How many f*cking times!!! Grow into your dose!!

[Hazard]

Acne (in my experience) gets worse with doses. The higher the dose the worse it is.

If your prone, like I was, then Accutane is your only option, but I have seen those that are prone to acne in puberty, then dont have a pimple on cycle or during PCT.

You need to find out.

An AI helped me a great deal.

Also..... keeping blood levels stable will help A LOT imo. I think maybe the dosage combined with the frequency has an impact on oil production. I try to pin mon/wed/fri and I try to split my orals up into 4 doses taken 4-5 hours apart. If I get sloppy with my timing..... acne gets worse.

~Haz~

[FireGuy]

Totally agree on the low dose concept. A couple interesting points regarding the study. This was done on 18-35 year old males who already had good testosterone levels . During this testing period they also did not change their diet and more importantly they did ZERO weight training of any kind. The 300mg a week was the amount needed to add muscle under these circumstances. I would venture to guess had they changed dialed in their diet and added resistance training they could have added muscle below 300mgs. (more than with just diet and training alone). Also, these subjects already had healthy T levels. Take a male over the age of 35 or one with low T levels and they also tend to get fantastic results in the 200-250mg per week range.

[iatiger]

I think you could get your stats up more by the way, even at 5"7.

You should start on 300-350mg/wk and up it if gains slow or hault. They shouldnt though with the correct diet increasing cals.

PCT needs to be 5-6 weeks, not 3.

I agree, working on it! Thanks for help!

[mrniceguy215]

i don't necessarily think in every ones cases growing into doses works. it may be the smart thing to do but not always the best option for ppls needs.

[FireGuy]

^^Please elaborate.

[mrniceguy215]

every ones body is diffrent first off and second not evryones goals are the same. say that a bb has terrible luck and just doesnt respond to testosterone they are basically forced to increase the dose maybe two or three times more after there first cycle just to be able to have a leg to stand on in competition

[bjpennnn]

have not gone over 350mg of prop yet do not really see a reason to as of yet. although i do like high doses of var ha.

[Swifto]

bump

[Swifto]

Bump again, too many people increasing doses and adding 2-3 other compounds when they're not needed IMO.

[UnderTheRose]

Great post swifto!

I'm currently in my 3rd week of Test E at 500/wk. I was wondering if dropping down to 250mg/wk would be recommended? Kind of like a front load, will that work with Test E?

Thanks for the help!!

[BG]

I only run 400mgs of test Max. Keeps the water retention down along with other sides. I've had my diet dialed in for over a year and a half now and I'm shocked at how I'm still getting gains on my hrt.

[Swifto]

Great post swifto!

I'm currently in my 3rd week of Test E at 500/wk. I was wondering if dropping down to 250mg/wk would be recommended? Kind of like a front load, will that work with Test E?

Thanks for the help!!

I'd stick with 500mg/wk now you're on it. But it wouldnt hurt lowering it if you'de like. Try injecting your 250mg shot every 4 days, not 3. Reduce it marginally.

Next cycle, you dont need to run 750mg/wk. Stick to what you have just run and go again. You'll gain again if you increase cals.

I only run 400mgs of test Max. Keeps the water retention down along with other sides. I've had my diet dialed in for over a year and a half now and I'm shocked at how I'm still getting gains on my hrt.

I weighed MUCH more on 350mg/wk Test Prop, than I did 500mg/wk TE with my diet dialed in.

[dec11]

I only run 400mgs of test Max. Keeps the water retention down along with other sides. I've had my diet dialed in for over a year and a half now and I'm shocked at how I'm still getting gains on my hrt.

i'll 2nd this mate, same here. proof that diet is the ultimate tool, the rest is just helping along

[SHADO]

My first cycle was test e 250mg/week, made decent gains with zero sides.

Recently started my 2nd cycle @ 750mg/week

[BG]

My first cycle was test e 250mg/week, made decent gains with zero sides.

Recently started my 2nd cycle @ 750mg/week

So you thought there was a need for a 500mg ew jump.........?

[The Situation]

I'm getting ready to start my first cycle in a few weeks. I have test e that are 300mg. I was going to do 600 mg a week because of my gear. Is that an overkill? I'm 5'11 200 11%

[The Situation]

Oh almost forgot I am 25 years old and have been training for 9 years. Maybe I could just go 225 mg every 3 days making it 450mgs a week and extending it to 12 weeks? Any input is appreciated.

[Swifto]

My first cycle was test e 250mg/week, made decent gains with zero sides.

Recently started my 2nd cycle @ 750mg/week

Do you not think the bold sounds ironic now you've hit 750mg/wk? As I do.

Your the prime example of what this thread is about and what its against. No need what so ever to jump 500mg/wk.

Do your research.

So you thought there was a need for a 500mg ew jump.........?

Exactly.

I'm getting ready to start my first cycle in a few weeks. I have test e that are 300mg. I was going to do 600 mg a week because of my gear. Is that an overkill? I'm 5'11 200 11%

300mg every 5 days.

