Downside to Var & Tbol Cyc

[New2Anabolic]

Gear: 100mg Var pd & 80mg Oral Tbol (Not 100% on the mg dosage)

Goals: Maintain muscle gains while helping keep weight down with solid diet & cardio and var with it's helpful The only reason I'm interested in this, is to keep hair loss risk to a MINIMUM!

Now, I've never done an oral only cycle before so I'm not sure the length of time I can run it. I'm not really a drinker, so my liver will be balanced with supplements.


~~~~~~~~~~~~
-Test E / Cyp
-Var
-Tbol
-Clen
..in my cycle history

[Researcher]

Do you have a question?

[New2Anabolic]

YEah, I guess I expected you to read my mind - apologies.

Q:
Downside to using those as my cycle? Not pinning, that is. (Or is this fine/feasible)
Suggestions of duration of the cycle?
Maybe some experiences with people who may have tried this before.

[spywizard]

you mean other than the crazy back pumps you will get... cholesterol in the 300 range and killing your liver?? and testicular atrophy (mine got so small during sex they could suck back inside my body TMI I know)

NAW, you'll get crazy strength gains

[New2Anabolic]

1. Haven't heard the term back pumps before?
2. Also, Var is said to go easy on the liver.
http://www.steroid.com/Anavar.php
Although Anavar is an oral steroid, and has been alpha-alkylated to survive oral ingestion and the first pass through the liver, it´s still relatively mild in that respect too..., the unique chemical configuration of oxandrolone both confers a resistance to liver metabolism as well as noticable anabolic activity. It would also appear that Anavar appears not to exhibit the serious hepatotoxic effects (jaundice, cholestatic hepatitis, peliosis hepatis, hyperplasias and neoplasms) typically attributed to the C17alpha-alkylated AASs. (17) Anavar has even been used successfully in some studies to heal cutaneous wounds (7), or to improve respiratory function (18). Both of these novel properties could make it a good choice for in-season use for boxers, Mixed Martial Arts competitors, and other such athletes.
3. I also thought that Tbol wasn't too harsh on the liver either? Could have been a faulty assumption though.
Could you shed any light on the toxicity? This is also why I'm asking for a suitable length of cycle. Or people that have run orals only.

I've also lost my nuts before running Tren and dbol. (atrophy)

[Researcher]

Orals should be run as short as possible. I wouldn't go more than 6-8 weeks with Anavar. Some others may, that's just me.

[Vitruvian-Man]

good cycle for an oral only. I like the dosages. You'll get cut up on that stack. Var @ 100mg = sweet point IMO.

I would run it for 8 weeks personally.

Use some HCG weeks 1 - 8 @ 500iu every 5th day - that will prevent any atrophy.

Don't drink. Run liv52 before and during the cycle, and milk thistle. Should be a good run. Best of luck.

[New2Anabolic]

To double check;
Will 8 weeks measure up to about 4 weeks of gains? (As you start seeing results around week 4)
Also, a [my] liver should be able to handle these two orals, correct?

[chuckt12345]

To double check;
Will 8 weeks measure up to about 4 weeks of gains? (As you start seeing results around week 4)
Also, a [my] liver should be able to handle these two orals, correct?

i would say youll feel the orals within a few weeks

[chuckt12345]

you mean other than the crazy back pumps you will get... cholesterol in the 300 range and killing your liver?? and testicular atrophy (mine got so small during sex they could suck back inside my body TMI I know)

NAW, you'll get crazy strength gains

lol,, that shit happens to me all the time on cycles

[spywizard]

"back pumps"

think of it this way.. you are doing a low row, or jumping in a sport, or running, and your lower back starts to tighten up, then the next thing you know you are laying on the floor trying to stretch your back out because you are so "tight" (back pump) you can't turn your trunk (torso) ..

Or you have to stop eating because the muscles in your jaw are "pumped" or tightened to the point that it becomes very tight..

that's a back pump.. at 100mg var per day i believe about day 3-4 you'll become very familiar with the term..

[New2Anabolic]

Oh okay, yeah the jaw locking up is what I usually used to get.
Methods to avoid this? Taurine is it?

