First Cycle with Unique circumstances Please help

[First6]

First things first - Hi to all. This is my first post.
As you can see from my join date I have been reading for a while and getting a lot of questions answered that way before posting.
I have gotta say... you guys are really amazing! Talk about a wealth of information!

So I am interested in a first good cycle. But I have unique circumstances. I have naturally low (practically non-existant) test production. I have been taking shots (1ml-every 2 weeks) for about 3 years. (35 yrs old) I am in this situation because at the age of 25 I ran a cycle without knowing what I was doing. I ate wrong, worked out wrong, and ran the cycle wrong. Good times! LOL Got fat, didn't get much bigger or stronger, and started getting massive headaches from my natural test shutting down. Anyone new reading this.... Never just do what "a friend" says is okay.

Does anyone have experience with building a cycle for someone in my situation? I would appreciate any and all advice. If someone would be willing to detail an exact example cycle I would Greatly Appreciate it... I have gained alot of "know how" from reading but still have a lot of trouble trusting myself after the mishap 10 years ago.

Some info you will need to help me:
35 yrs old
5'9" & 175 lbs
b.f. is I'm gonna say "normal level" (34" waist if that helps at all to make a mental pic)
I work out lightly and regularly for the last 10 years... before that I was a total gym fly for many years. biggest problem was over working.
currently using 1ml Cyp every 2 weeks. nothing else.

Thanks to all who will respond and help. Looking forward to getting responses to my first post!

[redz]

Whats the strength of the gear you are taking every 2 weeks?

[First6]

How did I miss that??? Sorry man.. didn't know there even was different strenghs. I missed that somewhere. All I can say is I take 1ml every 2 weeks. I can look on the bottle when I get home tonight and hopefully be able to answer your question then.
Sorry.

[redz]

Not a big deal its probably 200 or 250mg/ml.

I think you would be best to go with a higher dose of test e or test c. Something like 500mg/week split into 2 injections per week. If you really wanted to you could add in some deca but a higher test dose alone should yield some nice gains.

[Subotai]

I didn't know headaches could be caused by low test production? I've been running very low (free test 211) since early highschool when I made some mistakes, and I have had a constant migrane (24/7) since then too. Maybe its not a coincidence.


What did you run to get this perminate shutdown?

[T-MOS]

Welcome

I would go with a basic cycle and make sure you do it right this time

Test beginner cycle info

[ninesecz]

I will almost gurantee your test is 200mg /ml and the Doc has you on basically 100mg a week(200mg Every other week) I know this because my Doc has me on the same exact thing for my TRT dose. And whether you have a lot of experience or just starting out.. 400-500mg a week of test cyp (what you are on now) is more than enough for beginner cycle. I saw this with confidence because from what i have found, Pharmaceutical grade gear tends to be stronger than Underground lab gear. So 400-500mg a week is a really good start. The great thing for you is that you will not need to worry about any type of "PCT" when your cycle is over because you will just continue on with your maintenance dose of 100mg a week (1cc every other week)
The only bad thing is that if your doctor decides to do blood work during the cycle, myour test levels will be through the roof!.
Other than that you should be Good 2 Go the only thing you might want to get is an Aromitase Inhibitor to combat gyno (if you are prone) and to help with excess bloat you might encounter

[First6]

I didn't know headaches could be caused by low test production? I've been running very low (free test 211) since early highschool when I made some mistakes, and I have had a constant migrane (24/7) since then too. Maybe its not a coincidence.


What did you run to get this perminate shutdown?

Sorry bro.. don't remember what I ran... Was young... didnt know anything and thought I was indestructable and it would all be okay. LOL

Yup I would say no coincidence. My first headache lasted over 9 months 24/7. Bad pain to... REAL bad. Went through a litany of tests from docs and never found a fix. Met another guy that had the same situation and said he got on gear and it fixed it.... went to my doc had levels check and they were extremely low... started the shots and headaches never came back. Doc says it is rare that headaches are a side effect but the fix is the gear. If you are still in pain I would say go to your doc Today! Best thing I ever did. (Bright side you can get your gear almost free)
Would love to get a pm from you on your progress.
Will help ANY way I can.

