]

213 lbs and thats all your eating... u must have some freaky genetics... eat man eat.. you will put on mass as though you are on cycle if you up everything. 100gms protein is no where near enough for your size and not eating after 5pm is not good either... head over to the diet section dude

[Damienm05]

I do not eat 1200-1600 calories a day because I like to or because I think it's enough to get big on. It's called dieting to lose weight (50 lbs in my case in a few months). If nothing else, this should show that I am dedicated to ANY diet necessary for a cycle. In fact, when I began losing weight, to show my body who was in charge, I ate 500-800 while doing 2 hours of cardio a day for two weeks to drop 20 lbs (makes most of you cringe, I am sure). I simply wanted to provide all dietary info to make it easier to understand my body's tolerance right now. My biceps are as big as they've ever been for example but due to all that cardio and crash dieting, I feel like my core muscles really need a boost. I am ready to up that intake gradually to above 4000 if I had to (I have always eaten a lot until very recently).

Thanks for the advice so far. I concede full well that I have a ways to go before any gear but understand that it will take me some time to procure, and I will also need a few weeks to get my diet up to par. I'm not ready to start anything for another 6 weeks or so regardless of what the consensus here is. Thanks guys.

[Damienm05]

Also, what should my ideal protein intake be RIGHT now? I want to gain mass but not a lot of bulk. I have long limbs and hard, vascular muscles and I don't do super low rep workouts. My goals are physical perfection with regard to ice hockey (upper body is still important in this sport, though it's not the NFL), not bodybuilding.

[ninesecz]

you need to get all your diet and exercise areas figured out first!! The most important thing is finding out what YOUR body needs..not what a chart that has your body type on it says you need!! Dont base how many calories and how much protein you need on a chart or whatever anyone else does!! You have to learn you!! Get that down as best you can

[Damienm05]

Thanks ninesecz. I'll start mixing it up this week and seeing how I handle a more balanced diet for a bit. Right now, I'm not sure what my metabolism is capable of. Even things like when to take protein with regard to when I train are a bit up in the air.

[LickAlotOfPuss]

People on this site are going to tell you your not ready to take steroids, and you cant have that type of diet your currently on to take steroids, and in my opion is complete bs. Look kid do you know what a pct is? if you dont you should read more about this stuff before you even consider taking steroids, but your age could be fine everyone is different, people suggest you should be 25 or older before you start your first cycle witch is bullshit, there no logic behind it. but you should read more before you start juicing, but dont believe everything you read on this site, go out and experience on your own.

[Damienm05]

As far as I know, a pct, is the process of bringing your body back to normal hormonal level after a cycle via specific supplements and vitamins. I'm sure they are vastly different based on the cycle and one's goals. I also agree that people seem to be really quick to say absolutely not to steroids for anyone who isn't a 100% ideal candidate or already huge but I don't mind, since I want to be cautious at first.

[Matt]

People on this site are going to tell you your not ready to take steroids, and you cant have that type of diet your currently on to take steroids, and in my opion is complete bs. Look kid do you know what a pct is? if you dont you should read more about this stuff before you even consider taking steroids, but your age could be fine everyone is different, people suggest you should be 25 or older before you start your first cycle witch is bullshit, there no logic behind it. but you should read more before you start juicing, but dont believe everything you read on this site, go out and experience on your own.

If your going to give out advice please make sure it is correct advice..

There are many threads on this board that explain the dangers of using steroids at an early age. The op may have no issues and may recover with no problems, however he may end up having serious problems.

Just to call it bullshit because it doesnt suit you is reckless and theres no place here for that.

Seriousmass has just been banned for coming out with these kind of statements, lets learn from that..

[TITANIUM]

[QUOTE=ninesecz;4797249]you need to get all your diet and exercise areas figured out first!! The most important thing is finding out what YOUR body needs..not what a chart that has your body type on it says you need!! Dont base how many calories and how much protein you need on a chart or whatever anyone else does!! You have to learn you!! Get that down as best you can[/QUOTE


Ditto!!!

[hankdiesel]

Your diet needs a lot of work. Research how to gain quality size and practice that for the next two years. If you stay consistant with your new diet and training you will do well. Then maybe consider a cycle. Good luck man.

[Damienm05]

If your going to give out advice please make sure it is correct advice..

There are many threads on this board that explain the dangers of using steroids at an early age. The op may have no issues and may recover with no problems, however he may end up having serious problems.

Just to call it bullshit because it doesnt suit you is reckless and theres no place here for that.

Seriousmass has just been banned for coming out with these kind of statements, lets learn from that..

I appreciate the responsible nature of many posters but I am a grown man and can weed out good advice from bad. I think he may have simply phrased his thoughts bluntly but prefaced them with my needing to know more about gear as a whole first.

