How to set up Cycle with Prop and EQ?

**animal instinct** · 12-25-2002, 11:31 PM

I am new to AS ( have been lifting since 95' though) and I was wondering if Prop was OK for a newbie to take, I have searched and the only reason it seems not to be suggested for inexperienced users of AS is because of the frequent injections.....is that the only reason? I want to shoot it EOD, not ED, and mix it with my EQ, which is Ganabol 50mg. Could someone suggest how many cc's of the EQ/Prop I should shoot EOD. Thanks for your help....and before the posts come suggesting I get 200mg QV or TT please note that I already invested in the Ganabol before I found a source for QV so I am stuck with the Ganabol.....but I am trying to make the most of it by mixing it with Prop.

**LAWNSAVER** · 12-26-2002, 12:58 AM

Assuming the prop is 100mg/cc, I would do this as a first cycle:

Week 3 to 10:100mg prop EOD
Week 1 to 10:100mg Ganabol EOD
Week 1 to 15: 50mg of proviron ED
WeeK 13 to 15: Clomid therapy: 300mg day 1, 100mg next 10, 50mg final 10.

Keep your diet high in protien and you should be very pleased.

**animal instinct** · 12-29-2002, 11:47 AM

Thanks for your reply Lawnsaver. I failed to mentionin my first post that I am also taking Winny Tabs, so do you think the Prov is still neccesary?

**babi** · 12-29-2002, 12:52 PM

hey bud trade the eq for a higher strength one.or else poking will be a full time job for you.prop is great stuff for newbies and yes the only reason they dont advice it to newbies is b/c of frequent injections

**MDMA** · 12-29-2002, 01:05 PM

Im on a prop/eq cycle right now. Looks like this:

Week 1-2: 200mg Prop ED / 600mg EQ
Week 2-12: 100mg Prop EOD / 500mg EQ

Prop and EQ is a killer combo bro - I'm lovin it.

**RON** · 12-29-2002, 01:32 PM

I'm gonna disagree with everyone here. IMO prop is not a good choice at all for a beginner. To use Prop properly it requires an ed shot. At the very least eod. I would use a longer ester test and shoot twice a week for you first run or two. Also a 200 mg/ml eq. Keep it simple you first couple times then get in to these pin cushion cycles.

BTW if you gonna use the Ganabol no matter what, shoot the prop 100mg eod with it. But don't say I didn't warn you.

**animal instinct** · 12-29-2002, 05:01 PM

Originally posted by RON
I'm gonna disagree with everyone here. IMO prop is not a good choice at all for a beginner. To use Prop properly it requires an ed shot. At the very least eod. I would use a longer ester test and shoot twice a week for you first run or two. Also a 200 mg/ml eq. Keep it simple you first couple times then get in to these pin cushion cycles.

BTW if you gonna use the Ganabol no matter what, shoot the prop 100mg eod with it. But don't say I didn't warn you.

Thanks for your advice Ron, could you please elaborate on why you don't think Prop should be used in someone's first cycle. Is it just because of the frequent injections? I want to cut more than bulk, looking for lean gains that will harden me and that I will be able to keep, I am already 200 lbs and stand 6'2" and I am not looking to really gain mass/weight...just lean muscle mass. Am I wrong in thinking that the Prop is the best type of Test for what my goals are? BTW, I sent you a PM if you would rather get back to me that way. Thanks.

**Warrior** · 12-29-2002, 07:44 PM

LAWNSAVER outlined a good stack. You just have to be comfortable with the injections and be sure you can adhere to the every other day. Which for some - it looks good on paper but when in comes to T time they miss scheduled shots... I guess... plus you need to be able to rotate injection sites because of the volume of oil...

One thing with LAWNSAVER's cycle is it won't be one pin. The Prop and Eq would be a 4cc injection (pins hold 3cc). So now you are looking at two injects per day - or you could alternate everyday. Something to consider.

Personally, I find taking a shot in the morning after a shower pretty easy.

**Warrior** · 12-29-2002, 07:47 PM

Prop with Proviron equals minimal bloat. And Prop is easier to back down the dose if sides become an issue. Blood levels are easier to control - which is one way Prop is good for beginners trying to find their effective Testosterone dose with minimal sides.

**animal instinct** · 12-29-2002, 08:58 PM

Warrior,

Thanks for the posts...so what you are saying is the Proviron administered IM would force me to take two pins EOD..right? Because the Prop/EQ would only equal 3cc's (2cc's of EQ and 1cc of Prop). So in theory could I just take Proviron orally and only have to take 1 shot EOD, right?

