Doesnt It Make Sense to Start Smaller?

[70sAesthetics]

testosterone should be the base for every cycle

"not for a beginner man, you wont put someone who barely knows how to drive in a mercedes. why do you think a lot of amateurs peak so early? because their first cycle is test, the receptors get used to something strong, its all about taking it step by step, if you do 500 grams a week, next cycle, you'd have to go to 750. then what? 1000 on your third cycle? if you start winny tablets for your first cycle, at 50 mg a day, second cycle, you could add primobolan, and thats how it goes..."

And quoted from William LLewellyn's Anabolics 9th Edition: "AAS should be limited to the minimum dosage necessary to achieve the next realistic training/performance goal".

Is there a lot of truth to the first quote? I am aware the most popular first cycle seems to be testE/Cyp at 500 mg/wk. But does it not make sense to start smaller, take smaller steps? I know that some people feel testosterone is a huge first step, and they really just need a "boost". Just to pack on a few pounds of lean, dry muscle that will remain after cycle. And repeat this maybe a few times over say a few years. And then at that point jump to testosterone? Does that not make more sense?

[JohnnyVegas]

Not sure what you are suggesting to take BEFORE testosterone. Many here, the wise ones, also believe in starting smaller and increasing only when needed. 400-500mg/week is a small enough dose that is it significantly larger than your body's natural production, but allows lots of room to grow. Despite what it says in your quote, you don't need to increase with each cycle, and certainly not 50%.

Others will chime in that have more knowledge than me.

[70sAesthetics]

Not sure what you are suggesting to take BEFORE testosterone. Many here, the wise ones, also believe in starting smaller and increasing only when needed. 400-500mg/week is a small enough dose that is it significantly larger than your body's natural production, but allows lots of room to grow. Despite what it says in your quote, you don't need to increase with each cycle, and certainly not 50%.

Others will chime in that have more knowledge than me.

I dont think the increasing test dosages were fact. More so just the point of that starting with testosterone even at 500mg is a huge step. When newbies to AAS could benefit from a smaller cycle, that wont give at much gains as test. But in the long run be better.

[sir.solidarity]

I'm also confused by what would precede test.
However, I agree with the idea of starting small.

I started with 250 ew, gained and kept 20lbs.

[70sAesthetics]

I'm also confused by what would precede test.
However, I agree with the idea of starting small.

I started with 250 ew, gained and kept 20lbs.

250 of what? Test? Doesnt the average young adult male produce around that much anyway?

[JohnnyVegas]

250 of what? Test? Doesnt the average young adult male produce around that much anyway?

No, less than that. My body changed when I went on 200mg/week Test Cyp for TRT. That dose won't give anyone the gains that 600mg/week would give, but I was surprised how much muscle I gained and how much fat I lost. Keep in mind that I was naturally making about as much Test as a 12 year old girl.

Still, I would like to know what LLewellyn recommends before taking Test. What could be milder or more simple? It is what the body makes, just in higher amounts.

[70sAesthetics]

No, less than that. My body changed when I went on 200mg/week Test Cyp for TRT. That dose won't give anyone the gains that 600mg/week would give, but I was surprised how much muscle I gained and how much fat I lost. Keep in mind that I was naturally making about as much Test as a 12 year old girl.

Still, I would like to know what LLewellyn recommends before taking Test. What could be milder or more simple? It is what the body makes, just in higher amounts.

He recommends dbol only cycle or a low dose test cycle like 250-350mg.

Also same dude from first quote:

Question: "for a very beginner cycle, if we only use oral steroids like you said, without any testosterone and at the lowest dosage, will it still give any significant effects..? Like extreme increase in strength and muscle mass (permanently if possible)"

Answer: "4 weeks of oral winstrol for example, with a very strict diet, and training routine, yes, you will see incredible results" (50mg per day).

I constantly hear people saying nothing good can come from an oral only cycle. Would 50mg of winny for a month as this guys says, be a good introductory cycle to AAS? For a good Boost from being natty for years.

[Bonaparte]

250 of what? Test? Doesnt the average young adult male produce around that much anyway?

Try 5-10mg daily.

[sir.solidarity]

At a young male's peak, an average of about 6mg is produced daily.

I was on 250mg of Test-E e/w.
250/7=35.7 e/d (obviously it fluctuates, but this is on average.)

583% increase.

I hope my math is correct.

[funkymonk]

Try 5-10mg daily.

Yup, which is the equivalent of roughly 100mg of Cyp on paper.

If you're going to do a low dose test cycle, remember that 100mg a week is a common TRT dose (IE: to match natty levels), however many people find themselves at optimal (but still in range) levels with closer to 200mg.

At a young male's peak, an average of about 6mg is produced daily.

I was on 250mg of Test-E e/w.
250/7=35.7 e/d (obviously it fluctuates, but this is on average.)

583% increase.

I hope my math is correct.

That's 250mg of testosterone enanthate. Test E is only about 70% actual test, the rest is the ester.

[DeniZen]

My first cycle was Test E only, and i started at 200mg per week, and increased to 500mg per week over a few weeks. Waste of time! Shoulda run 500 all the way thru.

[gixxerboy1]

You dont need to keep increasing test dosage every time. If that was true i would be running grams a week.