Natural looking muscles obtained by unatural means???

[texamwalker]

27 years old, 6'2'', 205 lbs. Ill start off by saying that im well aware that a structured diet and working out are by far the best means to obtain the physical fitness one would desire... i recently completed a full session of p90x and if anyone says that isnt one hell of a workout they are completely full of crap. i know it works because i lost 20 lbs, down to 189, had an amazing physique change, and never felt better. that being said, ive lost about 25% of where i was, and i want it back and then some. Again, i dont need resposes saying that i should just start a strenuous workout again and leave it at that.. i need education on what anabolics i should take, in which combination and length of cycle to obtain the best and quickest results. not body builder mass, just fat burning and lean definition. i know what it means to work hard, so for the lack of a better word, how can i "cheat" my way to where i want to be?

[bodybuilder]

Bro you need to start a strenuos workout. jk Id run a test alone cycle. Your diet will determine how much muscle and bf you gain. But, if your looking at getting a more natural look this can be achived fairly easy with a good diet up to you bro.

[gixxerboy1]

if all you want to do is cut. then diet and exercise is the answer.
steroids dont make you ripped. diet does

[texamwalker]

lets assume i know absolutley nothing..i would like a more detailed answer if ya dont mind

[bodybuilder]

if all you want to do is cut. then diet and exercise is the answer.
steroids dont make you ripped. diet does

x2 Head over to the diet section and check out some examples for a good cut.

[texamwalker]

again, i know whats best... that fairly obvious.. i dont plan on taking something and then sit on the couch and eat potato chips all day. the diet and exercise are a givin, i just want to know what i can add to that to expedite the process. ive seen plenty of people around that look great and i know for a fact its not all natural hard work.

[gixxerboy1]

sorry you dont like the truth

[bodybuilder]

In your original post you said you did not want "body builder mass". This is why your getting this type of response. There really is no need to put your body threw the stess that AAS will cause, why risk all the sides that come with steroid use if your goal is just to gain a little mass.

[texamwalker]

so your saying that there arent any steriods out there that will increase muscle mass, which will in turn, burn more fat that can be added to a workout like p90x to give more dramatic results than the workout will do alone?

[texamwalker]

In your original post you said you did not want "body builder mass". This is why your getting this type of response. There really is no need to put your body threw the stess that AAS will cause, why risk all the sides that come with steroid use if your goal is just to gain a little mass.

youre right.. i should of specified... what i meant was i would like to gain defined mass up to an extent... what i dont want is trap muscles that touch my ears and arms the size of cannon barrels..does that make sense?

[bodybuilder]

so your saying that there arent any steriods out there that will increase muscle mass, which will in turn, burn more fat that can be added to a workout like p90x to give more dramatic results than the workout will do alone?

No im not saying that at all. What im trying to tell you is for your goals they are completly unnecessary. Steroids are powerfull hormones that will effect your body in many diffrent ways.

[texamwalker]

No im not saying that at all. What im trying to tell you is for your goals they are completly unnecessary. Steroids are powerfull hormones that will effect your body in many diffrent ways.

ive researched the side effects and dangers of aas use... i know that they can cause extremely dangerous side effects...no offese at all intended, but im not asking what would be the healthiest thing for me to do, i know what that is. Assuming i didnt care about the health risks apart from stacking to the level of lethality, what would work the best to get the results

[bodybuilder]

A simple test only cycle. Look up first cycle her bro there are tons of examples her.

[texamwalker]

im new here, can you elaborate on test only cycle... or exactly where to go to read up on it

[JohnnyVegas]

Someone recently posted "If people can't tell you are on steroids, then you are doing it wrong." It may have been Gixxer, but that doesn't matter. That statement made me realize that AAS should only be taken by people that are looking for size that cannot be easily acquired naturally. If you want natural looking muscle mass, you should avoid drug use.

If you don't want to get really big, you will do well eating and lifting correctly. I know p90x is tough, which shows that you can do this.

Having said that, you can find info on starter/beginner cycles here that have more info than any one of us will sit down and type out for you.

