Test-E for only 8 weeks?

[bruary17]

I was reading through the stickies and I found a thread started by Ronnie Rowland that stated only 8 week cycles are neccesary for maximum gains. He goes into much detail here and I get the point. However, will be runnin Test-E only either 300-400mgs and thi will be my first cycle.

So my question is, does his theory apply to me...considering I have what some call "virgin receptors." What I'm trying to ask here is, 8 weeks? 10 weeks? 12 weeks? How long?

[D7M]

10 weeks is the minimum I would go with test E.

If you are novice user, just run your cycle.

You can explore AAS/training techniques in future cycles.

[bruary17]

10 weeks is the minimum I would go with test E.

If you are novice user, just run your cycle.

You can explore AAS/training techniques in future cycles.

Excellent! I was hoping for a response from a more knowledgeable member. 10 weeks is. Thank you!!

[MBMETC]

i didn't realy see much results until the lat 7 and eigth week on test e, iguess you need to see how you react and running a 10-12 week cycle will give you a baseline for kick in, max gain, and gain taper
good luck

[vettewreck]

yeah Id say for test-e is 10weeks. If sust, 8 weeks if fine.

[bruary17]

thanks boys..its going to be test e....10 weeks 300mg

[jrun]

When are you starting this cycle bro? I am thinking of doing pretty much the exact same thing for my second cycle. Please keep in touch and let us/me know how that works out for you!

[bruary17]

[QUOTE=jrun;5426057]When are you starting this cycle bro? I am thinking of doing pretty much the exact same thing for my second cycle. Please keep in touch and let us/me know how that works out for you![/QUOTE

I just had an MRI for an injred shoulder....I go see the doc on the 17th...once I get this bull honkey fixed up, I'm going to build my base back up for about 3-4 months...then hop on the test e. I'll keep you all posted!

[Ashop]

Any of those will work. I would say 8 weeks would be the minimum.

[cro]

sounds like its a well thought out cycle .

[Stephen73ta]

I think 10 weeks should be a minimum with any long ester.

[mario_ps2]

I would say 8 weeks of test e with frontload in my experience..

[BIG NICE]

Hey OP, I am considering my first cycle a little further down the line. What you are running is pretty much what I am thinking. Test E for 10 weeks, at a low dose. Are you def gonna run it at 300 mg? Or do you think you might go for 400mg/week? Just curious, I want to play it safe, but at the same time I don't want to waste my cycle by under dosing.

Also, are you planning on running an AI on cycle? What's planned for PCT? Thanks man, just curious.

[bruary17]

Hey OP, I am considering my first cycle a little further down the line. What you are running is pretty much what I am thinking. Test E for 10 weeks, at a low dose. Are you def gonna run it at 300 mg? Or do you think you might go for 400mg/week? Just curious, I want to play it safe, but at the same time I don't want to waste my cycle by under dosing.

Also, are you planning on running an AI on cycle? What's planned for PCT? Thanks man, just curious.

Def going to stay at 300mg. I don't want any sides. And I don't want any DHT conversion. I may run deca instead of enth actually. Just want to do my HW on itm first. It aromatization rate and DHT conversion are practically non existent from what I hear. For PCT, Nolva and clomid will be on hand.

[Bonaparte]

Def going to stay at 300mg. I don't want any sides. And I don't want any DHT conversion. I may run deca instead of enth actually. Just want to do my HW on itm first. It aromatization rate and DHT conversion are practically non existent from what I hear. For PCT, Nolva and clomid will be on hand.

Well, you heard wrong. Test is test and it all converts the same amount into estrogen or DHT for any given blood concentration level. That last part is the key and the only difference between different esters of the same compound, since the ester will determine the release rate and pattern, along with the amount of actual hormone per mg of product injected (longer esters weigh more, so they contain less hormone per mg).

[bruary17]

I was talking about the Deca when refering to the DHT/aromatization.

[Swifto]

Well, you heard wrong. Test is test and it all converts the same amount into estrogen or DHT for any given blood concentration level. That last part is the key and the only difference between different esters of the same compound, since the ester will determine the release rate and pattern, along with the amount of actual hormone per mg of product injected (longer esters weigh more, so they contain less hormone per mg).

Twice you have stated this. You ignored me at OLM when I stated this is NOT the case.

Longer ester's (Enanthate for example) convert to DHT and estrogen more heavily at the same dosage than short esters (Propionate for example).

Unless you have anything in the contrary?

The ester does effect the rate of conversion to DHT, estrogen, HPTA shutdown and how anabolic a specific compound is.

http://forums.steroid.com/showthread...icle-on-Esters...

I dont like Anthony, but this is good reading.

[Swifto]

I was talking about the Deca when refering to the DHT/aromatization.

Deca only is a terrible first cycle.

Stick with what you have - 10 weeks of TE at 300mg/wk.

If you dont want DHT conversion, you may be better with a shorter ester than Enanthate. Long and short estered Testosterone's will all convert to estrogen (aromotase) to varied degrees.

If you want no conversion to DHT/E, then go with something like Tbol 40-60mg/ED for 6 weeks.

[bruary17]

I didn't ignore you swifto, I saw your response and really appreciated it. It cleared things up for me. I don't exactly have the gear yet so maybe your right, a shorter ester like prop may be my choice. I originally wanted enth due to once a week jabs compared to twice w prop. Also, I here prop shots are painful. I'll take your advice on no deca for first cycle, now I just have to study up on the prop.

[Swifto]

I didn't ignore you swifto, I saw your response and really appreciated it. It cleared things up for me. I don't exactly have the gear yet so maybe your right, a shorter ester like prop may be my choice. I originally wanted enth due to once a week jabs compared to twice w prop. Also, I here prop shots are painful. I'll take your advice on no deca for first cycle, now I just have to study up on the prop.

