Deca...Cruising...Q's

**RuhlFreak55** · 08-26-2009, 06:04 PM

Ok so I need to bulk here....and i'm running Test E, Deca , and Drol to do it...now the issue i've run into is that the stuff to make this has been very slow in getting to my possession and now i'm in a bit of a time crunch.

My original intention was to run this for 15 weeks or there abouts. But now if i do that it will take me into December and I need to be on my cruising dose by then i think because the contest prep cycle will start like the second week in january.

So the question is.....Am i ok to run the Deca for say 10 weeks and will that still be enough time on it....(and my higher test dose for 12)....orrrrrr should i just run it 15 as planned and not worried about the smaller window cruising? Not sure what the purpose is except to give the body a bit of a break since I think receptor degradation has been proven to be a misnomer?

any help appreciated.....and I WILL compete this time goddamnit....3rd time is a charm

**Vitruvian-Man** · 08-26-2009, 06:12 PM

Well... There's a couple of things to consider with this. First off, you're correct. You're giving your body time to replenish it's receptors, so that the steroids can work effectively in the future.

That said, if it WAS ME, I would run the deca for 15 weeks. I honestly think that deca is done a complete injustice when run for 10 weeks. You only straight seeing quality gains after week 4 - 5 on it. Now here are your options, (smarter, IMO)

a.) Frontload the Deca: this does work. (I can talk to you further about it if you're interested)

b.) Run NPP in place of deca. You can run NPP for 10 weeks very successfully, with quality results. You'll see immediate results, and benefits from the deca (lubrication of the joints). You won't blow up huge like on deca.. but that's because there is not as much water retention. IMO, you could just use an oral to make up for this difference..

Hope that gives you some ideas.

**c-Z** · 08-26-2009, 06:15 PM

Deca should be ran longer.. I agree with the idea of running npp.

**RuhlFreak55** · 08-26-2009, 06:15 PM

i could def. front load it if that would be beneficial. Not enough time to get more stuff though unless there's a way to strip the esther off deca and turn it into NPP...

the question really is how long do you need on the cruise dose to replenish effectively? because if 4 weeks would get it done to an acceptable point then there's no issue and i can run the other cycle into december a couple weeks.

I may have to technically start cutting while on the 'bulking' cycle but we all know that's just diet and cardio that decides the two...

**Vitruvian-Man** · 08-26-2009, 06:22 PM

Originally Posted by RuhlFreak55

i could def. front load it if that would be beneficial. Not enough time to get more stuff though unless there's a way to strip the esther off deca and turn it into NPP...

the question really is how long do you need on the cruise dose to replenish effectively? because if 4 weeks would get it done to an acceptable point then there's no issue and i can run the other cycle into december a couple weeks.

I may have to technically start cutting while on the 'bulking' cycle but we all know that's just diet and cardio that decides the two...

Well optimally when you cruise, you should be returning to a maintenance dosage of testosterone , and staying on it for the equivalent of the time that you were "blasting" (on cycle.) For example, 10 weeks on cycle = 10 weeks @ TRT dosage.

Too bad NPP couldn't be used in this situation. It would be the perfect time.

So you're going to frontload the deca? That's a good option. I remember seeing graphs before, showing that blood concentrations of deca peak in week 3 when frontloading, opposed to week 5 - 6 normally.

What dose of deca are you planning on running the cycle at? And what dose are you going to frontload at? (are you going to use the traditional method and just double it for the first half-live of the deca ester?)

**RuhlFreak55** · 08-26-2009, 06:24 PM

grr...yea not enough time for that this go 'round.....

guess i'll frontload it yea....how would one structure that?

guess while i'm at it i could ask what a decent TRT dose is for sure...was thinking like 150 - 175 ish?

**RuhlFreak55** · 08-26-2009, 06:26 PM

I fail to see how anyone that regularly competes can follow alot of the time rules that everyone likes to elucidate....

even if you compete once a year at the same time it's very difficult to manage...much less doing a full PCT twice....

**Vitruvian-Man** · 08-26-2009, 06:26 PM

Originally Posted by RuhlFreak55

grr...yea not enough time for that this go 'round.....

guess i'll frontload it yea....how would one structure that?

guess while i'm at it i could ask what a decent TRT dose is for sure...was thinking like 150 - 175 ish?

Frontloading.. well depends.. tell me what dose you're planning on running it at like I asked!!

lol.

TRT is generally 200 - 250mg every 14 days (where I'm from at least?)... but for a bodybuilding cruising dosage.. just in mind of retaining muscle.. I'd say 200mg EW.

**RuhlFreak55** · 08-26-2009, 06:28 PM

oh...didn't see you ask that....i was planning on 600 a week for the deca

**Vitruvian-Man** · 08-26-2009, 06:28 PM

Originally Posted by RuhlFreak55

I fail to see how anyone that regularly competes can follow alot of the time rules that everyone likes to elucidate....

even if you compete once a year at the same time it's very difficult to manage...much less doing a full PCT twice....

LOL... I feel your pain. It's a sacrifice that BB's must make, when they choose to take this sport seriously. (unless you're natural, hah).