[JAB1]

haha, sorry but the last post made me laugh about traps to the ears. Anyway, I think you got your answer man. Test only cycle is what your looking for. What these guys are saying is if you dont want "traps to your ears and cannon ball arms", then you may want to rethink aas, as you can achieve what you are asking alone with a little effort(diet and training) and no risk. aas will expidite the process if everything else is in check but you are increasing risk for no increased reward other than percieved time/effort savings. Something to contemplate. Also since you seem quite new Ill stat the obvious-test only also needs to include hcg/support/pct protocol.

[bodybuilder]

Someone recently posted "If people can't tell you are on steroids, then you are doing it wrong." It may have been Gixxer, but that doesn't matter. That statement made me realize that AAS should only be taken by people that are looking for size that cannot be easily acquired naturally. If you want natural looking muscle mass, you should avoid drug use.

If you don't want to get really big, you will do well eating and lifting correctly. I know p90x is tough, which shows that you can do this.

Having said that, you can find info on starter/beginner cycles here that have more info than any one of us will sit down and type out for you.

Great example bro. You see theres a reason why everyone is telling you the same thing buddy.

[Blade15]

Use Search button bro.. If you dont know where that button is... then go straight up, take right.. you will find it...

[texamwalker]

i guess what im saying is that there are tons of people that are extremly fit and look really good without looking like the hulk...ie movie stars, models, and most guys that find whatever reason they can to run around with no shirt on.. and i know that it isnt just exercise and diet alone...they are definiteley sticking something in their ass to help and i just wanted to know what that was...

[Blade15]

so you want to become movie star or model??? how much bf you have right now?? and How long you have been training your ass off?????

[JohnnyVegas]

If you want to look like Brad Pit, get a diet and exercise coach. You probably think I am kidding, but I'm not. I got a diet coach a while ago and my body changed considerably. She didn't tell me anything different than what I already knew, or what the guys in the nutrition section were saying...but it was a person that I was accountable to that I had to send progress pics to every Monday. My body changed more in those two months than any other two months since I got back in the gym at the beginning of the year. I should have used her as a lifting coach as well to break me out of some of the bad habits that I assume I have.

[texamwalker]

dont want to be one, looking more like one is what i had in mind...im at around 14% now, was down around 9%.. ive worked out very regularly through out college. ran 2 miles a day and stuck to a good diet until about 9 months ago when i decided to kick it up and do p90x..and i did it all including that riduculous diet of eating crap that tasted like cardboard...it was no joke, by far the hardest, most dedication dependant thing ive ever done and it paid off.. i felt better than i ever have and looked that way too..i just wasnt quite where i wanted to be. it seemed like i hit a wall. i just wanted something that i can supplement my workout to push the results further. i can live with the risks. working my ass off and dieting is the easy part for me believe it or not, i just wwant something to push my body further than it was naturally wired to do

[texamwalker]

If you want to look like Brad Pit, get a diet and exercise coach. You probably think I am kidding, but I'm not. I got a diet coach a while ago and my body changed considerably. She didn't tell me anything different than what I already knew, or what the guys in the nutrition section were saying...but it was a person that I was accountable to that I had to send progress pics to every Monday. My body changed more in those two months than any other two months since I got back in the gym at the beginning of the year. I should have used her as a lifting coach as well to break me out of some of the bad habits that I assume I have.

no disrespect, just wanna be on the same page... are you saying that you believe that brad pitt got to where he is by diet and exercise alone?

[pheenyx1]

Everthing people have said here is true. That said, what I hear you saying is you want to know what AAS are more for lean muscle gains. Test only is good for that (usually prop b/c it gives less bloat). You should start w/ test only anyway. After that, probably anavar and test. Do your research. Particularly on sides, and how not to get them, and PCT. People will help you out along the way, but you gotta put in a little effort.

[FONZY007]

no disrespect, just wanna be on the same page... are you saying that you believe that brad pitt got to where he is by diet and exercise alone?

Look at him in Troy he looked awesome!!

[gixxerboy1]

and he was probably 165lbs. Nothing diet and working out cant accomplish

[JohnnyVegas]

no disrespect, just wanna be on the same page... are you saying that you believe that brad pitt got to where he is by diet and exercise alone?

We have no way of knowing, but I know he CAN look like that naturally. He isn't that much bigger now than he was when he was 20 and ripped. He has obviously been serious about his body his entire life and is by no means a monster. I don't automatically think that every 180 pound guy is taking AAS, but I do assume that every 240 pound guy is.

