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  1. #1
    michiganfan2011 is offline New Member
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    First Cycle - Recommendations Requested

    Gang,

    I'm 37, 6'1" and 210. about 15% BF and currently doing a cycle of clen to drop BF. My diet is very solid - 65/20/10 Protein/Carbs/Fat - and my workout routine and cardio are also solid. I'm looking at doing a cycle of Anavar and Primobolan - because I only want to gain about 5 lbs and solidify / strengthen. My goal is to be at 200 lbs and 10% BF. Also, I'm not a fan of needles - and don't want anyone to know I'm taking any form of AAS. I'm thinking about doing a 6 to 8-week cycle. I'd like to get thoughts on PCT. I've done a lot of research on this, but nothing's better than advice from people who have been there and done it. Thanks.

  2. #2
    MR-FQ320's Avatar
    MR-FQ320 is offline This means war!
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    wheres the test ? you need test to be a base in all cycles, in fact you would be better to just do test only first cycle,

    PCT could look like this
    Nolva 40/40/20/20
    Clomid 100/100/50/50

    not quite sure about the diet, id like to see how you get those total daily macros, post up your typical daily diet

  3. #3
    tbjake34's Avatar
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    Above, test is king. But if ur looking for an oral only I would HIGHLY recommend tbol 60mg/day for 6-7 wks. I loved it zero sides zero shut down with amazing gains that i retained very well. Goodluck bro!

  4. #4
    michiganfan2011 is offline New Member
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    Ross -

    I guess I should clarify - first, It's not my first cycle - done Test and DBol in the past.

    I'm confident that I can get my BF down to 10% w/ diet and cardio, but I'd like to add some lean mass while doing so. I'm hiding this shit from my wife and can hide pills easier (in different) bottles vs. needles. I can also get Primo tabs - and cost isn't an issue to me right now.

    Here's what I'm thinking about doing:

    Week 1: 40mg Var / 200 mg Primo
    Week 2-7: 80mg Var / 400 mg Primo
    Week 8: 40mg Var / 200 mg Primo

    PCT:
    Week 9 and 10: 40mg Nova
    Week 11: 20mg Nova

    Is Clomid needed for PCT if I'm taking Nova as outlined above?

  5. #5
    songdog's Avatar
    songdog is offline ARs TOP DOG ~ MONITOR ~
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    if you are scared of needles stick to creatine.

  6. #6
    Blade15's Avatar
    Blade15 is offline Senior Member
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    Agreed^^ LOL

  7. #7
    michiganfan2011 is offline New Member
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    Clarification:

    Here's what I'm thinking about doing:

    Week 1: 40mg ED Var / 200 mg week Primo
    Week 2-7: 80mg ED Var / 400 week mg Primo
    Week 8: 40mg ED Var / 200 week mg Primo

    PCT:
    Week 9 and 10: 40mg ED Nova
    Week 11: 20mg ED Nova

  8. #8
    michiganfan2011 is offline New Member
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    READ OUR RULES BEFORE POSTING AGAIN -


    This is your only warning YOU will be banned if I see one more post Flaming!

  9. #9
    franklin 13 is offline New Member
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    if youre willing to inject try test prop for 8 weeks with a nolva/clomid pct
    prop will give you less bloat and with a good diet you should stay low bf
    test should be the basis of most if not all cycles, esp your first few cyles.

    your macros seem too exaggerated, i would drop protein while increasing fats( preferably mono, poly unsaturated fats) and carbs
    10% is too low for fats. try at least 15 if not 20.

    try something like 50/30/20 (p/c/f) instead of the 65/25/10 your are using/planning to use

  10. #10
    blackoutbandit is offline New Member
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    Wow..

  11. #11
    Windex is offline Staff ~ HRT Optimization Specialist
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    Quote Originally Posted by michiganfan2011 View Post
    Ross -

    I guess I should clarify - first, It's not my first cycle - done Test and DBol in the past.

    I'm confident that I can get my BF down to 10% w/ diet and cardio, but I'd like to add some lean mass while doing so. I'm hiding this shit from my wife and can hide pills easier (in different) bottles vs. needles. I can also get Primo tabs - and cost isn't an issue to me right now.

    Here's what I'm thinking about doing:

    Week 1: 40mg Var / 200 mg Primo
    Week 2-7: 80mg Var / 400 mg Primo
    Week 8: 40mg Var / 200 mg Primo

    PCT:
    Week 9 and 10: 40mg Nova
    Week 11: 20mg Nova

    Is Clomid needed for PCT if I'm taking Nova as outlined above?
    Anavar is a potent enough anabolic to cause shutdown of your HPTA (endocrine system). Testosterone MUST be in every cyle. If you cannot pin yourself don't take anabolics. Aside from creating biological problems, how would you explain to your wife you cannot get stiff for the next 3 months ?

