If you sit on your ass and just juice will you gain LBM?

**Dancer** · 08-29-2009, 02:32 PM

Well for years most vets here and all over the net have said it majority diet/lifting/sleep.

But, the public perception is that if you just juice you are gonna look like Arnold's 1982 Mr. O poster.

Most think that regardless of your life style and let me just express IMHO many adults here especially in the US are stuck in a wasting like disorder. Were they go through the years and gain fat and loss muscle.

So lets just posse the question can you just pop some 'roids' sit on your ass/ eat more and gain LBM?

so lets take the look at your ultimate sit on your ass study:

http://www.pubmedcentral.nih.gov/art...rtype=abstract

Forty-one patients were enrolled between January 1, 2001, and June 15, 2003, 18 received oxandrolone (10 mg po BID) and 23 received a placebo. Groups were comparable for age, gender, injury severity score, and APACHE II score. The majority were trauma patients (83%), and 90% received enteral feeding. The oxandrolone group received higher caloric and protein intake before enrollment, but these differences were not significant. Contrary to our hypothesis, patients receiving oxandrolone spent significantly longer time on the ventilator than the placebo group (mean 21.7 days vs. 16.4 days, P = 0.03). There was no difference in infectious complications, acute respiratory distress syndrome, or multiple organ failure scores. Patients receiving oxandrolone had a longer intensive care unit stay but no difference in total hospital stay.

So the ultimate laid up scenario, There was not a gain in muscle function. In fact, there was no difference in total hospital stay for those patient. Even looking at higher protein and caloric intake.

**ninesecz** · 08-29-2009, 02:46 PM

loks like it almost had a detrimental effect

**gymnerd** · 08-29-2009, 03:09 PM

IMO if it were that easy I wouldnt even bother with it I would find a different challenge.

**energizer bunny** · 08-29-2009, 03:20 PM

i know a lot of peeps who take steroids ....rec drugs...drink every weekend....no real diet.......but they obviously train....and they look pretty good.......im not saying this is right im just pointing out that some people do this.......

**JiGGaMaN** · 08-29-2009, 03:56 PM

what did the title have to do with the article?

**bermyshotta** · 08-29-2009, 07:04 PM

Originally Posted by JiGGaMaN

what did the title have to do with the article?

read it again.interesting ,defies public opinion.

**JiGGaMaN** · 08-29-2009, 07:08 PM

Originally Posted by bermyshotta

read it again.interesting ,defies public opinion.

i did and there was no reference to LBM

**jasperhup** · 08-29-2009, 07:52 PM

Originally Posted by JiGGaMaN

i did and there was no reference to LBM

+1

i've actually heard that in at least some studies, the no exercise gear group out gained the no gear exercise group!

**Dancer** · 08-29-2009, 08:44 PM

Originally Posted by JiGGaMaN

i did and there was no reference to LBM

It does not state LBM, I should have written the title better but ahhhhhh...

**gymnerd** · 08-29-2009, 08:47 PM

It is a bit misleading.

**Dancer** · 08-29-2009, 09:41 PM

Over all muscle strenght or over muscle function...

LBM is not on point.

**JiGGaMaN** · 08-29-2009, 09:51 PM

the article has nothing to do with lean mass or anavars muscle building effects...

**Dancer** · 08-29-2009, 10:11 PM

/\ Not true...

Ventilator dependentance in contengent on weakness... Over all of one's muscle function improves then there is no need for the ventilator...

LBM perhaps is not the right term... buttttttttttttt the point still stands

**Vitruvian-Man** · 08-29-2009, 10:28 PM

Originally Posted by Dancer

LBM perhaps is not the right term... buttttttttttttt the point still stands

The point still stands?

All you've "proven" is that if you take a low dose of anavar , (while you recover from significant trauma, which most likely caused extreme bodily injury) and do literally nothing (and I mean nothing), you will make no significant gains...

Originally Posted by Dancer

Groups were comparable for age, gender, injury severity score, and APACHE II score. The majority were trauma patients (83%), and 90% received enteral feeding.

But how does that apply to any situation? Yes - people believe steroids are a "miracle drug...." but steroid users are also the smartest demographic of drug users on Earth... most realize that they have to alter their diet, and actually train somewhat to see noticeable gains..

The logic is pretty flawed, because I can show you links to similar studies (also done on medically challenged individuals -- I believe they had muscle wasting disorders) where they take anadrol , and gain significant mass, without much alteration of exercise levels, etc.

IMO you're just trying to perpetuate bullsh*t..

And I'm sorry if this comes off harsh... I just don't understand how the correlation applies here! And don't really think it's a just.. "assumption" (I guess I'd call it).. to make.

**Dancer** · 08-29-2009, 10:50 PM

Originally Posted by Vitruvian-Man

The point still stands?

All you've "proven" is that if you take a low dose of anavar , (while you recover from significant trauma, which most likely caused extreme bodily injury) and do literally nothing (and I mean nothing), you will make no significant gains...