[BJJ]

1. Haven't heard the term back pumps before?
2. Also, Var is said to go easy on the liver.
http://www.steroid.com/Anavar.php
Although Anavar is an oral steroid, and has been alpha-alkylated to survive oral ingestion and the first pass through the liver, it´s still relatively mild in that respect too..., the unique chemical configuration of oxandrolone both confers a resistance to liver metabolism as well as noticable anabolic activity. It would also appear that Anavar appears not to exhibit the serious hepatotoxic effects (jaundice, cholestatic hepatitis, peliosis hepatis, hyperplasias and neoplasms) typically attributed to the C17alpha-alkylated AASs. (17) Anavar has even been used successfully in some studies to heal cutaneous wounds (7), or to improve respiratory function (18). Both of these novel properties could make it a good choice for in-season use for boxers, Mixed Martial Arts competitors, and other such athletes.
3. I also thought that Tbol wasn't too harsh on the liver either? Could have been a faulty assumption though.
Could you shed any light on the toxicity? This is also why I'm asking for a suitable length of cycle. Or people that have run orals only.

I've also lost my nuts before running Tren and dbol. (atrophy)

Easy on the liver?
Compared to other orals I guess...
Look what did to me in 8 weeks at 63 mg ed averaged:
http://forums.steroid.com/showthread.php?t=403234

I would not go over 80 mg ed.

[New2Anabolic]

You looked jacked [lean] in week one.
I'll keep reading thru the pages though

[BJJ]

You looked jacked [lean] in week one.
I'll keep reading thru the pages though

If you mean mi pic, that was shot before the cycle in July or August, I do not remember exactly.

You do not need to read through the whole of the pages, just check the last one with the entire cycle and pct in one post.

[New2Anabolic]

Definitely cannot aff0rd nor can dedicate myself to using:
Multi Vitamins/Minerals 1 tb, Vitamin C/Ester 3 gr, EFA complex 6 gr, ALA 600 mg, LIV.52 2 tabs, CLA 4 gr, ZMA, Tribulus Terrestris 3 gr, Chromium Picolinate 400 mcg, Acetyl L-Carnitine 600 mg, Coenzyme Q10, Glutamine 35 gr, BCAA 20 gr, MT Gakic Hardcore 8 tbs (only before w/o), UN Animal Flex 1 pckt.

Hope the cycle won't mutilate me without such an indepth arsenal of supplements.

[BJJ]

Definitely cannot aff0rd nor can dedicate myself to using:
Multi Vitamins/Minerals 1 tb, Vitamin C/Ester 3 gr, EFA complex 6 gr, ALA 600 mg, LIV.52 2 tabs, CLA 4 gr, ZMA, Tribulus Terrestris 3 gr, Chromium Picolinate 400 mcg, Acetyl L-Carnitine 600 mg, Coenzyme Q10, Glutamine 35 gr, BCAA 20 gr, MT Gakic Hardcore 8 tbs (only before w/o), UN Animal Flex 1 pckt.

Hope the cycle won't mutilate me without such an indepth arsenal of supplements.

Well, at least care about your blood and liver, so do not avoid taking EFA and LIV.52
Also, at least simple vitamin C is a must during one's PCT.

Just my 2 cents...

[New2Anabolic]

I would be using Tbol & Var for the very opposite reason of your cycle.
Not bulking, definitely not.

That being said (thank you for your thread!) ...

What would be your suggestion(s) for running the cycle?
(Or to be more direct
1. Length of cycle?
2. Time to begin taking supplements? (Liver protection & vit C that is)?
3. Suggested PCT?

[BJJ]

I would be using Tbol & Var for the very opposite reason of your cycle.
Not bulking, definitely not.

That being said (thank you for your thread!) ...

What would be your suggestion(s) for running the cycle?
(Or to be more direct
1. Length of cycle?
2. Time to begin taking supplements? (Liver protection & vit C that is)?
3. Suggested PCT?

I really would like to help you deeply but my only experience so far is with Oxandrolone.
I can tell you though, I added mesterolone during my cycle and I figured out it helped me not to shut down my LH and FSH values, which were in the normal range during my entire cycle. This helped me later on my pct since I had a really easy one. The only reason I added clomiphene citrate is to try having, after the cycle, my test values higher than before the cycle. If I succeeded or not will depends from the new blood work I am going to take by the end of this month.

