Sust, Mast, Anavar First Cycle Questions

**Truewop** · 06-21-2011, 03:53 PM

I just have some questions on my first cycle im currently Injecting 100mg mast EOD, 0.5ml Sust350 (I would be taking test but was unable to get my hands on it) Twice a week and 40mg of Anavar ED. Ill also have Arimidex on hand and probably start taking it a week into my cycle

My specs are:
Height - 5'8
Weight - 163lbs
Body Fat % - 10-15 (Im not exactly sure howmuch body fat but im not a big guy. To be honest i think 10 - 15 is more then what i have but i dont know forsure)
Age - 22

I go to the gym everyday after work for a minimum of an hour

So my question here is are the doses im currently taking sufficient for my first cycle and howlong until i see results also i dont have a PCT set up yet (yes i know thats a no no, i should have it thought up before i start my cycle but i figure i have 10 - 12 weeks to figure out which route to take) and would like some suggestions on what to take for PCT

Thanks in advance

**Noles12** · 06-21-2011, 03:55 PM

I would hold off a couple of years. You are too young imo. Not to mention that is a little much for a first cycle

**Truewop** · 06-21-2011, 04:01 PM

Ok not really the answer i was looking for but thank you for replying. Now lets just pretend that i did wait a few years because honestly i appreciate your concern but im going to go ahead with my cycle anyways and am still looking for some advice on the route iv decided to take so id appreciate if anyone could give me some advice on my cycle

thanks

**Noles12** · 06-21-2011, 04:05 PM

Originally Posted by Truewop

Ok not really the answer i was looking for but thank you for replying. Now lets just pretend that i did wait a few years because honestly i appreciate your concern but im going to go ahead with my cycle anyways and am still looking for some advice on the route iv decided to take so id appreciate if anyone could give me some advice on my cycle

thanks

Well you may find it hard to get what you are wanting to hear here. Most guys do not condone AAS usage at your age, myself included, due to it the potential permanent side effects. We hear it everyday, "what if i ran it in a few years, what should i do?". I personally dont provide information that i deem is unsafe. Therefore i have nothing to help you with other than to deter you from your decision

**smc88** · 06-21-2011, 04:12 PM

for PCT id run clomid and tamoifan, not sure on how long after you course id start, check the PCT section on the forum menu, theres a sticky stating your start times. as for your results it aldepends massivly on your diet but i should imagine around 4 to 5 weeks. when you say 50mg of sust350 how often ?

**Truewop** · 06-21-2011, 04:13 PM

Well thanks anyways Noles. If there's anyone that reads this thread that is willing to help me out id be very grateful

**Truewop** · 06-21-2011, 04:14 PM

Sorry thats a typo i meant 0.5ml twice a week so 350mg a week

**smc88** · 06-21-2011, 04:15 PM

but at the end of the day the gear is going to get taken anyway, so wouldnt it be best to advice on how to do it as ''safely'' as possible, instead of them doing it blind and on hearsay? and as a result doing it unsafe ?

**Truewop** · 06-21-2011, 04:18 PM

I feel the same way Smc88

**Truewop** · 06-21-2011, 04:19 PM

and thanks for the info

**Noles12** · 06-21-2011, 04:23 PM

Originally Posted by smc88

but at the end of the day the gear is going to get taken anyway, so wouldnt it be best to advice on how to do it as ''safely'' as possible, instead of them doing it blind and on hearsay? and as a result doing it unsafe ?

No because i do not see a safe way of doing it at your age. Why does the gear have to be taken anyways? You cant hold off and wait until it is safer for you?

I will leave others to respond. I have tried to help but since it isnt what you want to hear you think it hasnt helped. Goodluck with whatever decision you make

**Hazard** · 06-21-2011, 04:26 PM

Originally Posted by smc88

but at the end of the day the gear is going to get taken anyway, so wouldnt it be best to advice on how to do it as ''safely'' as possible, instead of them doing it blind and on hearsay? and as a result doing it unsafe ?

You aren't the first and surely wont be last to use this argument.....

It goes beyond that..... it's an ethical situation. Lets say I don't feel someone is ready to cycle..... but I give him the advice because he states he's going to continue anyway. Now lets say something bad does happen and a friend or familly member knew he was posting here. What if theys ee 5 guys say "you aren't ready to cycle....." but then they see that I gave him the advice...... not good.

If a person feels that it's morally wrong to give someone advice because of their age or lack of knowledge then they are in no way encouraged to go against their beliefs. If someone does not get advice - they are responsible for making their own choice. If something bad happens - it's completely on them.

~Haz~

**Hazard** · 06-21-2011, 04:35 PM

Originally Posted by smc88

for PCT id run clomid and tamoifan, not sure on how long after you course id start, check the PCT section on the forum menu, theres a sticky stating your start times. as for your results it aldepends massivly on your diet but i should imagine around 4 to 5 weeks. when you say 50mg of sust350 how often ?