But how does that apply to any situation? Yes - people believe steroids are a "miracle drug...." but steroid users are also the smartest demographic of drug users on Earth off point I did not at any point addy this... most realize that they have to alter their diet, and actually train somewhat to see noticeable gains..

The logic is pretty flawed, because I can show you links to similar studies (also done on medically challenged individuals -- I believe they had muscle wasting disorders) where they take anadrol , and gain significant mass, without much alteration of exercise levels, etc.

IMO you're just trying to perpetuate bullsh*t..

And I'm sorry if this comes off harsh... I just don't understand how the correlation applies here! And don't really think it's a just.. "assumption" (I guess I'd call it).. to make.

Most do believe "they are miracle drugs"... and they are not

The point is if you litterally do nothing and even put your caloric intake and protien intake you are no better off.

And, actually I like to see some other studies in a controlled enviroment where as the patient did "nothing" and gained a benefit.

The point was make in the OP.

**Tjohn6231** · 08-29-2009, 11:16 PM

Not to hijack this thread, but a chic that I used to bang "on the side" saw me a few months ago, and I mentioned that I was starting to use test. Anyway, I saw her again a week ago, and she immediately told me how big Ive become, and I had slimmed down a lot.
Her exact words were....."You look great, but you cheated"
WTF???? In her mind....she probably thinks that I sat on the fvckin couch injecting test while eating honey buns, and chocolate milk all day.
I hate people like that. Just because someone uses a little gear, doesnt give them a free pass to the perfect body.

**sizerp** · 08-30-2009, 12:08 AM

Originally Posted by Tjohn6231

Not to hijack this thread, but a chic that I used to bang "on the side" saw me a few months ago, and I mentioned that I was starting to use test. Anyway, I saw her again a week ago, and she immediately told me how big Ive become, and I had slimmed down a lot.
Her exact words were....."You look great, but you cheated"
WTF???? In her mind....she probably thinks that I sat on the fvckin couch injecting test while eating honey buns, and chocolate milk all day.
I hate people like that. Just because someone uses a little gear, doesnt give them a free pass to the perfect body.

You are preaching to the quior.

In regards to this study. I suggest clicking the link and reading the whole thing.

Method:
"We conducted a randomized, double-blind, placebo-controlled trial of oxandrolone therapy for surgical/trauma patients requiring >7 days of ventilation. The primary end point was time on the ventilator."

Conclusion:
"Ventilator-dependent surgical patients receiving oxandrolone had a more prolonged course of mechanical ventilation, suggesting that oxandrolone may be detrimental in this circumstance. Oxandrolone may enhance collagen deposition and fibrosis in the later stages of acute respiratory distress syndrome and thus prolong recovery."

Yes, assuming we're all farmiliar with Anavar effects...

Background:
"Multisystem injury and major surgical stress result in a hypermetabolic state with accelerated breakdown of protein stores. Loss of lean muscle mass impairs wound healing, increases infection rates, and weakens respiratory musculature. Oxandrolone is an anabolic steroid that attenuates loss of lean body mass and improves wound healing in burn patients. We hypothesized that oxandrolone would improve outcome for ventilator-dependent surgical patients."

So basically, they were wrong in their guess. Interesting to say the least. Regardless, sitting on the couch and injecting steroids with a slight caloric uptake increase is WAY different than being a ventilator-dependent surgical patient.

I think it's kinda irrelevent to anything, if not still interesting, we know what NOT to feed through grandpa's tubes.

**MuscleScience** · 08-30-2009, 02:20 AM

I get what your point is, this was not a very good choice as far as evidence towards your argument. It would have been much better to have found a review article to bolster your argument.

And who ever said the word proven above, needs to be shot. You can't say the word prove in science dammit....lol
well maybe not shot but sat in the naughty seat none the less....hehehe

**premedreject** · 08-30-2009, 02:30 AM

Originally Posted by Tjohn6231

Not to hijack this thread, but a chic that I used to bang "on the side" saw me a few months ago, and I mentioned that I was starting to use test. Anyway, I saw her again a week ago, and she immediately told me how big Ive become, and I had slimmed down a lot.
Her exact words were....."You look great, but you cheated"
WTF???? In her mind....she probably thinks that I sat on the fvckin couch injecting test while eating honey buns, and chocolate milk all day.
I hate people like that. Just because someone uses a little gear, doesnt give them a free pass to the perfect body.

and after she said you cheated, she wanted to bang you 10x more.

**MuscleScience** · 08-30-2009, 03:04 AM

Originally Posted by Tjohn6231

Not to hijack this thread, but a chic that I used to bang "on the side" saw me a few months ago, and I mentioned that I was starting to use test. Anyway, I saw her again a week ago, and she immediately told me how big Ive become, and I had slimmed down a lot.
Her exact words were....."You look great, but you cheated"
WTF???? In her mind....she probably thinks that I sat on the fvckin couch injecting test while eating honey buns, and chocolate milk all day.
I hate people like that. Just because someone uses a little gear, doesnt give them a free pass to the perfect body.

Moral of the story, keep that you use AAS to yourself. The average person does not understand what it takes as far as diet and exercise let alone steroids .