Lean Bulk Cycle (Test/Tren/Winny)

**TopOfTheLine** · 09-21-2010, 10:18 PM

Hey guys, I've been a lurker on these forums for about 2 years. Finally registered to get a little input because I'm bumping doses to a level I'm a little unsure about. Before I get into it, I will admit I got into AAS too early. My personal trainer introduced them to me and I made the uneducated choice to start taking them. This place was my saving grace because he had me doing completely inadequate post cycles.

..... Background Info .....

Age: 25
Height: 5'10
Weight: 183 lbs (Started from 145 lbs and I have to fight to hold every pound.)
BF: 11% - 12% (I think...Pic below)
Training: 4 years (2 serious. It's now a lifestyle.)

..... Previous Cycles .....

Test E - 10 Weeks
Drol - Test E - Deca - 12 Weeks
Dbol - Test P - Tren A - 8 Weeks (100mg EOD Tren/Test)

..... Routine .....

30 - 60 min cardio - Legs - Abs
60 min cardio - Chest - Abs
OFF
60 min cardio - Back
60 min cardio - Shoulders - Abs
60 min cardio - Arms - Abs
OFF

..... Diet .....

High Protein/Low Carb/Low Fat
NO cheat days
NO soda
NO fastfood

..... Rough Game Plan .....

I would like to take HGH to hopefully to hold more gains post cycle. I plan to run it for 6 months. I want this to be my last cycle. My gf is not at all on-board with steriods /peptides. With that said, I have taken Tren /Prop before at 100mg EOD. I handled the sides very well. Only thing I really noticed was sweating during sex/workouts and insomnia. Pinning ED is not a problem for me although I may need to branch out from glutes only. I do not want to get huge, just more defined and I need that freakin chest to grow.

..... Questions I have .....

Will 100mg ED of Tren benefit me any more than 50 - 75mg ED considering my size/cycle experience?
Should you run more/less Test than Tren?
Is it too hard on my liver to be using 2 toxic orals in the same cycle even with a 6 week break between them?
Would it be best to wait about 2 months into HGH to run a cycle with AAS?

**gonzo6183** · 09-21-2010, 11:47 PM

How log since you finished your last PCT?

Looks like a well planed cycle but you should at least have caber on hand if not taking throughout at .5mg 2 x per week.

You should get results plenty good enough from 50mg ED but you could ramp to 75mg (im not recomeding 100mg but ramping upto it wold be an individual situation)

As for running test or tren higher that also seems to be a personal choice where many guys go either way.

75mg on the prop should be plenty, so id say 75mg prop/75mg tren.

Youwill also want to ramp up the HGH starting at maybe 2iu going up very week or 2

**_ripp3d_** · 09-21-2010, 11:55 PM

Fvck bro that many cycles and that small of a chest? What does your chest routine look like???

**gonzo6183** · 09-21-2010, 11:57 PM

You should post and tweak your diet aswell, will make holding your gains a lot easier and hopefully not have to fight for every pound

**gonzo6183** · 09-21-2010, 11:59 PM

NOTE: I didnt see the Adrol, drop it...

AND: You might want to consider dropping back to 12 wees total, that will be more than enough

**MrGreen** · 09-22-2010, 04:27 AM

Im fairly bigger then you and running tren with test e now at 1ml each ed 100 tren/ 250 test ed. I can tell you if your eating right and lifting your going to grow but I think your chest routine is lacking.

You look pretty lean I would bulk gain some weight then trim up the fat. Shouldnt be in issue to get everything in place.

**TopOfTheLine** · 09-22-2010, 07:23 AM

Thanks for the replies.

Originally Posted by gonzo3816

How log since you finished your last PCT?
You should get results plenty good enough from 50mg ED but you could ramp to 75mg (im not recomeding 100mg but ramping upto it wold be an individual situation)
You will also want to ramp up the HGH starting at maybe 2iu going up very week or 2

8 weeks since last post cycle.

HGH I plan to start well in advance of this cycle so that I can make it up to 6 iu. I'm going to start at 2iu and see how I feel but I haven't started yet.

Originally Posted by _ripp3d_

Fvck bro that many cycles and that small of a chest? What does your chest routine look like???

Originally Posted by MrGreen

Im fairly bigger then you and running tren with test e now at 1ml each ed 100 tren/ 250 test ed. I can tell you if your eating right and lifting your going to grow but I think your chest routine is lacking.

Chest Routine
Dumbbell Bench Press
Decline Dumbbell Press
Incline Dumbbell Press
Seated Fly (Pec Deck) super-set with Push-ups
Chest Dip

All exercises done 3 x 8 except push-ups to failure. Too much?

