Everything going good then sudden crash

[nwjt]

I am taking 200 mg test per week for a couple months, nothing else. Been doing great. Sex drive was through the roof last week, sex about 25 times in a week.

However, suddenly it dropped. I am having a little ED. It felt like I was on PCT, low energy, low sex drive etc. Its like there is a numbness in my brain that blocks my sex drive. Energy levels are lower and strength has dropped slightly, but still definately high.

Sorry, but may be important, my semen has changed consistancy, like its bright white clumpy balls in it, low volume.

Drinking plenty of water etc.

I quit working out for almost 3 weeks. Just starting back up, could that of caused it?

Is there any theory that working out causes the test to absorb, and not working out makes you have Free T that could turn to E2?

I am having bloodwork next month but just thought odd. Just a sudden crash.

If you got any ideas let me know.

[THE-DET-OAK]

I see this alot, at this dose actually, when guys dont take an AI. 99% its high E. Aromasin at 25mg ED for 7-10 days will fix you right up, then go down to 12.5mg and see what happens. Then get your bloods so you can see where your at with the AI. only other solution is to lower dose to 125, usually.

BTW im assuming your on TRT, if not disregard my post.

[nwjt]

Ok, I will start my AI. I did take .25 mg of liquidex evertime I did an injection but quit doing it because it made my joints hurt.

Diregard dosage. I have liquidex, you think that is good enough or should I buy something else?

[THE-DET-OAK]

i like aromasin better cuase its easier to play with dosages and not drop E too much. adex will work, try .25mg ED til libido comes back then drop to .25mg 2x a week and see if it holds. if not .25mg EOD may be the dose for you. just got figure out what works, get feeling right, then get tested to be sure.

[nwjt]

Also, I have some tamifoxen left, but its been setting for like 6 months. Do I need an AI or do I need a recepter modulator like tamifoxen?

[THE-DET-OAK]

AI- no tamox. its worhtless for TRT dosages.

tell me more about you, are you on TRT???? did you just start therapy????? how old are you???? have you had bloods while on TRT before??? what are you trying to get from TRT?

[nwjt]

What is the stuff AR-r sells that is aromasin ?

I'll pick some up for future use. I just went with armidex since that is the trend.

[THE-DET-OAK]

also are you on HCG ?? aromasin is Exemestane

[nwjt]

"tell me more about you, are you on TRT???? did you just start therapy????? how old are you???? have you had bloods while on TRT before??? what are you trying to get from TRT? "
Cliffs:

-33 Yo.
-Trt, started 1 year ago in May.
-Cycled off in Oct, using tamox. and took HCG a few weeks before Horrible results, still recovering from that. Lots of fat gain, muscle loss, scarring back acne etc.
-Back on a few months ago.
-My prescribed dosage is 300 mg per week, I only take 200.
-Bloodwork done 4 times so far. Test was near the very bottom of the range, E2 non existant. (Can link to results if you wish, I posted them here)

Basically I blame andro poppers in my mid 20s. I gained tons of fat the next 5 years and couldnt get it off. Finally, I ate 1600 calls for 6 months and went from 205 to 175.

Went to doc to complain, low T found. Also low sex drive as well as some ED.

Got on T, jumped up to 192 in a few weeks. Cycled off T, dropped to 185, then shot up to 198 in 1 month.
Currently sitting at 200 and trying to get back down.

200 Mg of test puts me in the upper middle range of the T according to the tests they use at my clinic. So certainly not overboard but much higher than I am naturally.

I am still researching if I should stay on TRT or try to get off it.

Man I feel good while on it and I have very little side effects as long as I am consistent with the dosage. The problem above is the first problem I have ever had, and it may be related to excessive fat I have right not from cycling off before. Need to get bf% down.

Purpose? To stay in shape and be able to actually benefit from my workouts. Before I just got sore and no growth, despite years before of making great gains natually.

I also want to keep my sex drive up. I am a bit worried long term and may plant to cycle off again. I am prescribed HCG as well.