Let me also just say that if you don't completely understand what you are talking about..... please refrain from giving advice. You gave him 2 compounds for pct with no information how how much or how long to run them. Yes there is a PCT thread and your initial response should have been:

"You clearly aren't ready to cycle..... you have much to learn yet. Start at the PCT thread to get a better understanding of how to bring back your natural testosterone levels "

A lot of guys want to get big and look great at the fvcking beach but don't know the first thing about what they are doing to their body. It's not just injecting these oils and then magically looking pretty with no reprocussions. You are chemically changing your body..... you stopping some natural processes..... your risking damage to your body withjout knowing wtf you are doing. Also..... you need to UNDERSTAND what you research..... just reading a pct thread doesn't make you an expert in post cycle therapy . You should have an understanding of why the testes shut down, what happens to lh/fsh levels, how to bring those things back, and what to do if conventional therapies don't work......

~Haz~

**Truewop** · 06-21-2011, 04:35 PM

I guess ill just have to go post somewhere else. Thanks everyone for replying

**Truewop** · 06-21-2011, 04:39 PM

Your taking the time to sit here and say how i should go do some research and figure it out... what do you think im doing here.. im asking for advice on the safest route to take while doing research on every aspect of the gear im taking... if everyone on this site knew what to do for their cycles why the hell is there a "questions and answers" page.

**Noles12** · 06-21-2011, 04:43 PM

Originally Posted by Truewop

Your taking the time to sit here and say how i should go do some research and figure it out... what do you think im doing here.. im asking for advice on the safest route to take while doing research on every aspect of the gear im taking... if everyone on this site knew what to do for their cycles why the hell is there a "questions and answers" page.

We are hoping your research would showing you the best way to go about it, which would be to wait a few years. This section is for us to help with the best of our knowledge which i think we have done. We have many guys everyday say that we arent helping because we say they are too young or we dont give them what they want to hear.

This section isnt to tell you what you want to hear but rather for what you need to hear

**smc88** · 06-21-2011, 04:44 PM

i do agree, to an extent, it seems to be a bit of a catch 22 situation, how is an inexperienced user suppose to gain knowledge if the more experienced people wont give advice? im by no means looking for an argument here but it seems that nowadays alot of youngsters turn to steroids because friends do or they see others at the gym on it ect ect so i think it would be in thier best interest to know how to take it correctly what the correct PCT to run is etc etc. but i dont agree on people takin it if thet have never trained before, a base training is always a must or if they dont know the importance of a diet. i myself have been told not to cycle as im ''too young'' but i belive ive done enough re-search and have gained enough knowledge to start cycling, iv got a good diet, got a good base training in behind me, have a well planned cycle including hcg and an ai, and an appropriate pct for recovery, and in myself i feel ready to cycle. but like i said im not looking for an argument these are just my views

**Noles12** · 06-21-2011, 04:47 PM

Originally Posted by smc88

i do agree, to an extent, it seems to be a bit of a catch 22 situation, how is an inexperienced user suppose to gain knowledge if the more experienced people wont give advice? im by no means looking for an argument here but it seems that nowadays alot of youngsters turn to steroids because friends do or they see others at the gym on it ect ect so i think it would be in thier best interest to know how to take it correctly what the correct PCT to run is etc etc. but i dont agree on people takin it if thet have never trained before, a base training is always a must or if they dont know the importance of a diet. i myself have been told not to cycle as im ''too young'' but i belive ive done enough re-search and have gained enough knowledge to start cycling, iv got a good diet, got a good base training in behind me, have a well planned cycle including hcg and an ai, and an appropriate pct for recovery, and in myself i feel ready to cycle. but like i said im not looking for an argument these are just my views

Enough research and training does not mean one is ready to cycle. Research does not change the damage AAS can do at a young age

**Truewop** · 06-21-2011, 04:50 PM

Originally Posted by Noles12

We are hoping your research would showing you the best way to go about it, which would be to wait a few years. This section is for us to help with the best of our knowledge which i think we have done. We have many guys everyday say that we arent helping because we say they are too young or we dont give them what they want to hear.

This section isnt to tell you what you want to hear but rather for what you need to hear

Well everyone is entitled to their opinion i was just hoping someone with a lot of experience would give me some advice but thats alright ill just keep up the research throughout my cycle and figure out the best way to go

**Truewop** · 06-21-2011, 04:52 PM

Originally Posted by Noles12

Enough research and training does not mean one is ready to cycle. Research does not change the damage AAS can do at a young age

At such low doses you figure it will do much dmg even with the proper precautions taken?