Originally Posted by gonzo3816

You should post and tweak your diet as well, will make holding your gains a lot easier and hopefully not have to fight for every pound

Diet is definitely the hardest part for me. I work a lot and it's hard to get a set eating schedule with what I do. Some things are constant though.
Breakfast
10 Egg Whites
2 small Yogurt
Fruit (Strawberries, Blackberries, Raspberries, or Blueberries)
Cereal or Protein Shake (2% Milk, Oats, Almond Butter, Flax Seed Oil, Whey)

Lunch/Dinner
3 x Chicken Breast throughout the day. (Sometimes substitute Tuna)
Green Beans/Pees/Assort frozen veggies 2 x throughout the day.
Brown rice 2 x sometimes only 1 depending on how late in the day it is.
2 x small yogurt

Before Bed
10 Egg Whites
Protein Shake (2% Milk, Almond Butter, Flax Seed Oil, Whey)

PWO (Usually late at night so I just go straight to before bed routine)
Protein Shake (2% Milk, Oats, Almond Butter, Flax Seed Oil, Whey)
Occasionally Chicken & Rice with Carrots/Cucumber

**gonzo6183** · 09-22-2010, 09:19 AM

Im no diet expert but im sure if you got into the diet section and asked for help you would see some dramatic results, you want to be consuming 6-8 meals a day making sure you get you macros right and of course where you get th caories from is critical. I posponed my first cycle and spent 8 months studying and tweaking my diet. I previously found it tough to break past 65kg now I hold 85kg no problem, its all diet and you have to be committed.

**Sector** · 09-22-2010, 09:39 AM

Originally Posted by gonzo3816

Im no diet expert but im sure if you got into the diet section and asked for help you would see some dramatic results, you want to be consuming 6-8 meals a day making sure you get you macros right and of course where you get th caories from is critical. I posponed my first cycle and spent 8 months studying and tweaking my diet. I previously found it tough to break past 65kg now I hold 85kg no problem, its all diet and you have to be committed.

Definatly agree. If you fix that diet you will see some serious gains from this cycle.

**Knockout_Power** · 09-22-2010, 09:54 AM

I havent read the other replies, but your cardio split is not helping you keep any muscle. If you maintain that lean structure, might as well cut back to 2-3 days a week and see if muscle gains start to show. I would highly recommend you do not start pounding in 100ED of Tren , thats a lot of Tren and more than I have ever taken. I just finished my 4th cycle and Im about your height and 220 around 12%. I havent run test over 600/wk or any additional compounds at more than 450/wk.

More gear is not the answer, make sure you are eating enough protein to build muscle and knock back that cardio by half I would say.

-KP

**TopOfTheLine** · 09-22-2010, 09:54 AM

Originally Posted by gonzo3816

Im no diet expert but im sure if you got into the diet section and asked for help you would see some dramatic results, you want to be consuming 6-8 meals a day making sure you get you macros right and of course where you get th caories from is critical.

Originally Posted by Sector

Definatly agree. If you fix that diet you will see some serious gains from this cycle.

Alright, I'll spend some time in the diet forum and get the calorie intake on par. Thanks guys.

**TopOfTheLine** · 09-22-2010, 10:02 AM

Originally Posted by Knockout_Power

I havent read the other replies, but your cardio split is not helping you keep any muscle. If you maintain that lean structure, might as well cut back to 2-3 days a week and see if muscle gains start to show. I would highly recommend you do not start pounding in 100ED of Tren , thats a lot of Tren and more than I have ever taken. I just finished my 4th cycle and Im about your height and 220 around 12%. I havent run test over 600/wk or any additional compounds at more than 450/wk.

More gear is not the answer, make sure you are eating enough protein to build muscle and knock back that cardio by half I would say.

-KP

I thought I might be doing too much cardio. I like to stay in shape for basketball but I will definitely cut down. I'm going to try 75mg ED Tren/Prop instead of 100mg. I was worried about it being too much because other guys I have seen taking that amount are a lot larger. Sound advice, thanks man.

**Knockout_Power** · 09-22-2010, 10:06 AM

Originally Posted by TopOfTheLine

I thought I might be doing too much cardio. I like to stay in shape for basketball but I will definitely cut down. I'm going to try 75mg ED Tren/Prop instead of 100mg. I was worried about it being too much because other guys I have seen taking that amount are a lot larger. Sound advice, thanks man.

Thats a good idea, the cycle I was most happy with was my most simple stack of Test E @ 250/wk and Tren A @ 350/wk. Dropped some fat, got me just under 10% and still added half a dozen lbs of LBM. The only cardio I did was my regular bag training.

**gonzo6183** · 09-22-2010, 10:22 AM

Are you going to consider dropping the Adrol (not needed at all) and cutting the total cycle length to 12 weeks?

**gym_junki** · 09-22-2010, 10:50 AM

man u need to cut down on cardio if u want to stack on some muscle, also hcg is iu not mg. cycle looks good but as stated above u dont need the adrol

**TopOfTheLine** · 09-22-2010, 11:10 AM

Yeah, dropping Drol and total cycle length to 14 weeks. So 8 weeks of Tren and 10 weeks of Prop.

**_ripp3d_** · 09-23-2010, 12:21 PM

Dumbbell Bench Press
Decline Dumbbell Press
Incline Dumbbell Press
Seated Fly (Pec Deck) super-set with Push-ups
Chest Dip

Why so many dumbbells? Get rid of the decline. Do incline first preferably with a bar. Do flat second if you want with DB or with a bar and go as wide as possible. I always used to do decline until I found out how useless it is.

Doing incline first should help with mass, a member told me to do it and it has helped alot !

**TopOfTheLine** · 09-23-2010, 12:37 PM

Originally Posted by _ripp3d_

Get rid of the decline. Do incline first preferably with a bar. Do flat second if you want with DB or with a bar and go as wide as possible. I always used to do decline until I found out how useless it is.

Doing incline first should help with mass, a member told me to do it and it has helped alot !

I will definitely change it up and try that. Thanks.