  12. #12
    cantbetouched is offline Associate Member
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    Test is recommended to be in every cycle is does not have to be. there are a few threads that talk about this..
    If you are wanting to stick with an all oral tbol and var are great for solid/lean gains. pct would be pretty basic since you've cycled before id just go with nolva 40/40/20/20 would be good for this cycle.
    if your really wanting to cut down clen that your on now with t3 is a choice. Im looking to run this soon.
    Good luck man.

  13. #13
    Blade15's Avatar
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    >>>>>>>>>......

  14. #14
    nilrac is offline Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Windex View Post
    Anavar is a potent enough anabolic to cause shutdown of your HPTA (endocrine system). Testosterone MUST be in every cyle. If you cannot pin yourself don't take anabolics. Aside from creating biological problems, how would you explain to your wife you cannot get stiff for the next 3 months ?
    I disagree with this. I think if somebody wants to run var or tbol for 6wks or so for a cycle then that is their choice. As long as they run a PCT they will be fine as their system will recover much more quickly than if they were on Test only for 12wks for example (which is a recommended cycle). Part of how your HPTA recovers relates directly to how long you have been "on", not necessarily the compound. Yes, you feel great while on test and you might not feel as great on var only, but you should still get good gains if you train and eat properly and you should recover quickly if you run your PCT.

    Just my .02

  15. #15
    terraj's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tbjake34 View Post
    Above, test is king. But if ur looking for an oral only I would HIGHLY recommend tbol 60mg/day for 6-7 wks. I loved it zero sides zero shut down with amazing gains that i retained very well. Goodluck bro!
    You have been a member here from 2005 and you post that^^

    All steroids at a higher enough doses to give a LBM increase will suppress your HPTA.

  16. #16
    terraj's Avatar
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    Getting a bit carried away huh

  17. #17
    nilrac is offline Member
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    OK........ some real engaging and intelligent posts in this thread.

  18. #18
    D7M's Avatar
    D7M
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    Settle down with the flaming.

  19. #19
    marcus300's Avatar
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    x2 ^^ no flaming please

  20. #20
    MACHINE5150's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nilrac View Post
    I disagree with this. I think if somebody wants to run var or tbol for 6wks or so for a cycle then that is their choice. As long as they run a PCT they will be fine as their system will recover much more quickly than if they were on Test only for 12wks for example (which is a recommended cycle). Part of how your HPTA recovers relates directly to how long you have been "on", not necessarily the compound. Yes, you feel great while on test and you might not feel as great on var only, but you should still get good gains if you train and eat properly and you should recover quickly if you run your PCT.

    Just my .02
    ^^^Agreed.. confused on the primo.. are you doing oral primo or primo depot?? is you have done test beofer havent you already done injection cycles?? kinda confused here

  21. #21
    brad1986's Avatar
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    wow dude... sounds like your the insecure one. They didnt even disrespect at all what they said was actully beneficial. Injectable gear is far better on your system and side effects. Orals can/will destroy your liver and kidneys and because of liver filtration much more of the dose is needed for same effect. Imho they are right. If your scared of needles steroids may not be for you

  22. #22
    Swifto's Avatar
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    There's a lot of shit in this thread, flaming aside.

    Test does not have to be used in every cycle at all.

    Yeah, its optimal to use it, but if the cycle is planned accordingly, a form of Test does not have to be used because of sides IMHO.

    DHT-derivatives can be used to boost labido, energy and other compounds can be added for their own effects on protein synthesis, increasing mTOR, etc...

    I experiemented with a lot of compounds (not exogenous testosterone ) for years before going back to basing my cycles on Test again. Worked well, low sides, little HPTA impact, no loss of labido/energy...

  23. #23
    brad1986's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blade15 View Post
    How much you lift you F***ing F****T....???? or you just dont do squats and deads ????
    I think what michigan fan said was dumb and wrong but your not making a point blade15. How much you dead lift/squat has no corealation to fighing or ass kicking.

  24. #24
    Swifto's Avatar
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    If people keep posting pathetic immature posts not related to this thread, fighting and flaming each other, punishments will start getting handed out.

    Back to thread...

  25. #25
    cantbetouched is offline Associate Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Swifto View Post
    If people keep posting pathetic immature posts not related to this thread, fighting and flaming each other, punishments will start getting handed out.

    Back to thread...
    Laying the smack down!!! haha

  26. #26
    MR-FQ320's Avatar
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    wowsers, missed quite a lot there, TBH michaginfan i dont think your ready for AAS, you need to sort it out man, your scared of needles, what the wife thinks or finds out or anybody else for that matter , if thats the case then why bother at all ?

    ......................................

  27. #27
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