Seriously, Pitt isn't that big (from Troy and Fight Club, click for larger photos):

[texamwalker]

Everthing people have said here is true. That said, what I hear you saying is you want to know what AAS are more for lean muscle gains. Test only is good for that (usually prop b/c it gives less bloat). You should start w/ test only anyway. After that, probably anavar and test. Do your research. Particularly on sides, and how not to get them, and PCT. People will help you out along the way, but you gotta put in a little effort.

thank you for actually answering the question i had ,in much better detail.... believe me i know what everyone has said is correct and said to help me with the right decisions...i dont dispute anything that has been said...i would never think that there is some miracle drug that could be taken that will change you physique to modellike without adding a large amount of effort in the diet and exercise department. i will do more research, it was just hard to do because of the massive amount of info out there...i think youve narrowed it down for me which should really help

[texamwalker]

We have no way of knowing, but I know he CAN look like that naturally. He isn't that much bigger now than he was when he was 20 and ripped. He has obviously been serious about his body his entire life and is by no means a monster. I don't automatically think that every 180 pound guy is taking AAS, but I do assume that every 240 pound guy is.

Seriously, Pitt isn't that big (from Troy and Fight Club, click for larger photos):

well several people would say that he is definitely pharmecuetically enhanced.... so for the sake of arguement, assuming he is, my question was ...what is out there on the market that you can add to a strenuous workout and diet that would get a person to looking like that. and im not talking about getting a 250 lb 40 year old to that, im talking about getting a 200 lb 27 year old that is already in great shape to that point because he cant quite seem to get there naturally...does that make sense?

[Far from massive]

There are a couple of things on this thread that really jump out at me.

You say you want a look simalar to Brad Pitt or other hollywood type peeps. OK first things first many of those on this board will jump all over this kind of statement saying Brad Pitt aint that big etc, many of these guys have 20 inch arms, unfortunately thay also and big traps that touch their ears, biceps that ball up and have no base, hairy backs and hairy shoulders, bald heads, skinny legs, fat bellies and are 5.2 and 215lbs. My point being Brad Pitt and the others who you speak of have phenominal genetics and physique without that as a base it does not matter what kind of workout you incorporate..you will never get the models body you seek.

Now if you do have the Genetics and physical base for this kind of look the only way you are likely to achieve it is with a trainer, a diet guru, and AAS etc. while its easy for some guy with 20 arms to say these guys could get there naturally yada yada yada unless they have ever tried to achieve washboard abs when they are over 25 and wieght more than 165 they really don't speak from a knowlegable position.

Just my opinion but unless you realistically have the balanced base to achieve this kind of physique then you are setting yourself up for dissapointment.

[texamwalker]

There are a couple of things on this thread that really jump out at me.

You say you want a look simalar to Brad Pitt or other hollywood type peeps. OK first things first many of those on this board will jump all over this kind of statement saying Brad Pitt aint that big etc, many of these guys have 20 inch arms, unfortunately thay also and big traps that touch their ears, biceps that ball up and have no base, hairy backs and hairy shoulders, bald heads, skinny legs, fat bellies and are 5.2 and 215lbs. My point being Brad Pitt and the others who you speak of have phenominal genetics and physique without that as a base it does not matter what kind of workout you incorporate..you will never get the models body you seek.

Now if you do have the Genetics and physical base for this kind of look the only way you are likely to achieve it is with a trainer, a diet guru, and AAS etc. while its easy for some guy with 20 arms to say these guys could get there naturally yada yada yada unless they have ever tried to achieve washboard abs when they are over 25 and wieght more than 165 they really don't speak from a knowlegable position.

Just my opinion but unless you realistically have the balanced base to achieve this kind of physique then you are setting yourself up for dissapointment.

that's a great response, all great info...and I believe that I definitely have the base and genetics to get where I want...I'm not unrealistic, I know that super fit guys like pitt are few and far between, I just want to get as close to that as my body, along with help, will allow me to..not sure if my pic shows up but you can see I'm not a whole hell of a long way off from my goals

[JohnnyVegas]

Now if you do have the Genetics and physical base for this kind of look the only way you are likely to achieve it is with a trainer, a diet guru, and AAS etc. while its easy for some guy with 20 arms to say these guys could get there naturally yada yada yada unless they have ever tried to achieve washboard abs when they are over 25 and wieght more than 165 they really don't speak from a knowlegable position.