**Hazard** · 06-21-2011, 04:52 PM

Originally Posted by Truewop

Your taking the time to sit here and say how i should go do some research and figure it out... what do you think im doing here.. im asking for advice on the safest route to take while doing research on every aspect of the gear im taking... if everyone on this site knew what to do for their cycles why the hell is there a "questions and answers" page.

Because before you cycle..... you should have researched enough to know wtf you are doing. You should know what pct to run and how long to run it. The questiosn and answer thread isn't a place to lay out a cycle, it's not a place to write pages on how to do something the right way. The base of your knowledge should come from your own research using this website and any other media you feel is reputable enough. The question and answer forum is for the things that come durring a cycle..... it's for guys to verify that what they had planned looks safe.... it's to help guys who have fvcked something up..... and it's here to prevent guys from fvcking up (which has been it's purpose for you)

Originally Posted by smc88

i do agree, to an extent, it seems to be a bit of a catch 22 situation, how is an inexperienced user suppose to gain knowledge if the more experienced people wont give advice? im by no means looking for an argument here but it seems that nowadays alot of youngsters turn to steroids because friends do or they see others at the gym on it ect ect so i think it would be in thier best interest to know how to take it correctly what the correct PCT to run is etc etc. but i dont agree on people takin it if thet have never trained before, a base training is always a must or if they dont know the importance of a diet. i myself have been told not to cycle as im ''too young'' but i belive ive done enough re-search and have gained enough knowledge to start cycling, iv got a good diet, got a good base training in behind me, have a well planned cycle including hcg and an ai, and an appropriate pct for recovery, and in myself i feel ready to cycle. but like i said im not looking for an argument these are just my views

I spent YEARS on this site reading every single thread I could. I read all the stickies.... I used the search function and found threads that were IMO sticky worthy. Also.... i'm not sitting here with all this knowledge and not offering it up..... and my point wasn't directed at you needing to research more. It was merely to state that without being knowledgable enough to give advice to someone..... don't give the advice.

While we are at it...... You said in your initial post that you weren't sure when he should start his pct. Now your saying that you feel you've done enough research that you know what you are doing and feel you are ready to cycle. If you can't tell him when he needs to start pct how are you knowledgable enough to run a cycle?

This website is about giving "safe advice" to people who we feel are ready to run a cycle...... thats it.....

~Haz~

**Noles12** · 06-21-2011, 04:56 PM

Originally Posted by Truewop

At such low doses you figure it will do much dmg even with the proper precautions taken?

Low doses still suppress your HPTA function, can prematurely close growth plates, and suppress your natural test production. The suppression of these hormones can be permanent even with a PCT. Regaining your levels after cycle is not guaranteed. Low test will lead to low libido, depression, lethargy, and other symptoms that im sure at 22 you wouldnt want to have. This means required weekly injections for life just to feel "normal" again

I prefer to keep guys off that path if i can

**smc88** · 06-21-2011, 04:56 PM

because i no when to start my pct for the compounds i am planning on taking

**Truewop** · 06-21-2011, 04:59 PM

Originally Posted by Noles12

Low doses still suppress your HPTA function, can prematurely close growth plates, and suppress your natural test production. The suppression of these hormones can be permanent even with a PCT. Regaining your levels after cycle is not guaranteed. Low test will lead to low libido, depression, lethargy, and other symptoms that im sure at 22 you wouldnt want to have. This means required weekly injections for life just to feel "normal" again

I prefer to keep guys off that path if i can

I knew it would suppress my natural test production thats the reason i added the test into my cycle i just figured 350mg a week would be enough. I have no problem taking 1ml twice a week (700mg EW) if that works better for my body. These are the types of questions/answers im looking for that way i dont do permanent damage to my body. Thanks

**Noles12** · 06-21-2011, 05:05 PM

Originally Posted by Truewop

I knew it would suppress my natural test production thats the reason i added the test into my cycle i just figured 350mg a week would be enough. I have no problem taking 1ml twice a week (700mg EW) if that works better for my body. These are the types of questions/answers im looking for that way i dont do permanent damage to my body. Thanks

I dont think you understand what i mean by the suppression due to using AAS. Yes test is recommended when cycling due to that suppression on cycle but that only solves the problem while on cycle. The problem is your body is still not producing any natural test for an extended period of time because it has no need to. Therefore you come off and you are still suppressed. This can lead to it never coming back. This is one of the reasons why it is not recommended at all at your age.

**Hazard** · 06-21-2011, 05:13 PM

Originally Posted by Truewop

At such low doses you figure it will do much dmg even with the proper precautions taken?

It's a very individual thing..... no ammount of research or knowledge can predict whats going to happen to you. Shutting down your test level can mean that it wont retun to the levels they were at before you ran the cycle. Even with a propper PCT - you may not recover to the levels you were at pre-cycle.

Thats what guys don't understand..... it's a comittment. Is one or two cycles worth low test for life? It may not happen..... but it could.....