[Subotai]

Sorry bro.. don't remember what I ran... Was young... didnt know anything and thought I was indestructable and it would all be okay. LOL

Yup I would say no coincidence. My first headache lasted over 9 months 24/7. Bad pain to... REAL bad. Went through a litany of tests from docs and never found a fix. Met another guy that had the same situation and said he got on gear and it fixed it.... went to my doc had levels check and they were extremely low... started the shots and headaches never came back. Doc says it is rare that headaches are a side effect but the fix is the gear. If you are still in pain I would say go to your doc Today! Best thing I ever did. (Bright side you can get your gear almost free)
Would love to get a pm from you on your progress.
Will help ANY way I can.

The isssue is I'm 23 with a full beard (and almost no hair left on my head), I weigh 220 and don't look like i have low test. Any doctor who sees my levels knows whats going on and won't be super excited to perscribe me anything! They always say, "These must be off for some reason wink wink lets wait about six months until your real numbers come back" But i started taking andro 100 poppers at 13. 13! I don't think my htpa ever developed.

I hope that stuff is the answer for your issues, and mine, mine'll just be illegal

[First6]

Thanks to all so far for all the replys!
I just called the wife - it is 200mg/ml

About the below reply:

I will almost gurantee your test is 200mg /ml and the Doc has you on basically 100mg a week(200mg Every other week) I know this because my Doc has me on the same exact thing for my TRT dose. And whether you have a lot of experience or just starting out.. 400-500mg a week of test cyp (what you are on now) is more than enough for beginner cycle. I saw this with confidence because from what i have found, Pharmaceutical grade gear tends to be stronger than Underground lab gear. So 400-500mg a week is a really good start. The great thing for you is that you will not need to worry about any type of "PCT" when your cycle is over because you will just continue on with your maintenance dose of 100mg a week (1cc every other week)
The only bad thing is that if your doctor decides to do blood work during the cycle, myour test levels will be through the roof!.
Other than that you should be Good 2 Go the only thing you might want to get is an Aromitase Inhibitor to combat gyno (if you are prone) and to help with excess bloat you might encounter

That sounds ideal! using what I already have in increased dose is what I was hoping to hear. I will have to find a way to store it up so I have enough for the full cycle.
What doc... you say blood work now... "Oh yeah I forgot to tell you I slipped and fell on a fully loaded needle". Won't happen again I promise. LOL

I will look around at getting a gyno combat... from what I read I should take that very seriously... don't really want surgery.
Thanks!

[First6]

The isssue is I'm 23 with a full beard (and almost no hair left on my head), I weigh 220 and don't look like i have low test. Any doctor who sees my levels knows whats going on and won't be super excited to perscribe me anything! They always say, "These must be off for some reason wink wink lets wait about six months until your real numbers come back" But i started taking andro 100 poppers at 13. 13! I don't think my htpa ever developed.

I hope that stuff is the answer for your issues, and mine, mine'll just be illegal

Hmm. If your not running to your Doc right now I would say your pain is not in the same range my was. Thats a good thing.
I understand your prob. My doc asked no questions... jsut said sure let's try it and I have been on it ever since. Good luck!

[ninesecz]

You guys had headaches for months, years and never bothered to tell a doctor what you did or why? Man that is a Bummer

[First6]

You guys had headaches for months, years and never bothered to tell a doctor what you did or why? Man that is a Bummer

I told my first doc right away... Thought something was seriously wrong.
He said nothing he could do and told me that he would not "advertise" that again. So I didn't not knowing if I could get arrested or something.

