9 weeks into test-e first cycle, before and current picture... need help!!!

**Wisco** · 01-13-2011, 03:27 PM

Hey all! I know there are quite a few of you here that have a sizable amount of experience - heard a lot of different things and researched but would like to get your specific thoughts pertaining to my specific situation. I posted a picture of a before cycle pic The one below is from 11/1/10 at the beginning of my cycle.

Problem: I am not seeing real size gains, minimal strength gains and want to know what to do differently. I started my cycle 9 weeks ago and have maybe put 5lbs on. Bench has increased from 155lbs x 1 to 175lbs x3.

Me: 30 yo, 180lbs, 6'0. Started working out 2-3 times per week in June 2010 Previously just played hockey 2x a week. Test level prior to cycle was 593 according to a local hospital blood test.

Cycle: 16 weeks test-e only direct from **** labs - I verified the serial number on the vials through their website. First 8 weeks i did one per week 350mg pin in my upper right glut. Didn't think was enough so now doing 325mg twice a week, Mon and Thurs so total dose 650mg/wk. I am also taking creatine as of about week 7, in the form of BSN Cellmass (one scoop mornings and one post workout). Things I noticed in the first 4 weeks on cycle were: clearly increase aggression levels... (hate this btw), oily skin at about week 3, some acne on my shoulders, at about week 7 some on my chest, increased hair growth on my chest, increased facial acne. Increased libido and increased erections around week 2-4 but that calmed down quite a bit since it became apparent...

Work out: 2 on, 1 off repeat. Normal routine is 3-5 sets of 10 reps increasing to about 85% or so of my max. Trouble doing the last couple reps on each set. I bench, tricep extensions/dips and shoulder press and abs one day, then on the second day on I do squats, rows and bicep curls.

Diet / Sleep: Mornings I'll have a scoop of whey protein mixed with a scoop of medium duration sytha 6, a banana and about 8 oz of soy milk. I might have cereal some mornings. I do a quick meal before lunch, usually a bowl of broccoli and a 6 oz serving of cottage cheese. For lunch I'll have a large sandwich or whatever our entree is, sides, soup etc. (whey shake after work out if work out day).. Dinner I usually do a sub or medium sized meal. Granola bar or other snacks around 9p. And finally another whey and syntha shake w soy milk before bed.

As far as sleep goes I know I have room to develop here. I usually only average about 6 hours of sleep. I heard that not having enough sleep can drop your test levels considerably.

Alcohol: I drink about 3-7 drinks twice a week (Fri/ Sat) with an occasional couple glasses of wine once or twice a week if I have anyone over for dinner.

My lifestyle is otherwise very active. I work at the office during the day and also spend about 3-4 hours a night working in my garage on hobbies - namely a track car I'm building.

Any suggestions? Should I stack for the last 6 weeks with something else? What should I do?

**DKbuilder** · 01-13-2011, 03:34 PM

this must be a troll

**MBMETC** · 01-13-2011, 03:37 PM

Originally Posted by Wisco

Hey all! I know there are quite a few of you here that have a sizable amount of experience - heard a lot of different things and researched but would like to get your specific thoughts pertaining to my specific situation. I posted a picture of a before cycle pic The one below is from 11/1/10 at the beginning of my cycle.

Problem: I am not seeing real size gains, minimal strength gains and want to know what to do differently. I started my cycle 9 weeks ago and have maybe put 5lbs on. Bench has increased from 155lbs x 1 to 175lbs x3.

Me: 30 yo, 180lbs, 6'0. Started working out 2-3 times per week in June 2010 Previously just played hockey 2x a week. Test level prior to cycle was 593 according to a local hospital blood test.

Cycle: 16 weeks test-e only direct from **** labs - I verified the serial number on the vials through their website. First 8 weeks i did one per week 350mg pin in my upper right glut. Didn't think was enough so now doing 325mg twice a week, Mon and Thurs so total dose 650mg/wk. I am also taking creatine as of about week 7, in the form of BSN Cellmass (one scoop mornings and one post workout). Things I noticed in the first 4 weeks on cycle were: clearly increase aggression levels... (hate this btw), oily skin at about week 3, some acne on my shoulders, at about week 7 some on my chest, increased hair growth on my chest, increased facial acne. Increased libido and increased erections around week 2-4 but that calmed down quite a bit since it became apparent...