~Haz~

**Truewop** · 06-21-2011, 05:13 PM

Originally Posted by Noles12

I dont think you understand what i mean by the suppression due to using AAS. Yes test is recommended when cycling due to that suppression on cycle but that only solves the problem while on cycle. The problem is your body is still not producing any natural test for an extended period of time because it has no need to. Therefore you come off and you are still suppressed. This can lead to it never coming back. This is one of the reasons why it is not recommended at all at your age.

And this is also why i asked for advice on my PCT. Im sure i can do some more research and check forums to see the best PCT to take but id prefer getting some one on one advice. I understand that im still young but i do not plan on taking any steroids after this cycle so its more of a one time deal for me and i dont see a point in waiting a few more years, i have been working out since i was 14 and just want that little extra boost to get my body the way i want it and to maintain that on my own. Im not trying to gain mass im just trying to lean out and get ripped. Thats why i chose to go this route

**Truewop** · 06-21-2011, 05:14 PM

Originally Posted by Hazard

It's a very individual thing..... no ammount of research or knowledge can predict whats going to happen to you. Shutting down your test level can mean that it wont retun to the levels they were at before you ran the cycle. Even with a propper PCT - you may not recover to the levels you were at pre-cycle.

Thats what guys don't understand..... it's a comittment. Is one or two cycles worth low test for life? It may not happen..... but it could.....

~Haz~

I totally understand your concern and this is a chance im willing to take

**Hazard** · 06-21-2011, 05:16 PM

Originally Posted by Truewop

I totally understand your concern and this is a chance im willing to take

Fair enough.... good luck

~Haz~

**Noles12** · 06-21-2011, 05:21 PM

Originally Posted by Truewop

And this is also why i asked for advice on my PCT. Im sure i can do some more research and check forums to see the best PCT to take but id prefer getting some one on one advice. I understand that im still young but i do not plan on taking any steroids after this cycle so its more of a one time deal for me and i dont see a point in waiting a few more years, i have been working out since i was 14 and just want that little extra boost to get my body the way i want it and to maintain that on my own. Im not trying to gain mass im just trying to lean out and get ripped. Thats why i chose to go this route

Your thinking is flawed. Everyone says i am only going to cycle once. It doesnt happen.

Working out since you were 14 doesnt change your age now. Nor does it develop your HPTA faster or speed your growth. It does not change the chances of your levels not recovering . You are being hard headed as do many guys that are told they are too young. IMO the risks far outweigh the benefits

Getting "ripped" is easily obtained naturally with proper diet and nutrition.

**Hazard** · 06-21-2011, 05:29 PM

I was only going to do one cycle also...... 75lbs later i'm still going lmfao

~Haz~

**AussieOak** · 06-21-2011, 05:31 PM

I dont mean to intrude here but I was just wondering if Noles12 and Hazard would mind taking a look at my thread please "Thoughts on a Stanazol and Clenbuterol stack". Ive read a lot of posts from you guys. It seems you really know your stuff. I was going to try and PM you but couldnt figure out how (newish here). Sorry for the intrusion.

**Truewop** · 06-21-2011, 10:52 PM

Ok so iv taken everything you guys have said into consideration and am wondering if i decide to go 20 days on mast, 25 on var, while taking sust the whole time and then transitioning into a sust tren cycle at the end of the 30 days would this be totally retarded or am i able to do this without any harmful effects? the reason im thinking about doing it this way is because i have paid for 20 days of mast and 25 of var already and really dont want to waste the money and to be honest you guys scared me away from the AAS.

Let me know what you think

**Noles12** · 06-21-2011, 11:04 PM

Originally Posted by Truewop

Ok so iv taken everything you guys have said into consideration and am wondering if i decide to go 20 days on mast, 25 on var, while taking sust the whole time and then transitioning into a sust tren cycle at the end of the 30 days would this be totally retarded or am i able to do this without any harmful effects? the reason im thinking about doing it this way is because i have paid for 20 days of mast and 25 of var already and really dont want to waste the money and to be honest you guys scared me away from the AAS.

Let me know what you think

It would be completely retarded. Tren is the one of the most harsh compounds you could possibly use. The splits you have posted make no sense whatsoever.

AAS could easily be kept for 2 years for when you are ready. You wouldnt be wasting your money

**408gt91** · 06-21-2011, 11:06 PM

20 days is a joke cycle #1 #2 Tren on a first cycle is a real bad idea. #3 Even if you were ready, you dont know how your body will react to 1 of those compounds let alone 4. I shut myself down at 22 for about 8 months just running deca cause i was clueless.
Im running sust and mast right now and the prop in them gives me sides like a mofo and i have had a lot of experiance w these.
Your body is making enough test to gain like you are juicing. you just have to put in some work, gordge yourself with protein, and get a training partner that knows how to lift. muscle hypertrophy look it up.