Oh almost forgot I am 25 years old and have been training for 9 years. Maybe I could just go 225 mg every 3 days making it 450mgs a week and extending it to 12 weeks? Any input is appreciated.

12 weeks is good, yes. Better than 10.

Increase cals every week.

[SHADO]

So you thought there was a need for a 500mg ew jump.........?

To be honest i was always only going to do 500mg/week, but because my first cycle i used 100% pharmacy grade test, this time around im using UG 10ml vials, and was told that these vials from UG labs arent always dosed as precisely, so taking 500mg may of only meant i was getting 400 etc, so i thought i would go the next step and go 750mg, on my 5th week now and no sides...

[xxblazenlowxx]

Great thread, just saved me some $$$ was planning on the magic 500 a week of test c but now I'm going to experiment with 300 a week. I will also frontload considering I don't have acne probs.

Thanks swifto I have learned so much from reading your stuff.

[HitIt]

bump

[daniel20]

My last cycle was 350mg/wk Test Prop and Dbol 20mg/ED for about 16 weeks. Got to around 220lbs 5"11 10-12% with my diet/training in order.

So I didnt NEED 500mg/wk at all.

350mg/wk Test was plenty and I was 20lbs heavier than I ever was using 500mg/wk.

I get the point of the thread and DO agree that most people run higher doses than whats needed. But your comparison of your cycle to the 500mg of test cycle does not add up..

350mg Prop Week + 140mg Dbol Week (20mg ED) = 490mg of TOTAL AAS compared to 500mg of Test.

Of course the added dbol is going to bring a synergistic effect of AAS with increased strength, gains etc. You just can't compare those 2 cycles.
If your cycle was ONLY 350mg prop a week then I could see the comparison.

[jasc]

bump

Never seen this thread before.. excellent read and something new users should be required to read.

Thanks for bumping

[DanB]

bump

excellent bump

[binsser]

ok this one might be harder.... im going to plan this cycle after my next 2 and have alreday started ordering the gear BUT its so fcking expensive and really hard to get this is what i think and i want you tell me if this is wrong

700mg -100mg a day of PRIMO
400MG- TEST PROP

Do think this is too much i was going to also add parabolin but dont want it to effect the primo as i want it full benefits and like i said it cost more than anything ive bought so far so dont want to waste this, is there any point me adding parabolin or should i just stick with this ill be on 3iu of hgh throughout also?

[binsser]

The only reason why i said this is harder is becuase primo does need to be taken in alot higher dosages??

[DanB]

Yeah high doses of primo or its a waste

I would call that cycle fairly conservative, but wouldnt add tren simply so you can judge the effects of the primo like you said

I would also make this a long cycle due to the primo

[binsser]

nice ..what i was thinking is this 16 weeks and yes dan IT IS REAL AND VERIFIED lolololol ha haha hahahah what do think 16 weeks at 700mg good, i know u can do 20 but bit to long for me as time on is time off dont want that long off to be honest???

[DanB]

haha you sure? send it my way and i'll test it

yeah 16wk is least I would run it for, and if you can afford 150mg ed it wouldnt do any harm..........

[binsser]

mmmmmm 1000mg a week for me isnt a prob m8 but isnt that on the high side???

[DanB]

not for primo to be honest, 700mg is minimum

I have a friend currently running 250mg test e and 1400mg primo with 0 adverse effects

on another well known forum they run doses even higher with no reported problems

[binsser]

right good to know any ideas on his gains ???

ill run 1000-1400mg not sure yet and ill do 16weeks just purley because i have to run test with it and dont want to be shut down too long !

[DanB]

For any newbies reading this thread since its about growing into your dose lol that binsser is an experienced user and this cycle isnt advisable for newbies

[binsser]

ha ha ha yes well put in bud

im gonna do before and after and progress with it so everyone can see the differances including me should be good m8!

[DanB]

right good to know any ideas on his gains ???

ill run 1000-1400mg not sure yet and ill do 16weeks just purley because i have to run test with it and dont want to be shut down too long !

he describes as a mild tren type gain

no sides, some lbm, nice dry look, drop in b/f

run hcg with it, this is key to recovering from long cycles, even if it is only bursts every couple weeks to stimulate LH so it isnt shut down for the full cycle lenght

[binsser]

yeah always run hcg throughout cycle that to me is a must i normally do 2 x 250ius and does my boys proud lolol thanks for the info

[DanB]

no bother, you know where i am if you need anything else, my thread in the lounge

[binsser]

sound chrs m8 still agreeing lololol

[Boxtrot]

Wouldn't it make sense that adding anymore test than a sufficient amount would make it harder to keep the gains you may gain from a higher dose anyway?

Given the more test your taking above your natural production is only going to make it harder to adapt to the gains you COULD make from a higher dose (regardless of diet and PCT).

[binsser]

300mg of test for me is low a week not going lower than thats it primo im talking about m8 and that isnt test?