Work out: 2 on, 1 off repeat. Normal routine is 3-5 sets of 10 reps increasing to about 85% or so of my max. Trouble doing the last couple reps on each set. I bench, tricep extensions/dips and shoulder press and abs one day, then on the second day on I do squats, rows and bicep curls.

Diet / Sleep: Mornings I'll have a scoop of whey protein mixed with a scoop of medium duration sytha 6, a banana and about 8 oz of soy milk. I might have cereal some mornings. I do a quick meal before lunch, usually a bowl of broccoli and a 6 oz serving of cottage cheese. For lunch I'll have a large sandwich or whatever our entree is, sides, soup etc. (whey shake after work out if work out day).. Dinner I usually do a sub or medium sized meal. Granola bar or other snacks around 9p. And finally another whey and syntha shake w soy milk before bed.

As far as sleep goes I know I have room to develop here. I usually only average about 6 hours of sleep. I heard that not having enough sleep can drop your test levels considerably.

Alcohol: I drink about 3-7 drinks twice a week (Fri/ Sat) with an occasional couple glasses of wine once or twice a week if I have anyone over for dinner.

My lifestyle is otherwise very active. I work at the office during the day and also spend about 3-4 hours a night working in my garage on hobbies - namely a track car I'm building.

Any suggestions? Should I stack for the last 6 weeks with something else? What should I do?

yes food

**chuckt12345** · 01-13-2011, 03:41 PM

got to be legit if you take the time to write that.
Yea something doesnt seem right. Even at 325mg /wk you should of put on more than 5lbs and strength should be way higher. Where your after pic?

**MAC MAN** · 01-13-2011, 03:43 PM

To start one issue is your diet. You are not getting a good meal 1,2,3,4,5,6 etc. Go to the diet section and start reading on ways to change yours up. Second thing is that you drink 3-7 drinks/ week. Another prob I see is that you workout 2-3 times per week, do not know what in June means, that's not not much time to do all exercises for your body. Do not stack, you are not ready for this. Aslo 16 weeks of test-e is a long cycle and high dosage you are using. You deffinately have room for improvements.

**Blacksrt42004** · 01-13-2011, 03:46 PM

From the stuff I have read on here I would say you need a lot more food and cutoff the alcohol while your are on your cycle.

**Ruffiancino** · 01-13-2011, 03:47 PM

No juice..............you need food...............and a lot more of it than you are getting now. Research your diet and your routine. Both are poorly suited for even maintaining the little bit of muscle you have. You should have eaten your entire's day worth of food by 11 am. Seriously, don't do another cycle until you get that other stuff in order, you'll be throwing your money away

**BigJuice777** · 01-13-2011, 03:48 PM

FOOD!!! It starts and ends with food. Without it, doesn't matter how much gear you inject.

**mg0922** · 01-13-2011, 04:09 PM

Im guessing this is his first cycle by the way he looked pre-cycle. There is ALOTwrong going on here. 325mg a week of sus you should of gained more than five lbs. I can gain 5lbs sitting on my ass for 2 days!! You must not be eating at all, or working out at all man. I mean come on! 5lbs!????? You definitley were not ready for this cycle and it just goes to show you what lack of knowledge will do to someone trying to cycle thinking its gonna make you get the perfect body.

I suggest you stop now, do your pct, (if thats even legit) and start learning how to diet my friend. Stick around here and educate yourself.

good luck

**chuckt12345** · 01-13-2011, 04:15 PM

yup start reading the stickies.

as far as the reason why ur gainint i have no clue,, even with a poor diet and workout routine you would of put on more than 5lbs,, unless youve lost fat.