Ahhh to be young and dumb again. LOL

[Phate]

Welcome

I would go with a basic cycle and make sure you do it right this time

Test beginner cycle info

this guide should help you plan your cycle, after you read it go ahead and ask any questions you have

what you will be doing is called blasting and cruising, basically since you are on trt(testosterone replacement therapy), you don't have to do post cycle therapy since the point of pct is to bring your natural test levels back up and you inject your test so that's pointless

with blasting and cruising you will run a cycle(like the one outlined in the above link) and afterwards just continue to inject your trt dose, then blast another cycle, and continue with trt

[First6]

this guide should help you plan your cycle, after you read it go ahead and ask any questions you have

what you will be doing is called blasting and cruising, basically since you are on trt(testosterone replacement therapy), you don't have to do post cycle therapy since the point of pct is to bring your natural test levels back up and you inject your test so that's pointless

with blasting and cruising you will run a cycle(like the one outlined in the above link) and afterwards just continue to inject your trt dose, then blast another cycle, and continue with trt

Thanks,
I have read that serveral times trying to get it all to sink in. I do have one question that I keep going back and forth on with the answer.
SERM or AI Can anyone give me more insight on why I would choose one or the other?

[Phate]

Thanks,
I have read that serveral times trying to get it all to sink in. I do have one question that I keep going back and forth on with the answer.
SERM or AI Can anyone give me more insight on why I would choose one or the other?

Selective Estrogen Receptor Modulator (SERM) Compounds that bind with estrogen receptors and exhibit estrogen action in some tissues and anti-estrogen action in other tissues. The ideal SERM would deliver all the benefits of estrogen without the adverse effects. ex: Clomiphene Citrate (Marketed as Clomid or Serophene). Tamoxifen (Marketed as Nolvadex ).

Aromatise Inhibitor (AI) Aromatase inhibitors exhibit a very different mechanism of action than SERM’s. Aromatase inhibitors prevent the conversion of androgens into estrogen in fat, muscle, breast, and brain. ex: Anastrazole (brand name Arimidex ). FEMARA (letrozole tablets).

NOTE: Clomid and Nolvadex are both anti-estrogens belonging to the same group of triphenylethylene compounds. They are structurally related and specifically classified as selective estrogen receptor modulators (SERMs) with mixed agonistic and antagonistic properties. This means that in certain tissues they can block the effects of estrogen, by altering the binding capacity of the receptor, while in others they can act as actual estrogens, activating the receptor. In men, both of these drugs act as anti-estrogens in their capacity to oppose the negative feedback of estrogens on the hypothalamus and stimulate the heightened release of GnRH (Gonadotropin Releasing Hormone). LH output by the pituitary will be increased as a result, which in turn can increase the level of testosterone by the testes.

Although these two are related anti-estrogens, they appear to act very differently at different sites of action. Nolvadex seems to be strongly anti-estrogenic at both the hypothalamus and pituitary, which is in contrast to Clomid, which although a strong anti-estrogen at the hypothalamus, seems to exhibit weak estrogenic activity at the pituitary.




but to answer your question, you won't be needing to pct if you are on trt so an AI like arimidex or aromasin would be best to control water retention on cycle

[Subotai]

You guys had headaches for months, years and never bothered to tell a doctor what you did or why? Man that is a Bummer

It happened at a somewhat close time to a cuncussion. They said I'd get headaches for a while, they just never went away. I've always assumed I had some sort of brain damage honestly. I just recently about a month ago told my doc, they assumed it was high bp which I don't have. Then assumed it was prolactin which is normal..... then she stopped thinking about it. I'm no good at pushing points with doctors. I just deal with the pain and avoid things that make it worse.

[First6]

Selective Estrogen Receptor Modulator (SERM) Compounds that bind with estrogen receptors and exhibit estrogen action in some tissues and anti-estrogen action in other tissues. The ideal SERM would deliver all the benefits of estrogen without the adverse effects. ex: Clomiphene Citrate (Marketed as Clomid or Serophene). Tamoxifen (Marketed as Nolvadex ).

Aromatise Inhibitor (AI) Aromatase inhibitors exhibit a very different mechanism of action than SERM’s. Aromatase inhibitors prevent the conversion of androgens into estrogen in fat, muscle, breast, and brain. ex: Anastrazole (brand name Arimidex ). FEMARA (letrozole tablets).