Time constraints are a b*tch. Especially with competitions at all times of the year nowadays.

My GF is only a couple of months out of her next show.

**RuhlFreak55** · 08-26-2009, 06:29 PM

i've never frontloaded before so that's why i'm unsure about it. and for some reason i didn't read the whole last paragraph of your post above....lol

**Vitruvian-Man** · 08-26-2009, 06:34 PM

Originally Posted by RuhlFreak55

oh...didn't see you ask that....i was planning on 600 a week for the deca

So I believe it would be:

Deca (week #1) @ 600mg x 2 = 1200mg
Deca (weeks 2 - 13) @ 300mg x 2 = 600mg

I know my training partner elected to use a different protocol.. and it worked very nicely.. he started seeing results after only 2 weeks or so. (not sure how stable it will keep your blood levels).

Deca (weeks 1 + 2) @ 600mg x 2 = 1200mg
Deca (weeks 3 - 13) @ 300mg x 2 = 600mg

He just front-loaded for two weeks straight. He said it was a very effective way of reaching a higher blood concentration quicker.

**RuhlFreak55** · 08-26-2009, 06:37 PM

answered while i was messing around............

**RuhlFreak55** · 08-26-2009, 06:38 PM

Originally Posted by Vitruvian-Man

So I believe it would be:

Deca (week #1) @ 600mg x 2 = 1200mg
Deca (weeks 2 - 13) @ 300mg x 2 = 600mg

I know my training partner elected to use a different protocol.. and it worked very nicely.. he started seeing results after only 2 weeks or so. (not sure how stable it will keep your blood levels).

Deca (weeks 1 + 2) @ 600mg x 2 = 1200mg
Deca (weeks 3 - 13) @ 300mg x 2 = 600mg

He just front-loaded for two weeks straight. He said it was a very effective way of reaching a higher blood concentration quicker.

did he do that with deca or was it a different compound? Only thing is i'd get worried about deca related sides perhaps? not that I have a gf anyway lol but still...

**Vitruvian-Man** · 08-26-2009, 06:38 PM

Originally Posted by RuhlFreak55

so the "active life" is 15 or 16 days for deca it seems from what i looked up....neither book says what the halflife is explicitly....

so i would just run 1200 a week for the first 7.5-8 days?

Correct.

**Vitruvian-Man** · 08-26-2009, 06:41 PM

Originally Posted by RuhlFreak55

did he do that with deca or was it a different compound? Only thing is i'd get worried about deca related sides perhaps? not that I have a gf anyway lol but still...

No. He did that with deca actually. I've only front-loaded with test before.

I would not really worry about sides from deca. I've run NPP @ 725mg EW for 10 weeks, and didn't get any prolactin sides.

However, if you're nervous, it could be smart to get caber or bromo, and run it from the whole time that you stay on deca.

Running a nice dose of proviron too, while on the 19-nor (@ 75 - 100mg) I find is VERRRY beneficial for libido.

**RuhlFreak55** · 08-26-2009, 06:42 PM

hmmm i may just frontload it two weeks then....not like i have a short supply of it lol

**Vitruvian-Man** · 08-26-2009, 07:00 PM

Originally Posted by RuhlFreak55

hmmm i may just frontload it two weeks then....not like i have a short supply of it lol

It's worth a shot. It may mean determine the time you have left to return to your cruising dose. I would definitely consider the potential rewards to be greater then the cost (sides, etc.)

PM me once you've figured it out though, alright?

**wukillabee** · 08-26-2009, 08:52 PM

Originally Posted by RuhlFreak55

Ok so I need to bulk here....and i'm running Test E, Deca , and Drol to do it...now the issue i've run into is that the stuff to make this has been very slow in getting to my possession and now i'm in a bit of a time crunch.

My original intention was to run this for 15 weeks or there abouts. But now if i do that it will take me into December and I need to be on my cruising dose by then i think because the contest prep cycle will start like the second week in january.

So the question is.....Am i ok to run the Deca for say 10 weeks and will that still be enough time on it....(and my higher test dose for 12)....orrrrrr should i just run it 15 as planned and not worried about the smaller window cruising? Not sure what the purpose is except to give the body a bit of a break since I think receptor degradation has been proven to be a misnomer?

any help appreciated.....and I WILL compete this time goddamnit....3rd time is a charm

I have no personal exp in this situation but if i were u, id say fu@k it and run it 15 weeks with just a shorter cruise time. Whats the worst that could happen, u get bigger and stronger?

**wukillabee** · 08-26-2009, 09:03 PM

Originally Posted by RuhlFreak55

I fail to see how anyone that regularly competes can follow alot of the time rules that everyone likes to elucidate....

even if you compete once a year at the same time it's very difficult to manage...much less doing a full PCT twice....

Exactly! I know this board is probably one of the most conservative as far as cycles go and protocols. Im sure in a perfect world its time on+pct=time off so thats what, 2 cycles a year if you're lucky? Not realistic for anyone who competes or takes things seriously imo. I mean thats great protocol for the newbs who want a cute little beach body for the summer and could care less about bbing but i think the majority on this board are not newbs.