**Far from massive** · 01-13-2011, 04:41 PM

Taking steroids at this point in your life is like putting nitrous on your daily driver...the only difference is its harder to fix you than you car. You definately need to get your diet and workout in order take some time to develop your connective tissue then after at least 6 months of eating right and training ( and not drinking ) then read about priming while doing your prime you can get all the stuff for your cycle and PCT and by the end of your prime your body will be ready to start making dramatic gains. At your age body type (Ecotomorph) and early point in your development you will then see huge rapid gains in wieght that will be almost entirely lean mass.

Best of luck, its a process not an event but if you want it and will commit to it, you are at a point in your life where the changes can come very rapidly.

PS acne can very often be controlled by scrubbing with a non oil based cleanser and taking a shower anytime you sweat so it does not dry onto you body, and frequent changes of bed linens and always wearing clean, dry cotton (this may mean changing tee shirts 2-3 times a day) where it contacts affected areas to wick any oil, sweat from the surface of the skin.

**Wisco** · 01-13-2011, 05:23 PM

Originally Posted by Far from massive

Taking steroids at this point in your life is like putting nitrous on your daily driver...the only difference is its harder to fix you than you car. You definately need to get your diet and workout in order take some time to develop your connective tissue then after at least 6 months of eating right and training ( and not drinking ) then read about priming while doing your prime you can get all the stuff for your cycle and PCT and by the end of your prime your body will be ready to start making dramatic gains. At your age body type (Ecotomorph) and early point in your development you will then see huge rapid gains in wieght that will be almost entirely lean mass.

Best of luck, its a process not an event but if you want it and will commit to it, you are at a point in your life where the changes can come very rapidly.

PS acne can very often be controlled by scrubbing with a non oil based cleanser and taking a shower anytime you sweat so it does not dry onto you body, and frequent changes of bed linens and always wearing clean, dry cotton (this may mean changing tee shirts 2-3 times a day) where it contacts affected areas to wick any oil, sweat from the surface of the skin.

Guys - thanks for the tips. You're right on and I figured it had to do with food. I have actually lost just a small amount of fat over the last 9 weeks. I've been working on getting my abs to show for the last couple months, so my diet has been protein rich with average carbs and low(er) fat. Sounds like I need to do much more research on eating right. Thing is, I'm newly single as of about 3 months ago and at 30 it's important for me to look fit. I guess a bulking cycle is in order. I may just sit back, burn some fat for a month and go heavy on cardio, do research, get at least the top set of abs (4) showing and go at this the right way. I don't think I'll need pct [EDIT] BECAUSE I THINK MY GEAR WAS FAKE although I have Nolva on hand and can get clomid same day. I'm going to have to lock down the discipline to eat right... Actually now that I think about it I have a friend that eats almost NO fat, is completely natural... Same frame as me except is just a f*ckin tank. He hardly eats I don't get it... Sugar free oatmeal and a banana for breakfast, chicken wrap, rice cake, protein shakes x 4 a day syntha and regular clean lower carb shakes for dinner... no carbs after 7pm. I did my research (not enough obviously) but I got my diet by cornerstoning my friends diet. I appreciate all the help I'll take some pictures tonight and post up.

**Ruffiancino** · 01-13-2011, 05:27 PM

Originally Posted by Wisco

Guys - thanks for the tips. You're right on and I figured it had to do with food. I have actually lost fat over the last 9 weeks. I've been working on getting my abs to show for the last couple months, so my diet has been protein rich with average carbs and low(er) fat. Sounds like I need to do much more research on eating right. Thing is, I'm newly single as of about 3 months ago and at 30 it's important for me to look fit. I guess a bulking cycle is in order. I may just sit back, burn some fat for a month and go heavy on cardio, do research, get at least the top set of abs (4) showing and go at this the right way. I don't think I'll need pct although I have Nolva on hand and can get clomid same day. I'm going to have to lock down the discipline to eat right... Actually now that I think about it I have a friend that eats almost NO fat, is completely natural... Same frame as me except is just a f*ckin tank. He hardly eats I don't get it... Sugar free oatmeal and a banana for breakfast, chicken wrap, rice cake, protein shakes x 4 a day syntha and regular clean lower carb shakes for dinner... no carbs after 7pm. I did my research (not enough obviously) but I got my diet by cornerstoning my friends diet. I appreciate all the help I'll take some pictures tonight and post up.