I am trying to get my abs back at 43, and it is frickin' tough! No doubt a body like that is hard work.

[gearbox]

The body you want can be achieved with diet and YES p90x is a great cardio/muscle endurance workout. If you get your diet in check and stick to it I MEAN NO cheating for about 90 days I believe you will see GREAT results...and remember you may think you know alot about diet as i did too, then I went over to the diet section and read alot and heard from GBRice in the diet section...he is the man in that department and will answer all your questions...

[gearbox]

There are a couple of things on this thread that really jump out at me.

You say you want a look simalar to Brad Pitt or other hollywood type peeps. OK first things first many of those on this board will jump all over this kind of statement saying Brad Pitt aint that big etc, many of these guys have 20 inch arms, unfortunately thay also and big traps that touch their ears, biceps that ball up and have no base, hairy backs and hairy shoulders, bald heads, skinny legs, fat bellies and are 5.2 and 215lbs. My point being Brad Pitt and the others who you speak of have phenominal genetics and physique without that as a base it does not matter what kind of workout you incorporate..you will never get the models body you seek.

Now if you do have the Genetics and physical base for this kind of look the only way you are likely to achieve it is with a trainer, a diet guru, and AAS etc. while its easy for some guy with 20 arms to say these guys could get there naturally yada yada yada unless they have ever tried to achieve washboard abs when they are over 25 and wieght more than 165 they really don't speak from a knowlegable position.Just my opinion but unless you realistically have the balanced base to achieve this kind of physique then you are setting yourself up for dissapointment.

what a great response, I learned about this a few months back when trying to achieve the wach board abs. at 29 and 170-175, they show a little but nothing like certain individuals. i dropped weight to 162 and a huge difference in the midsection...

[gixxerboy1]

I am trying to get my abs back at 43, and it is frickin' tough! No doubt a body like that is hard work.

lol unfortanitly its not as easy it as it used to be.

[Honkey_Kong]

You guys think that Brad Pitt really looks like that in real life? In the movies, he's got make-up artists and they have lighting experts who know how to make people look their best. And if it really matters, they can touch up his scenes with a little Photoshop in post. TV and Movies are an illusion. Now does Pitt work hard to look how he looks, probably. But I wouldn't dare say he is on something. That would be speculation.

As far as the OP goes, if you precisely control your diet, you'll make some great results towards your goal. Don't expect instant gratification, good physiques take years to make. I don't think you need gear to reach your goals. Just a good diet.

And for the record, a good cutting diet doesn't have to taste like cardboard. You need to check out the diet section.

[dec11]

no disrespect, just wanna be on the same page... are you saying that you believe that brad pitt got to where he is by diet and exercise alone?

are you serious? you actually think he carries alot of muscle?!

[guitario]

It's not what they get to that is the issue, its how fast they get there. My instincts say pitt, Reynolds and jackman are natural. On the flipside, mickey rourke and tom hardy definitely juice while bale and Daniel Craig are 50/50 to me.

[chuckt12345]

[QUOTE=JohnnyVegas;5824711]Someone recently posted "If people can't tell you are on steroids, then you are doing it wrong." It may have been Gixxer, but that doesn't matter. That statement made me realize that AAS should only be taken by people that are looking for size that cannot be easily acquired naturally. If you want natural looking muscle mass, you should avoid drug use.

If you don't want to get really big, you will do well eating and lifting correctly. I know p90x is tough, which shows that you can do this.


id never want anyone to think im on steroids,, at least outside the gym. Im 6'2" and never want to be over 220, yea i could get there naturally but i dont have the time or energy to devote that much when i can do it with a needle 5 times faster, cheaper and easier,, thats why i take aas. i know im cheating myself but ill be the first to admit it.

[texamwalker]

are you serious? you actually think he carries alot of muscle?!

wow..apparentley you havent read any of what ive been saying....i dont want to carry a lot of muscle.....carrying what he has is what im looking for....