Tren Acetate / Winny/Test Prop Cycle

[mjohs88]

Height: 5’7”
Weight: 192 lbs
BF: 16%
Age:22


Goal: Gain about 10-15lbs of lean quality muscle. Decrease my bf% to <10%.

Note to all: Criticism is welcome but if you decide to say something negative you better have a better way at doing it. If not keep your yap shut. [i.e. I don’t want nor need unbased attacks e.g. yo bro you don’t know what you’re doing ]

12 week super cutter cycle
Juice Dosage:

Trenbolone Acetate: 100mg EOD wk 1-12

Winstrol Tabs: 50 mg ED wk 4-10

Testosterone Propionate: 100mg EOD wk 1-3,10-12 [6 weeks total]; 150mg EOD wk 4-9[6 weeks total]

HCG: 250-500 mg EOD wks 10-12 <-- have not decided yet on exact dosage but it will be in this range.

Albuterol Sulfate: 10-15 mg/day for two weeks at a time. Planned cycle is for wks 1-2, 5-6, 9-10. If you do not know what albuterol and think I am crazy read the article about this chemical on this site first.

PCT:
Nolvadex- start taking pills 3 days after last injection. 40 mg/day wks 13-14 [total 2 weeks], 20mg/day wks 15-16[ total 2 weeks], Then done.

Supplements:
To prevent sore joints and inflammatory effects from the Winstrol I will combat it with the following:
Glucosamine Sulfate [I know to start taking this 1 month before I start my cycle], Hyaluronic Acid, Chondroitin Sulfate, Methylsulphonylmethane (MSM), Concentrated Fish Oil, (Magnesium and Calcium as an added bonus for bone strength) . I might make a late add of a potassium supplement if I feel I need it during the cycle.

Also will be taking a diuretic.

Other supplements I am taking and will continue to take:
EGCg (green tea extract)
Vitamin C
MultiVitamin.

Other:
Blood Test (before, halfway, and after)-Full Blood Count, Liver and Kidney function test, FSH, LH, TSH, Cholesterol

Diet: It it key and more important than juice IMO but for sake of brevity I will not go into it here. Also do not ask me about my diet because I will not post it. Take a leap of faith with me and assume I know how to eat properly and healthy to get the most benefit out of this cycle [what do you think I would spend all this time and money on juicing just to have a sloppy diet, ha]. This post is about the juice not my diet.

Lastly I will be upfront and tell you my 3 main concerns. Hopefully someone who knows what they are talking about will reply and give me a decent answer.
1) The length and dosage of trenbolone. Obviously I know how potent it is so I want to know if this will be too long of a cycle. If I should cut it down to 10 weeks should I also cut down the test to ten weeks the also? I also know that the difference between 8 weeks or 12 weeks can be the difference between a good cycle or not so this is why I am a little concerned. For those wondering I have not taken any type of Tren before. I have done several cycles with the main steroid being testosterone [Also will not go into it here, again you have to trust me that I know what I am doing with my body].
2) I am avoiding estrogen related side effects at all costs (water retention, bitch tits, ect) so I want to know if you think 150mg of Test Prop EOD might be too much and will cause those undesirable side effects.
3) I am concerned about the alleged ‘tren cough’ and ‘test flu’. I know this much, it happens at the start of a cycle with short acting injectible esters. I do know for people who have this issue, there is a correlation that they are most likely injecting too much too early in the cycle. That is why I am going low and approaching my dosing schedule as a pyramid [ Incline dosing pattern at the start, level off, then a proper decline dosage at the end].

Again any feedback would be awesome. Thanks!

[carp123]

nice first post but your too young buddy .............

[mjohs88]

Arnold started juicing when he was 15 fyi...

[sixoner]

right on arnold....good luck

[carp123]

Arnold started juicing when he was 15 fyi...

and? this makes it ok to start juiceing then? your post means nothing at all and shows your a dumb ass...

[clayton2127]

ya know.. this guy has obviously thought about doing it and has made up his mind... i know, you all think hes too young, not enough knowledge,etc.. but understand, hes going to do it anyways. so not answering his questions and letting him make big mistakes as far as dosages and uneducated gear decisions because of his age is just as bad as giving him good feedback and helping him in a positive way even though hes too young. he didnt ask for any opinions on wether or not hes too young, he asked what seemed to be pretty legit questions. so just pretend he is within your alls qualifications and just answer the questions. Not trying to be a d!ck here, just trying to get the point across that it does nobody any good to act this way. If you all dont want to answer the questions he has posted and just want to bash, then dont write anything at all. I do see people on here who actually give educated answers and opinions to ANYONE that asks and can still sleep at night. Again, not trying to be a turd, just trying to open some eyes. and now let the bashing on me begin lol

[sixoner]

the guy came in with an attitude clayton...just because its the internet does not mean manners are out the window

not everybody is humble fine.. but how the fuk do you come into a place to ask questions in regards to something as complex and potentially hazardous to your health as steroids and at the same time demand just what and in which manner you require to receive the information..

respect counts

[number twelve]

this guy prefaces his post with negativity, so he is only going to receive negative responses

[mjohs88]

and? this makes it ok to start juiceing then? your post means nothing at all and shows your a dumb ass...