Um.....You've been on for 9 weeks and you don't want to run anything for PCT?

**D.Pump** · 01-13-2011, 05:57 PM

I say troll

that picture is not of a 30 yo on 350 mg of test for 9 weeks already

**D.Pump** · 01-13-2011, 05:58 PM

^ on second though it could just be a kid who bought fake gear (hence no gains) and lied about his age... seems more plausible

**The Hyena** · 01-13-2011, 06:09 PM

I want my click back... for this thread

**JohnnyVegas** · 01-13-2011, 06:19 PM

Originally Posted by D.Pump

^ on second though it could just be a kid who bought fake gear (hence no gains) and lied about his age... seems more plausible

Out of your two choices...I am going with this one.

**Wisco** · 01-13-2011, 06:49 PM

I'm actually turning 31. I'm not a troll and I'm not a child. but I'll tell you what I am - I'm prepared to get flammed bc of course all newbs get slammed.. and that is perfectly fine . I haven't done enough research I will admit that. Not sure what type of clowns post to this site but ill be here. To learn and to get results.

Originally Posted by JohnnyVegas

Out of your two choices...I am going with this one.

**mg0922** · 01-13-2011, 08:00 PM

We hope you do that man. And whatever your age is who cares, you messed up big time.

you need to do a pct my friend!!!! If you don't your going to be shut down for along time. Ppl who a cycle for 2-3 weeks still need a pct! Get whatever you need and do that.

I personally believe what your saying. Unless you really have no life and live to right really long paragraphs for no reason. Do your pct and focus on eating right. Your not your friend, your body is different, so you ll have to work harder, be honest with ppl and hopefully they ll help you.

Good luck.

Mg

**mg0922** · 01-13-2011, 08:02 PM

Also, Are you 100% positive your gear was legit? How many calories would u say you ate a day? How many times a week did you work out?

**mg0922** · 01-13-2011, 08:05 PM

And just because you "verified label numbers" means ABSOLUTELY NOTHING!! have you or anyone you know orederrd from there before to testify it is real stuff?

**terraj** · 01-13-2011, 09:20 PM

Lol @ OP.

Just stay on and don't come off, we can call it a method of Natural Selection.

**Duckhombre** · 01-13-2011, 10:05 PM

Your gains are placebo, you have fake stuff. Sorry.

**Johnyonemove** · 01-14-2011, 12:15 AM

Originally Posted by Duckhombre

Your gains are placebo, you have fake stuff. Sorry.

agreed. so this should tell teh kid he needs to keep working out naturally before he uses if hes gaining on fake aas.

**Wisco** · 01-14-2011, 01:58 AM

Not sure that it's fake but I may be wrong. Based on previous research I'm guessing my levels should be around 1050-1200. Is there a place I can send in a sample to get tested or maybe get another blood test to check T levels although it would probably seem sketchy to the doctor that I have only met once before for my first blood test... Anyway- Main side is that it makes me very aggressive - especially while driving behind a prius thats doing the speed limit in the passing lane for example - swear i get nuts i need to hold back. was never like that before! Anyway i think i eat fine - 2500 cals a day, about 200g of protein, maybe 50-80g of fat. In regards to my comment about not needing pct earlier in this thread, somewhere online I had read that if you have a low dose (300mg was my initial plan) and have very low body fat that you probably won't need pct all together. Haven't done enough research again - just going by what my buddy tells me who is currently on a 500mg test and 300mg tren cycle for 16 weeks. Figure he knows his sh*t this is his umpteenth cycle. Here is a current pic. Ps. respect to the people that are helping me out here.