[hankdiesel]

People on this site are going to tell you your not ready to take steroids, and you cant have that type of diet your currently on to take steroids, and in my opion is complete bs. Look kid do you know what a pct is? if you dont you should read more about this stuff before you even consider taking steroids, but your age could be fine everyone is different, people suggest you should be 25 or older before you start your first cycle witch is bullshit, there no logic behind it. but you should read more before you start juicing, but dont believe everything you read on this site, go out and experience on your own.

Don't believe everything you read on this site. Like any of the posts written by LickAlotOfPuss

[Matt]

I appreciate the responsible nature of many posters but I am a grown man and can weed out good advice from bad. I think he may have simply phrased his thoughts bluntly but prefaced them with my needing to know more about gear as a whole first.

I understand lol, however there maybe much younger people reading this thread, they may read what he has posted and take it as fact...

[Damienm05]

Your diet needs a lot of work. Research how to gain quality size and practice that for the next two years. If you stay consistant with your new diet and training you will do well. Then maybe consider a cycle. Good luck man.

I appreciate the advice but I want people to understand, I am not a bodybuilder and that sort of time line is just not at all compatible with my life right now. I will continue to train, and eat healthy for the rest of my life but not with the emphasis on getting bigger, simply maintaining a strong, attractive form. I know it may sound like blasphemy to many members but I have no urge to be much bigger than I was 16 months ago and while I understand gear is not a magical, "you're buff now", I simply want a boost to get me where I need to be for hockey season, at which point, I will have the willpower to stay there and keep my gains. 10-15 lbs of hard muscle, ideally.

[LickAlotOfPuss]

Well what i'm trying to say everybody body is different you have to find what works for you, and how your body reacts. I agree that nobody should take steroids until they have the proper diet and are well educated in this subject, but if someone posts a thread and is asking for advice you should give ADVICE i wouldn't advise someone to say, "your too young", "your diet is not to par". Thats not advice at all, more like an insult and thats not helping anyone. Mya advice to you damienm is to do a little more research, you dont want to jump into things and f up your body. And if your looking to cut weight and gain strength there is gear out there compatible for your situation, you dont need to be on a bulk diet to take steroids. figure out BMR and go from there

[Damienm05]

According to most online calculators (dunno if they are bullshit) I should be eating 3400 calories per day based on my level of activity/training.

[jimbob21]

agreed damienm05
in 22 and just want some advice besides (your to young)

[Damienm05]

that said, disclaimer: I know the risks and also that I am not in a position to gain full benefit (max potential) from gear. I agree that these things should be taken on a case by case basis and if you're reading this as a scrawny kid who doesn't want to look weak anymore, you should not consider yourself, "in the same boat". I play a team sport at close to professional level and have been active my whole life. I am going to do this and want to do it right. Any advice on all fronts is appreciated.

[Damienm05]

that said, disclaimer: I know the risks and also that I am not in a position to gain full benefit (max potential) from gear. I agree that these things should be taken on a case by case basis and if you're reading this as a scrawny kid who doesn't want to look weak anymore, you should not consider yourself, "in the same boat". I play a team sport at close to professional level and have been active my whole life. I am going to do this and want to do it right. Any advice on all fronts is appreciated.

[ninesecz]

People on this site are going to tell you your not ready to take steroids, and you cant have that type of diet your currently on to take steroids, and in my opion is complete bs. Look kid do you know what a pct is? if you dont you should read more about this stuff before you even consider taking steroids, but your age could be fine everyone is different, people suggest you should be 25 or older before you start your first cycle witch is bullshit, there no logic behind it. but you should read more before you start juicing, but dont believe everything you read on this site, go out and experience on your own.

Please do not give anymore advice.. you are one of those people that have their own theories and just hand them out thinking everything else is BS when you are actually the one full of BS.

Scientific Fact #1: When you are between 14-23yr old, you have as high a natural test level as a 40 year old man on a low dosage cycle... FACT!!

Scientific fact #2 You have something called growth plates. these plates give you your size and shape! Doing Steroids at an early age has shown to fuse these plates earlier than normal!!

There are more facts but i am not going to bother!!
Just please do not give out anymore advice

[ninesecz]

we use the "you are too young" statement because we do not want to be responsible for a 20 year old kid screwing himself up for life from lack of knowledge and being too young... I agree that sometimes you might actually want to do them at a younger age!! There are literlaly 100,000 threads on here about beginner cycles and what to take before, during, and after them!! At a quick glance.... 375-500mg of a long acting testosterone like test e or test c is bes for a first timer... PCT will ned BOTH Clomid and Nolva to be done properly ..No Exceptions!!! Diet needs to be worked out to a "T" before even starting or they will not even do the job they should be doing.... No Need to add D-bol , Anadrol, Winstrol, Deca, Anavar, DNP, T-3, Primo, Clen, Masteron, or antthing else to this... Test alone is more than enough at these doses for a first timer.. I myself have done a few cycles here and there and I still only use one compound and maybe, maybe an oral at the beginning.. The lower the dose you use now, the better your chances for recovery and getting back to normal the quickest.. There it is in a nutshell Good Luck!!