Yes I am prescribed HCG. I do it for a couple weeks every few months to keep testes from going away.

[THE-DET-OAK]

ok this is very easy a very easy fix for you my man.

you NEED HCG , the reason you got side effects is because it stimulates aromatization in the leydig cells. when this happens Estrogen rises and in turn testosterone drops. if you had AI with this it would not have been bad.

for now no HCG cause we do not want to make your problem worse.

there are 2 things you need to think about here.

by using 200 it sounds to me like your converting too much T to E. so a better dose for you would prolly be 125mg a week. I know this sounds strange, but you can keep your T levels as high as with 200mg if your not converting T to E. when we make E we make it from T, therefore T falls.

so the first thing I would do is get E in control with the AI like I suggested previously. meaning libido comes back you feel really good, no acne.

then i would drop to 125mg a week. add HCG @ 250iu 2x a week and keep same AI dose as you used to get feeling normal. then as long as joints dont hurt get E and T tested. If joints hurt, lower AI a LITTLE. see how you feel. if good get tested and now you have your perfect protocol.

[THE-DET-OAK]

If your confused, ask questions please.

[nwjt]

125mg is too low. 200 is too low to last all week.

I really think my bf% is the main issue, i am at 23%, and that is why i am making somuch e2. Do you agree that could be an issue?
I think I will reduce bodyfat first before changing protocol.

Do you know if not working out could cause e2 to rise?

[THE-DET-OAK]

its ok to reduce BF before changing. NO matter what we need an AI now. this will solve your current problems. BF% may be a contributing factor.although with supplemental doses it will not have as big of an impact.

125mg is prolly perfect though. remember when we add HCG that will add T to our blood. also by dropping T dosage we may not make as much E. this will increase T sensitivity, if you will.

Ive seen this many times, I work with guys about HRT, they all give me the same answer. I do not want to drop my T dosage, then when i finally convince them they realize it actually works out better. then you will need less AI to control E, and still hit levels of 600-800 in your trough.

do you see what I mean now?

when you put so much T in your body it says "holy shit this is too much", and it wants to decrease T levels. the only way it can do this is by converting to T. so even though we take 200mg we are esentially "wasting" some of the dosage.

by getting this worked out you will see performance of smaller dosages increase.

[THE-DET-OAK]

the key to figuring this out is to change 1 thing at a time.

[lifter65]

so people on trt need to take hcg ? why is that? I thought taking hcg to long could reduce your sensitivity to it?

[THE-DET-OAK]

HCG just makes you feel better on TRT, it can also increase libido. You dont HAVE to but as I explained above its silly not to use it as a tool to get some more T floating around in your body.

here is Crisler's take on it

"But there’s another metabolic reason to employ this protocol. The P450 Side Chain Cleavage enzyme, which converts CHOL into pregnenolone at the initiation of all three metabolic pathways CHOL serves as precursor (the sex hormones, glucocorticoids and mineralcorticoids), is actively stimulated, or depressed, by LH concentrations. It is intuitively consistent that during conditions of lowered testosterone levels , commensurate increases in LH production would serve to stimulate this conversion from CHOL into these pathways, thereby feeding more raw material for increased hormone production. And vice versa. Thus the addition of HCG (which also stimulates the P450scc enzyme) helps restore a more natural balance of the hormones within this pathway in patients who are entirely, or even partially, HPTA-suppressed."

as far HCG desensitization, its a myth, bro-lore, it doesnt happen in real life.

[lifter65]

ok thank you that clears things up

[nwjt]

Does HCG do anything if you have primary hypogonadism?

[THE-DET-OAK]

no..................................primary means testicular failure, secondary means LH and FSH are not going out from the pituitary. so if the testicle wont react to normal FSH and LH it def wont react to LH analog. I guess you could make a case on crislers statement, but prolly not a strong one.

[nwjt]

Im pretty sure mine is secondary as my testes get bigger again when I use HCG . Whats the fastest way to get my E2 down? I noticed my acne is flaring up a bit. Going to start a round of antibiotics.