**Wisco** · 01-14-2011, 02:04 AM

Originally Posted by mg0922

And just because you "verified label numbers" means ABSOLUTELY NOTHING!! have you or anyone you know orederrd from there before to testify it is real stuff?

hey man - I was actually out in vegas for new years at the marquee at the cosmo... sick time.. I was going to pick up the stuff from some xxl website but my friend said he had enough to get me going so i picked up his unopened vials. i'm about 99% sure he wouldn't screw me but then again.. ? I eat about 2500 cals a day and work out 2-3 times a week. I was going 4-5 times but the discipline came in a bit when I wasn't seeing gains after about week 6-7. I felt that I saw some solid strength gains after only week 2 but no size gains. Thanks for the help.

**The Titan99** · 01-14-2011, 02:45 AM

Originally Posted by Wisco;548***4

Not sure that it's fake but I may be wrong. Based on previous research I'm guessing my levels should be around 1050-1200. Is there a place I can send in a sample to get tested or maybe get another blood test to check T levels although it would probably seem sketchy to the doctor that I have only met once before for my first blood test... Anyway- Main side is that it makes me very aggressive - especially while driving behind a prius thats doing the speed limit in the passing lane for example - swear i get nuts i need to hold back. was never like that before! Anyway i think i eat fine - 2500 cals a day, about 200g of protein, maybe 50-80g of fat. In regards to my comment about not needing pct earlier in this thread, somewhere online I had read that if you have a low dose (300mg was my initial plan) and have very low body fat that you probably won't need pct all together. Haven't done enough research again - just going by what my buddy tells me who is currently on a 500mg test and 300mg tren cycle for 16 weeks. Figure he knows his sh*t this is his umpteenth cycle. Here is a current pic. Ps. respect to the people that are helping me out here.

This is a Troll. Nobody walks around this stupid. From your previously stated diet, where is this 200 g of protein coming from, the "Big Sandwich"? And where ever you read that with low BF you won't need to do PCT, WTF does that have to do with your HPTA being shutdown. I hope for your sake this is a Troll, otherwise you are just about to irretrievably fvck yourself up. Good luck man, your gonna need it.

**ufc8581** · 01-14-2011, 08:08 AM

you shoulda did alot more research before cycling.. people who rush it this is what happens... there is more than enough info and help on here .. start pct and do ur homework

**needle** · 01-14-2011, 08:11 AM

working out 2-3 times a week? come on nowlol

**MBMETC** · 01-14-2011, 08:18 AM

im not gonna pound on you like others because i feel this post is dead. run a pct or get blood levels checked to confirn legitimcy of gear, and chalk it up to a learning exp. do more research, build a strong diet and a solid base so you can make and maintain gains.
best of luck

**chuckt12345** · 01-14-2011, 10:05 AM

jesus,, wtf everyone ripping on this guy for. If you take the time to read youd see he's being serious and looking for advice.
OP you do need to do a pct and go get your hormone levels checked at a doctors office.

**Far from massive** · 01-14-2011, 10:46 AM

Yeah I for one don't understand everyone's outlook that the guy is trolling because he did not think he needed a PCT for whatever reason. I have a close friend who has lifted for 30 years ( we are both in our early 50s) he works repairing fitness equipment and knows tons of people through both his job as well as all the years of lifting. Anyway he has juiced in the past (1980s) and is now juicing again and until I introduced him to PCT he had never heard of it, the same goes for many of the guys he knows who have been cycling for 4-5 years when he says do you believe in PCT they wanna know if you shoot it? they honestly have never heard of the concept of taking drugs to alter the bodies recovery ( of course this is why most of them are starting or are on TRT even though they are in their 30s).

I know the OP has a lot of issues but it seems anytime an ectomorph posts he is open to redicule. By the way not everyone is a mesomorph some of us guys were born an ectomorph (as the guy in the picture clearly is) this does not mean that we can't use juice cause we are not 220 lbs this whole idea that some fat ass with big arms can come aboard and post pictures and as long as he wieghs 230 lbs he can be accepted with some mild suggestion that he should drop some of his claimed 20% bf which is clearly closer to 30% bf before cycling. Then if some skinny guy who is 6.0 175 with 15% body fat comes asking questions he is told he is too little to cycle, your too skinny to take a needle etc, and to eat and train till he is 210 at 10% etc. to me I truly think the guy who has low body fat and low musculature is a better candidate for steroids than some guy who is 35 with a pot belly and a mid life crisis.