NOTE: Clomid and Nolvadex are both anti-estrogens belonging to the same group of triphenylethylene compounds. They are structurally related and specifically classified as selective estrogen receptor modulators (SERMs) with mixed agonistic and antagonistic properties. This means that in certain tissues they can block the effects of estrogen, by altering the binding capacity of the receptor, while in others they can act as actual estrogens, activating the receptor. In men, both of these drugs act as anti-estrogens in their capacity to oppose the negative feedback of estrogens on the hypothalamus and stimulate the heightened release of GnRH (Gonadotropin Releasing Hormone). LH output by the pituitary will be increased as a result, which in turn can increase the level of testosterone by the testes.

Although these two are related anti-estrogens, they appear to act very differently at different sites of action. Nolvadex seems to be strongly anti-estrogenic at both the hypothalamus and pituitary, which is in contrast to Clomid, which although a strong anti-estrogen at the hypothalamus, seems to exhibit weak estrogenic activity at the pituitary.




but to answer your question, you won't be needing to pct if you are on trt so an AI like arimidex or aromasin would be best to control water retention on cycle

LOL... wish I had a nickel for every time I wished you guys would use english! LOL You are so over my head! LOL
Okay so after reading your post several times I get that AI prevents Est and SERM allows Est but prevents the side effects of it. (do I have that right)

Still confused though... your post seems to be in agreement with this thread:"Estrogen Control, Treatment, and PCT by WARMachine" particulary the part starting with red text about prevention of gyno. BUT both your comments and the ones in that thread lead me to think that a serm is the best bet... yet at the end of your comments you recommend an AI.. Am I confused enough? lol
Please set me straight

[Phate]

LOL... wish I had a nickel for every time I wished you guys would use english! LOL You are so over my head! LOL
Okay so after reading your post several times I get that AI prevents Est and SERM allows Est but prevents the side effects of it. (do I have that right)

Still confused though... your post seems to be in agreement with this thread:"Estrogen Control, Treatment, and PCT by WARMachine" particulary the part starting with red text about prevention of gyno. BUT both your comments and the ones in that thread lead me to think that a serm is the best bet... yet at the end of your comments you recommend an AI.. Am I confused enough? lol
Please set me straight

k, i'm gonna have to give you some background

When you inject testosterone into the body you create a spike in testosterone, the body doesn't like when you quickly spike levels of any hormone so it has to find a way to decrease this spike. To do that it releases the aromatase enzyme, this enzyme binds with testosterone and converts it into estrogen, thus decrease the testosterone spike but increasing estrogen, when this happens enough you get estrogen related sides(due to the increase in estrogen) such as gyno, high blood pressure, water retention, emotional sides, etc.....

now that you know that i can explain how AIs and SERMs work

AIs(aromatase inhibitors) actually bind to the aromatase enzyme and prevent it from converting testosterone to estrogen, this is why AIs are used on cycle to reduce water retention and such, they prevent the conversion of testosterone to estrogen and thus are best to use at first sign of estrogen sides

SERMs use a different action, they bind to the estrogen receptor(not the aromatase enzyme but the actual receptor that estrogen binds too) and in men produce anti-estrogenic effects, the reason these aren't used on cycle as often as AIs is that they don't stop the conversion of testosterone to estrogen, they only prevent estrogen from binding to it's receptor site, so using these while on cycle without an AI will results in an increase in estrogen levels throughout the cycle which will hit you hard as soon as you get off the SERM because you will have a ton of estrogen floating around ready to bind to the receptors as soon as the SERM is gone


does that help? i oversimplified alot of it and made some generalizations but it's basically correct

[BG]

^^Good post !

[First6]

Phate - Got it. makes a lot of sense, totally clear now. thanks. Now I have to go find one.

BG - If I looked like you I would neve wear a shirt - ever. LOL

Guys, thanks for helping me out here. Sucks to be a newb but it takes the pressure off when there is help like this around.

[Phate]

Phate - Got it. makes a lot of sense, totally clear now. thanks. Now I have to go find one.

BG - If I looked like you I would neve wear a shirt - ever. LOL

Guys, thanks for helping me out here. Sucks to be a newb but it takes the pressure off when there is help like this around.

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