Nahh man your the dumbass because you contribute absolutely nothing constructive to my original point but to decide to pick on a mute point about my age. Yes like the guy said above I am going to take it with or without your 'permission'. Do me and everyone else a favor and do not post anything else on this forum. FYI I looked at your other posts to other forums and again you speak like a person with a 8th grade education level giving your opinion and nothing constructive to say to those people. Giving a 5 word response does nothing to help anyone, it just shows your ignorance. Posting the thing about Arnold was suppose to be a comical thing (because I was dismissing your comment about my age and posting something stupid) but then again with your level of education you would not realize that.

[clayton2127]

Like you said, some people just arnt humble. I mean, you gotta think about on a daily basis, how many a$$holes you run into that there manorisms are just god awful. Sometimes its not their fault, they just dont know any better. Some people are just not social people, or know how to get things out the proper way. If this was an issue, someone should have just said it. I mean, from what I see up there, the first post was an answer that was not needed and he even said not to post things of that nature.. and then someone gave a smart a$$ answer then someone called him a dumbass lol. All im sayin is that someone should have nicely said that the post was disrepectful instead of just being disrespectful in return. like everyones parents told them, 2 wrongs dont make a right. although, sometimes it does make u feel better, lol. maybe if he came an apologized for being a dick, you all would feel better, i dunno, but usually there is a reason for people to come off like that. Anyways, i think we should get back to the questions because like i said, they are pretty legit questions and i am always in the mood for new info as well as everyone else.lol

[clayton2127]

btw i was typing as that post was being published lol

[clayton2127]

I think we need to try to start over. This is going to be a worthless post for everyone if this continues. Im sure there are people who have the same questions he has ( just like most other posts). So why dont we just all agree than human beings are assholes and people make mistakes lol.. Im sure the hundreds of people that are going to view this post dont want to see a bunch of grown men fighting about respect and acting like teenagers a week before their menstrual cycle haha..

[sixoner]

well for what its worth then

my stats are somewhat similar with the exception that, I am 15yrs older, 1"shorter and have achieved that body weight in the past with less percentage of body fat and have never cylced before ever. the OP claims to have cycled before several times and he is 22. so in my opinion he severely lacks dedication, discipline, or knowledge or all three combined. his pct sounds weak. his body fat is too high. and for somebody that will be avoiding estrogen related side effects at all costs he has not listed the use of any AI's for prevention. so again he lacks knowledge there for should probably ask in a nicer way or do more research because there's no telling what else could be wrong

fair enough???

[clayton2127]

Now thats what im talkin bout lol.

[JohnnyVegas]

Nahh man your the dumbass because you contribute absolutely nothing constructive to my original point but to decide to pick on a mute point about my age. Yes like the guy said above I am going to take it with or without your 'permission'. Do me and everyone else a favor and do not post anything else on this forum. FYI I looked at your other posts to other forums and again you speak like a person with a 8th grade education level giving your opinion and nothing constructive to say to those people. Giving a 5 word response does nothing to help anyone, it just shows your ignorance. Posting the thing about Arnold was suppose to be a comical thing (because I was dismissing your comment about my age and posting something stupid) but then again with your level of education you would not realize that.

Being rude will get you nowhere here, no matter what age you are.

People on this forum will generally not help youth start cycling. A mod or vet could just have well said only that you are too young. You haven't been singled out; there are currently several people being told they are too young on the first page or two of this forum.

Since you are degrading others on their education level, I will point out it is "moot" point.

[Maverick_J8]

Height: 5’7”
Weight: 192 lbs
BF: 16%
Age:22


Goal: Gain about 10-15lbs of lean quality muscle. Decrease my bf% to <10%.

Note to all: Criticism is welcome but if you decide to say something negative you better have a better way at doing it. If not keep your yap shut. [i.e. I don’t want nor need unbased attacks e.g. yo bro you don’t know what you’re doing ]

12 week super cutter cycle
Juice Dosage:

Trenbolone Acetate: 100mg EOD wk 1-12

Tren should not be run for this long. Cut back to 6 weeks. Dose is fine. Consider starting at 75 if never used before to see how your body reacts to sides, if any, then bump up to 100.