**Warrior** · 12-29-2002, 09:11 PM

I was figuring 100mg of Prop = 2mL, but you may have something different. If you have 100mg/mL then you would be good to go with one 3mL shot EOD.

Proviron is an oral - normally 25mg per tab... so you would take two tabs per day.

**animal instinct** · 12-29-2002, 09:19 PM

The Prop is 100mg/ml....also, I just read Big Cat's article on Proviron and he explains that Proviron is not really that toxic to the liver, but I will be taking Winny for the last 6 weeks of my cycle. What are your feelings about taking the two orals together?

**Warrior** · 12-29-2002, 09:40 PM

Proviron is not c17 alkyalted, so it is pretty safe to the liver. I don't see a problem taking the two orals together. I don't think you need it though... I keep looking at the cycle and trying to figure the best wat to add it... in the beggining (before the Equipoise kicks in, stacked with Prop, and hopefully add some quality gains the first few weeks and drop water later with the Proviron)... or the end (help make the transition out of the cycle, help solidfy gains)... but you have a pretty good cycle without it. I am leaning toward using the Winny in the beginning and switch to Proviron for the end... for the reason's above plus Proviron has some androgenic ability in itself...

Week 1 to 10:100mg prop EOD
Week 1 to 10:100mg Ganabol EOD
Week 1 to 4: 50mg of Winstrol ED
Week 5 to 15: 50mg of proviron ED
WeeK 13 to 15: Clomid therapy: 300mg day 1, 100mg next 10, 50mg final 10.

**Warrior** · 12-29-2002, 09:44 PM

I am going to go with LAWNSAVER 's origninal cycle and bank the winny for later.

**animal instinct** · 12-29-2002, 09:54 PM

I like that set-up...thanks for taking the time to actually put some thought into that, I really appreciate it. The only question I have is I thought I read that you should not take Proviron without running AS and with the Prop leaving my system 2-3 days after my last shot should I really take the Proviron 5 weeks after my last Prop injection? Are you counting on the EQ staying in my system that long after my last shot?

**animal instinct** · 12-29-2002, 09:57 PM

Originally posted by Warrior
I am going to go with LAWNSAVER 's origninal cycle and bank the winny for later.

That is a tough pill to swallow, or chew...lol I do have 100 tabs so I will probaly use half of the Winny I have in this cycle and half in my next one.

**Warrior** · 12-30-2002, 12:39 AM

Originally posted by animal instinct
I like that set-up...thanks for taking the time to actually put some thought into that, I really appreciate it. The only question I have is I thought I read that you should not take Proviron without running AS and with the Prop leaving my system 2-3 days after my last shot should I really take the Proviron 5 weeks after my last Prop injection? Are you counting on the EQ staying in my system that long after my last shot?

Many like Proviron post cycle - it an anti-e that exerts androgenic ability >50mg/day. But I could see stopping the Proviron at week 13 and finishing with just Clomid for that same reason.

And yes, you should wait at least 3 weeks for the Equipoise (Boldenone Undecanoate) to clear. It's ester is pretty long, longer than Deca 's decanoate. And you don't want to begin post cycle therapy with androgens still releasing into your system - it would make it less effective at getting you back to normal endogenous levels.

I am going to say stop the Proviron at Week 13 and begin Clomid on its own.

Also - I'll still say do without the Winstrol especially since you have the ** stuff. You may want the extras for next time, I will be running ** Winstrol too, and plan on upping to 75 then 100mg ED after the first week at 50mg... they have a rep for being under dosed. So you may still want to save them incase you want to play with the dose your next cycle. IMO.

**RON** · 12-30-2002, 07:00 AM

Originally posted by animal instinct

Thanks for your advice Ron, could you please elaborate on why you don't think Prop should be used in someone's first cycle. Is it just because of the frequent injections? I want to cut more than bulk, looking for lean gains that will harden me and that I will be able to keep, I am already 200 lbs and stand 6'2" and I am not looking to really gain mass/weight...just lean muscle mass. Am I wrong in thinking that the Prop is the best type of Test for what my goals are? BTW, I sent you a PM if you would rather get back to me that way. Thanks.

I got your PM and you have one back. The ed injections might not be a problem but your not gonna know till its too late. Chances are that they will drive you crazy Don't say I didn't warn ya.