Said that, I can advise you so:
1. 6 Weeks on var because I noticed after that my strength stopped growing further and no LBM improvement. I would not go over 80 mg ed.

2. From the beginning, day 1. Also, var will cause you not to want eating much the first week at least, so I advise you to use an appetite stimulating for that period of time.
You have the list I made for the supplements, try not to forget EFA also and if you can ALA and if you can afford it use vitamin C/ester.

3. I did nolva 20/20/20 and clomid 50/50 but clomid for me was not necessary. The best thing you can do is to have a blood work before your cycle and 1 week prior the end of it. So, you can compare the values of LH, FSH, DHT... as well as the others (there is a list on my thread) and choose the best PCT for your situation.

My advice is: do not be superficial.

[New2Anabolic]

I plan on taking Essential Fatty Acids, Vitamin/Ester C & Milk Thistle (rather than liv.52)
-- thoughts?

Nolva is always my PCT, I may throw in Clomid, but that is only an "if", & not a guarantee!

Superficial? I think I may be a bit superficial, in using gear

8 weeks for Var as well, so as to keep the strength up & weight down, as best it can.
unless sides are too tough. But it sounds as though I should be taking 100mg, at 205pds 14%bf.

Not 100% on the Tbol mg. Hope someone has some info for me.

[laveycraft]

i never got back pumps but my arms and shoulders did get really pumped. testys stayed same only pro was near the end my skin was turning yellow at 6 weeks then stopped little early at 7 weeks all is good now.

[BJJ]

I plan on taking Essential Fatty Acids, Vitamin/Ester C & Milk Thistle (rather than liv.52)
-- thoughts?

Nolva is always my PCT, I may throw in Clomid, but that is only an "if", & not a guarantee!

Superficial? I think I may be a bit superficial, in using gear

8 weeks for Var as well, so as to keep the strength up & weight down, as best it can.
unless sides are too tough. But it sounds as though I should be taking 100mg, at 205pds 14%bf.

Not 100% on the Tbol mg. Hope someone has some info for me.

Regarding your supplements, if you cannot do better that, I believe it is better than nothing.

Good Luck

[New2Anabolic]

Is there anything besides those three, that you would deem essential?

[New2Anabolic]

i never got back pumps but my arms and shoulders did get really pumped. testys stayed same only pro was near the end my skin was turning yellow at 6 weeks then stopped little early at 7 weeks all is good now.

What did you run?
And is are there ways to prevent the yellow skin? Was it very noticeable as well?

[fig]

Probably the safest cycle possible for your follicles. If you remember, send me a PM when you're done. I'm curious to see how much you gain on orals only.

[New2Anabolic]

Worried now about jaundice! Let's say that happened, what are treatment options (besides, of course, visiting my Doc)

[BJJ]

Is there anything besides those three, that you would deem essential?

ALA

What did you run?
And is are there ways to prevent the yellow skin? Was it very noticeable as well?

I got it too but only some spots for a couple of days in the first days.
It is a common side effect which goes away as soon as one's organism gets used to the drug.

[New2Anabolic]

Alpha Lipoic acid is a great antioxidant in its power to remove free radicals, but is there another reason for its being necessitated in an oral only cycle?

[elpropiotorvic]

i use it and i dont cycle, because it is so good for you,


a question for the experts = why testicular athrophy from this cycle ?

[New2Anabolic]

Tbol & Var for a cutting/strength cycle.
*Hair Safe*
It seems that there is a lot to worry about Oral only, and understandably that should be auto-assumed even while using the most liver friendly gear.

With that being said, I think 6 weeks will be the length of cycle I will be using, while running it alongside Vitamin C, EFA & ALA to ensure my body will be happy.
Nolva & possibly Clomid to seal off the deal PCT wise.

If you have any opinions on that, please feel free to let me know!
As I am still unsure. haha.

[laveycraft]

i ran 60 ed 30 morning 30 dinner time, yellow skin went away, also should of been drinken more water my fault.... i just ran var and had protein shakes, and multi vitamin.