Winstrol Tabs: 50 mg ED wk 4-10

I'd personally run the winny from week 6 onwards. As per above.

Testosterone Propionate: 100mg EOD wk 1-3,10-12 [6 weeks total]; 150mg EOD wk 4-9[6 weeks total]

Just stick with 100 eod all the way through. No need to increase and decrease.

HCG: 250-500 mg EOD wks 10-12 <-- have not decided yet on exact dosage but it will be in this range.

Albuterol Sulfate: 10-15 mg/day for two weeks at a time. Planned cycle is for wks 1-2, 5-6, 9-10. If you do not know what albuterol and think I am crazy read the article about this chemical on this site first.

PCT:
Nolvadex- start taking pills 3 days after last injection. 40 mg/day wks 13-14 [total 2 weeks], 20mg/day wks 15-16[ total 2 weeks], Then done.

Supplements:
To prevent sore joints and inflammatory effects from the Winstrol I will combat it with the following:
Glucosamine Sulfate [I know to start taking this 1 month before I start my cycle], Hyaluronic Acid, Chondroitin Sulfate, Methylsulphonylmethane (MSM), Concentrated Fish Oil, (Magnesium and Calcium as an added bonus for bone strength) . I might make a late add of a potassium supplement if I feel I need it during the cycle.

Also will be taking a diuretic.

Other supplements I am taking and will continue to take:
EGCg (green tea extract)
Vitamin C
MultiVitamin.

Other:
Blood Test (before, halfway, and after)-Full Blood Count, Liver and Kidney function test, FSH, LH, TSH, Cholesterol

Diet: It it key and more important than juice IMO but for sake of brevity I will not go into it here. Also do not ask me about my diet because I will not post it. Take a leap of faith with me and assume I know how to eat properly and healthy to get the most benefit out of this cycle [what do you think I would spend all this time and money on juicing just to have a sloppy diet, ha]. This post is about the juice not my diet.

Lastly I will be upfront and tell you my 3 main concerns. Hopefully someone who knows what they are talking about will reply and give me a decent answer.
1) The length and dosage of trenbolone. Obviously I know how potent it is so I want to know if this will be too long of a cycle. If I should cut it down to 10 weeks should I also cut down the test to ten weeks the also? I also know that the difference between 8 weeks or 12 weeks can be the difference between a good cycle or not so this is why I am a little concerned. For those wondering I have not taken any type of Tren before. I have done several cycles with the main steroid being testosterone [Also will not go into it here, again you have to trust me that I know what I am doing with my body].
2) I am avoiding estrogen related side effects at all costs (water retention, bitch tits, ect) so I want to know if you think 150mg of Test Prop EOD might be too much and will cause those undesirable side effects.
3) I am concerned about the alleged ‘tren cough’ and ‘test flu’. I know this much, it happens at the start of a cycle with short acting injectible esters. I do know for people who have this issue, there is a correlation that they are most likely injecting too much too early in the cycle. That is why I am going low and approaching my dosing schedule as a pyramid [ Incline dosing pattern at the start, level off, then a proper decline dosage at the end].

Again any feedback would be awesome. Thanks!

See bold.

Briefly on the above questions, you can run test for as long as preferred. 10-12 weeks all the way through will be fine. Test will also help in solidifying some of the gains as you come towards end of cycle.

I'll let someone else comment on the PCT.

And to the 'too young' comments - 23 too young? Cut the stock responses.

He's also mentioned he's done 3 previous cycles, which makes the comment even more stupid.

He's showed he's researched and has shown some knowledge and intelligence in his post. Besides, bottom line 23 is not too young..

[Maverick_J8]

and? this makes it ok to start juiceing then? your post means nothing at all and shows your a dumb ass...

This response is just pointless and unnecessary.

[Maverick_J8]

the guy came in with an attitude clayton...just because its the internet does not mean manners are out the window

not everybody is humble fine.. but how the fuk do you come into a place to ask questions in regards to something as complex and potentially hazardous to your health as steroids and at the same time demand just what and in which manner you require to receive the information..

respect counts

I didn't pick up on any attitude.

"Again any feedback would be awesome. Thanks!" shows he is in need of some advice and help and appreciates the feedback.

Let's grow up.

[JohnnyVegas]

I didn't pick up on any attitude.

I think he was talking about this in the original post:

Note to all: Criticism is welcome but if you decide to say something negative you better have a better way at doing it. If not keep your yap shut.