[LickAlotOfPuss]

ok so let me get the str8 as soon as someone turns 24 his natural test levels will me your standards what if the guy is 23 ****kkkk he cant be on gear he needs to wait a year, because he is all jack up on natural natty test, but in one more year he wont be wtf??? your scientific fact is bull shit.

[Damienm05]

Thanks ninesecz. I have done a lot of research on my day off and feel ready or at least, informed. Procurement would be the next logical step and the most difficult I would assume. PMs from above posters appreciated.

[Damienm05]

Also, test-e alone sounds good at that dose based on what I'm reading. I want to be very cautious and also start light, while continuing to condition myself and burn fat. The problem I am facing is that it's hard to do that, while building muscle at a comparably fast pace. And thus, I am here! Would most users agree that I should not be looking beyond enth alone?

[bvfd253]

Please do not give anymore advice.. you are one of those people that have their own theories and just hand them out thinking everything else is BS when you are actually the one full of BS.

Scientific Fact #1: When you are between 14-23yr old, you have as high a natural test level as a 40 year old man on a low dosage cycle... FACT!!

Scientific fact #2 You have something called growth plates. these plates give you your size and shape! Doing Steroids at an early age has shown to fuse these plates earlier than normal!!

There are more facts but i am not going to bother!!
Just please do not give out anymore advice

Are you seriously calling your quoates as facts??? so basically what you are saying is everyone is the same and any and all 14-23 yr olds have the same test levels as a 40 yr old on steroids.... thats not a fact man. not everybody is the same, this is why we have doctors in this world to take each patient case by case.

about your second fact yes steroids can and will most likely stop your growth if you havent stopped growing yet but lets take my case. i reached the height of 6'5" by the age of 17 im 24 now and still 6'5" at his age of 22 I would have to imagine he has stopped growing. if he is at his max potential and has taken the time to get on this site and gear up for doing a cycle then i would say he's seriously considerin doing them, he needs to do the research and determin the facts for his individual self. what he really doesnt need is everyone knocking him and forcing him to seek real answers ealsewhere.

[G4R]

Don't start.

When I played hockey, I was pretty much the best shape of my life. I don't know if you are still playing, but get back into the routine of training and the diet... at least for another few years.

The plateau you are hitting is because of your diet and training, not a lack of supplements in your body. You need to get back into seriously training and dieting (not just to lose weight, but to gain muscle mass and strength).

Age is a factor, regardless of wether or not people want to admit it. I would love to agree with the whole "try it and find out" theory.... but why not just wait until your body is going to be more apt to accept high levels of AAS.

[Damienm05]

There's more to it. I just got out of a 4-year relationship, lost 50 lbs, bought a new wardrobe, and am currently attempting a comeback into high level hockey, as well as wanting to re-enter the single life with a bang. That's probly a lil too personal but hey, you guys are taking time out of your life to respond to me, so why not know my motivation too. I would be lying if I said part of my motivation wasn't completely and totally superficial and that I am sure there's no problem with me doing steroids. I mean come on, it's clearly not healthy. But hey, I feel the need to do something to make up for lost time, and I accept what comes with it.

[G4R]

I played in the CHL for a few years, and I don't know about now (for hockey players).... but steroids were never a thought in my head.

All I can say is this..... if you want the best results from steroids, you have to give your body its best chance at accepting and using them to your advantage. Even if you throw the age issue out the window, you still have the fact that your BF% is still a little high, and you need to drop it before you start for health reasons. What would be the point of using steroids if the entire time after you come off of your cycle you don't act or look like you have been using, and you are possible combating possible sides that can be attributed to your body not being ready for them.

No one here can stop you from using them, but we are only trying to keep you safe. I am not saying never do them, I am just saying don't use them yet. Lets find out what you can naturally do first, then you have a good base to compare results when you are ready to use AAS.

[Damienm05]

I've decided to wait; at least until I've lost the rest of extra body fat and up my calorie/protein intake, while cutting back on cardio and dedicating a full 90 minutes to upper-body weight training (my legs are as good as they're gonna get without gear, thanks to hockey). If I am not seeing an exponential increase in mass at that point, I may consider steroids once again. But my logic set in and told me, "wtf are you thinking, you are actively dieting, how can you expect to be getting big fast!?". I really appreciate the good advice, rather than telling me what I obviously wanted to hear.

[G4R]

Thats more like it. Give it some time before you alter your body in ways it is not ready to take.

Good luck and BE CAREFUL