O-K sorry to flame the board but this has bugged me since the week I joined, I just think that we as a community still seem to single these guys out just like we did in the locker room at high school, I am sure there asses are tired of the towel snaps.

**Duckhombre** · 01-14-2011, 03:34 PM

2500 calories is too low, try your hardest to double it. If you manage a 50% increase you will gain some weight. You need to do something about your training. You should be showing more response. Anger/agression is not really a common side effect at that does, not even at double. The overwhelming urge to breed/masturbate is much more common, if you are not getting a bunch of random hard ons (RHO), jerking of three or four times a day, undressing fat girls with your eyes, threating your girl friend with rape if doesn't let some MORE, beating your hard dick on the dresser, ect, then you have fake stuff. Your stuff might not completely free from testosterone , it may just be very under dosed.

**Far from massive** · 01-14-2011, 03:52 PM

Common Duck ^^^ tell us how you really feel...

PS I agree with the underdosed analysis, on almost 700 wk you should be jacked.

**terraj** · 01-14-2011, 06:55 PM

Originally Posted by Far from massive

Yeah I for one don't understand everyone's outlook that the guy is trolling because he did not think he needed a PCT for whatever reason. I have a close friend who has lifted for 30 years ( we are both in our early 50s) he works repairing fitness equipment and knows tons of people through both his job as well as all the years of lifting. Anyway he has juiced in the past (1980s) and is now juicing again and until I introduced him to PCT he had never heard of it, the same goes for many of the guys he knows who have been cycling for 4-5 years when he says do you believe in PCT they wanna know if you shoot it? they honestly have never heard of the concept of taking drugs to alter the bodies recovery ( of course this is why most of them are starting or are on TRT even though they are in their 30s).

I know the OP has a lot of issues but it seems anytime an ectomorph posts he is open to redicule. By the way not everyone is a mesomorph some of us guys were born an ectomorph (as the guy in the picture clearly is) this does not mean that we can't use juice cause we are not 220 lbs this whole idea that some fat ass with big arms can come aboard and post pictures and as long as he wieghs 230 lbs he can be accepted with some mild suggestion that he should drop some of his claimed 20% bf which is clearly closer to 30% bf before cycling. Then if some skinny guy who is 6.0 175 with 15% body fat comes asking questions he is told he is too little to cycle, your too skinny to take a needle etc, and to eat and train till he is 210 at 10% etc. to me I truly think the guy who has low body fat and low musculature is a better candidate for steroids than some guy who is 35 with a pot belly and a mid life crisis.

O-K sorry to flame the board but this has bugged me since the week I joined, I just think that we as a community still seem to single these guys out just like we did in the locker room at high school, I am sure there asses are tired of the towel snaps.

Maybe because he 9 weeks into injecting a chemical into his body before he even thought about it...

**slimshady01** · 01-14-2011, 07:59 PM

Originally Posted by Duckhombre

2500 calories is too low, try your hardest to double it. If you manage a 50% increase you will gain some weight. You need to do something about your training. You should be showing more response. Anger/agression is not really a common side effect at that does, not even at double. The overwhelming urge to breed/masturbate is much more common, if you are not getting a bunch of random hard ons (RHO), jerking of three or four times a day, undressing fat girls with your eyes, threating your girl friend with rape if doesn't let some MORE, beating your hard dick on the dresser, ect, then you have fake stuff. Your stuff might not completely free from testosterone, it may just be very under dosed.

lol i had a surge of hornyness the other week and told my wife she better get it now, or i either go in the bathroom and jerk off or i rape her lol.. Was weird.. its only happened a few times on my first cycle.

**brad1986** · 01-14-2011, 08:03 PM

hahaha not 30 years old for sure and definitly not 180lbs... maybe 18.0 lbs.lol man you need to learn how to eat before you even think about jumpin on the gear.