I didn't say anything until the "dumbass" and "8th grade education level" comments started flying. Personally, I hope OP turns into a solid member that sticks around beyond getting his first post question answered and attacking anyone that says something he disagrees with.

[Maverick_J8]

I think he was talking about this in the original post:



I didn't say anything until the "dumbass" and "8th grade education level" comments started flying. Personally, I hope OP turns into a solid member that sticks around beyond getting his first post question answered and attacking anyone that says something he disagrees with.

I think he was talking about this in the original post:



I didn't say anything until the "dumbass" and "8th grade education level" comments started flying. Personally, I hope OP turns into a solid member that sticks around beyond getting his first post question answered and attacking anyone that says something he disagrees with.

I did see the comment, but completely ignored it. Besides, if someone had a problem with the tone there are loads of better ways to point it out.

The 'too young' comment completely confused me and made no sense whatsoever.

Then to call the guy a dumbass in response to a genuine comment. Any negative comments from the thread-starter from that point onwards were simply provoked.

Anyway.. forgotten.

Hopefully he sticks around

[sixoner]

just to clear up any misunderstandings in the open. i read the original post and i am 100% positive that I am sure how I interpreted it. he seemed to have an I know what i'm doing so don't disagree with me attitude. if you feel you interpreted it a different way then that is fine I still respect you just the same maverick.

in the original post it clearly states his age as being 22yrs. unless he is unsure of his age or you know something I don't. why the discrepancy with his age now...if we wait another 12 hrs perhaps he will be older? younger?

hes a young guy of 22yrs and has done multiple cycles yet hes is at 190and high body fat.....but he states dont ask me about diet dont ask me about what gear i've done just assume i know what im doing.......well no I wont assume anything. I stand by my statement and that is something is wrong with his plan because he is not getting results that justify numerous cycles already at his age.

what exactly do I need to grow up about?????? did I insult somebody here? he made the arnold comment i simply said good luck then arnold, seemed fitting.

maverick. youre saying he's 23, youre saying he has done 3 previous cycles i dont see this information available....original post 22 years old, several cycles is what he stated

[Tigershark]

Arnold started juicing when he was 15 fyi...

OMFG! That is your defense. You are the reason why steroids have a bad name.

[mjohs88]

Here is my updated response:

1) I posted this "Criticism is welcome but if you decide to say something negative you better have a better way at doing it. If not keep your yap shut. [i.e. I don’t want nor need unbased attacks e.g. yo bro you don’t know what you’re doing". Ok interpret this comment however you would like [people still read the bible literally today like we are in the year 1 AD]...point being everyone interprets everything differently and I apologize for not being as clear as I can. Trust me when I say this though. I have been looking on this website for many years and only now decided to join and post something. I have a great impression from majority of the postings [and responses] on this website as I think many other people do that have prevented me from joining and asking honest questions. Many people [define 'many' as how you like] are very cut, dry, and cirtical in their responses which do nothing to further the honest attempt of the OP (and others who read their posts inquiring knowledge). All it does it create an enviroment, which in my opinion makes people fearful of what to post and even sign up. Granted it prevents many people also from posting 'stupid questions' but at the same time you lose many more potential value adding members in the process, which I do not think is a good trade for this community. People have almost this 'You do not know what you are doing' attitude and instead of help that person only decided to rant and rave on and focus on how 'young', 'ignorant' or 'idiotic' they are. That is not fair and it does not further the goals of this website in my opinion. I have never seen in college a student ask a question to the professor (who knows all about the topic) and in front of the entire class make him/her look like an idiot (well maybe once or twice). Point being you 'who know all' should be giving information and helping 'the students' out instead of criticizing and bashing them. I think professors and people who do that have some sort of issue or complex and are only taking out their aggression on something irrelevant (kick the cat syndrome). You have to understand that to see why I posted my orginal comment at the start. Give me something constructive and I will respond. Give me negative energy and I will shut down. It is this negative energy that prevents people from joining and contributing. We all need to start being more conscious of our tone becuase it can be more costly than we think.

Also Thank you specifically Maverick J8 and clayton 2127 coming to my defense and for the very helpful comments.

Its ironic because the one thing I want to avoid became a reality (i.e. many people focusing on the choices that I make that are out of their control but instead ignore things they can constructively help with).

I am making changes to my cycle dosing and length as I have not started it (I was planning on it anyhow but this time I have some guidance on what to do) and I will post on here in the future btw

Thank you again.

P.S. No I do not use Arnold's age as my defense I meant that to say that everybody's choices are their own and rarely can be changed.