Not you Bonaparte.

Prop is not 2x week. Its EOD or ED.

Its clear you have a lot to learn. Spend some time in the Profiles Forum here and read up.

[bruary17]

Swifto, any good threads on proper dosing of prop? And would it be a good first cycle?

[bruary17]

And real quick...what gauge needle would I use w prop?

[Swifto]

Swifto, any good threads on proper dosing of prop? And would it be a good first cycle?

And real quick...what gauge needle would I use w prop?

Use the search feature.

Like everyone else here, you need to put the ground work in and actually read the articles, educational threads, sticky's, profiles, then come back with questions.

By reading everything you'll learn things you wouldnt have wanted to know or were not searching for.

I'm not answering all your questions on a plate for you.

[bruary17]

I wasn't asking you to answer all my questions on a plate for me. You provided a link for bonaparte...just thought you could throw one my way. But no problem. I'll dig like I have been, thanks for the straight forwardness.

[ScotchGuard02]

I did a 12 week Sustanon 250 cycle. Broke out with acne like crazy after week 5. Did the washing, topical, benzyl peroxide, but accutane shut the acne down. Great muscular gains but bad on the skin. Then I did an 8 week Test Prop cycle. I was really nervous since I broke out with Sus 250. I had a few acne that popped out but NOTHING like my Sus 250 experience. I'm converted to Test Prop. Injections hurt like a mother so I went on Anabolic Lab Forum and brewed my own "painless" Test Prop. The injection discomfort was only minimal in the thigh and zero in the butt.

[Bonaparte]

Twice you have stated this. You ignored me at OLM when I stated this is NOT the case.

Longer ester's (Enanthate for example) convert to DHT and estrogen more heavily at the same dosage than short esters (Propionate for example).

Unless you have anything in the contrary?

The ester does effect the rate of conversion to DHT, estrogen, HPTA shutdown and how anabolic a specific compound is.

http://forums.steroid.com/showthread...icle-on-Esters...

I dont like Anthony, but this is good reading.

Actually, I must have missed that.
And I have read that article before (though it was like 2 years ago), but I dismissed it as more of Anthony Roberts' unfounded conjecture. And I really don't feel like reading all that shit again, but didn't AR claim that long esters convert more readily to estrogen, while short esters convert more readily to DHT?
And either way, what could actually account for the difference, since the hormone is inactive while still attached to an ester?

[Swifto]

Actually, I must have missed that.
And I have read that article before (though it was like 2 years ago), but I dismissed it as more of Anthony Roberts' unfounded conjecture. And I really don't feel like reading all that shit again, but didn't AR claim that long esters convert more readily to estrogen, while short esters convert more readily to DHT?
And either way, what could actually account for the difference, since the hormone is inactive while still attached to an ester?

Read the article.

[bruary17]

That was an awesome artical!

[Bonaparte]

Read the article.

I actually went ahead and read it anyway a few hours ago. It was a bit different than the one I was thinking of.

But isn't it very possible that the findings in these studies he cites were skewed because of the infrequency of the shots? It seems that they are just based on what an individual shot of test will do (or multiple infrequent shots that allow for a return to baseline in between), and not a steady level like we would have in a cycle with frequent injections. I only took the time to look up the monkey study (source #2), but the shortest ester used was Enanthate, which doesn't really tell us much about Prop vs Enanthate. I'm still far from convinced, as it still just seems like a lot of conjecture, since he can't really provide a scientific basis for these findings.
Whatever, maybe I'm just being cranky and contrary because its midnight here and I have to teach a class in 8 hrs, but I'm awaiting your thoughts on the matter (and not trying to pick a fight with you that I'll surely lose) lol.

[Swifto]

I actually went ahead and read it anyway a few hours ago. It was a bit different than the one I was thinking of.

But isn't it very possible that the findings in these studies he cites were skewed because of the infrequency of the shots? It seems that they are just based on what an individual shot of test will do (or multiple infrequent shots that allow for a return to baseline in between), and not a steady level like we would have in a cycle with frequent injections. I only took the time to look up the monkey study (source #2), but the shortest ester used was Enanthate, which doesn't really tell us much about Prop vs Enanthate. I'm still far from convinced, as it still just seems like a lot of conjecture, since he can't really provide a scientific basis for these findings.
Whatever, maybe I'm just being cranky and contrary because its midnight here and I have to teach a class in 8 hrs, but I'm awaiting your thoughts on the matter (and not trying to pick a fight with you that I'll surely lose) lol.

No fighting here bro. I'm being blunt as I'm just about to put my dog down... :-(

They did compare Prop and Enanthate. I'm going to come back to this tomorrow.

[bruary17]

I'd like to see you come back to this tomorrow. Very intereted. Sorry to hear about your pooch. : /

[Bonaparte]

No fighting here bro. I'm being blunt as I'm just about to put my dog down... :-(

Sorry to hear that...

[Far from massive]

Hey just read the thread,

Sorry to hear about your situation Swifto, put one down for my daughter this summer,it was not even my dog and I felt like shit for weeks..

[Swifto]

He wasnt very well, so I did him a favour. Deterioted after a last ditch operation. Had a Mast Cell (cancer) tumour. Most vicious aggressive form, really took hold of the little fella. Anyway...

I'm speaking to someone about this ester article, someone that knows more than I do about pharmacokinetics than I do and I want his opinion. Infact, I'm getting two opinions. But I have no reason to suspect the article is bullshit looking at the references. Although Anthony doesnt come to any EXACT conclusion's IMHO. But that twat has made a catalogue of errors in the past, so we'll see...