Advice please... done my homework but no 'real life' steroid experience

[Firzt Timer]

Hey guys,

About to start my first cycle... actually I'm a week in and wanted to check if I've missed anything, or am making a silly mistake.

Major Concerns / priorities (not in order)

• Getting to the next level in muscle growth
• Losing around 5+ kilos of fat
• Keeping my hair (have lost some natually till now, male hairloss pattern thing)
• Minimal sides (particularly on the liver)
• The infamous deca-dick (think that's covered by the caber)

Stats first:

• Age: 28
• Height: 5'11
• Weight: 182 pounds
• Fat: Around 26%
• Training Experience: about a year

Weekly Schedule

• Duration - 12 weeks

Weeks 1 - 10

• Deca Durabolin 400mg (300mg-400mg)
• Test Ethanate 150mg (up to 250mg, depending on effect on hairloss)
• Clenbuiterol - 2 weeks on 2 weeks off, working up from 40mcg to approx 100-120mcg, increasing by 20mcg every three days by 20mcg. May only do this for the one two week block, will see based on results

.
Weeks 11 - 12

• Test Ethanate 150mg - 250mg (not decided on dose yet)

Supps

• Dostinex (cabergoline) 0.5mg twice a week
• HCG - Thinking about a three week cycle between weeks 9-12... not really sure. Like the idea of keeping my balls
• PCP - Clomid or Novalex... unsure which one just yet, as well as dosages etc...

Diet

• Minimal sugar
• 2-3 protein shakes a day (one with carb after workouts)
• Lots of lean meats
• Lots of beans, lentils etc
• Not much white carbs
• Plan to eat like a horse when deca kicks in by around week 3, though it's already happening in week 1

Ok - so they're the hard and fast stats.

I've researched heaps so far just on web forums and can just add in:

• I know most people will say to run more test than deca, but keeping hairloss to a minimum is a priority for me. Can't use finasteride on deca either that sucks.
• I know I'm kinda rolling the dice at 250mg test for hairloss, and may reduce this to 150mg for the base level that my body should normally produce.
• In week one i didn't have the test and just used the deca.. felt tired, sad... think it was on account of having no test in me.

May pop this up on another forum as well, as little concerned I'm already at the start of week 2 before raising this question

Questions:

• Is there any reason I couldn't go up to 400mg on the deca? Particularly for long term deca dick? Is there benefit to going this high?
• Is 150mg test going to just cover my base testosterone levels?
• What's a reasonable goal for muscle growth on this kind of cycle?

Any other feedback on any part of this cycle would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks

[slfmade]

Oh my!!! Deep Breath!!! You should get a lot of responses on this. All I'm gonna say is that the only goal you pointed out is to lose 5kg of fat. That can EASILY be done by adjusting your diet. You should for sure be using more Test if you do this, however, I think based on your current stats you should stop now and train natural. I can tell you at the BF you currently have...this is not a good idea. I'm no expert, so I'll take a back seat and let the guys with more experience comment on this now.

[gixxerboy1]

i would stop everything right now. Your trying to cut on Deca? Not a good choice.
Your bf is too high at this point
deca can cause hairloss too.
There is no need for steroids yet. Get your diet and training sorted out and you will continue to make gaisn naturally and get a good base. And there is no risk of any sides.

[Firzt Timer]

From what i've heard, bulking gear and cutting gear was a bit of a myth, that it was more diet and exercise that would drive whether you lose fat or not, and gear was more of a kicker to get the body workinng on overdrive.

[Sgt. Hartman]

You say you plan to eat like a horse once the deca kicks in but your goal for the cycle is to lose 11 lbs of fat. You should choose a goal of either losing fat or gaining muscle mass, which at 26% BF it should definitely be to lose fat.

Deca is not a wise choice for losing fat and I would recommend that you lose fat naturally with diet and cardio before considering an AAS cycle.

[songdog]

Bro you have only been lifting for 1 year? You need to learn how to eat go to the diet section and let them check your diet out.Between diet and cardio you will lose that bf.With your experence or lack of you really aint ready for aas.Stay nat for a while build a base.Then in a year our 2 if you are still at it then hit the juice.Why be in a rush?

[The Bear 79]

From what i've heard, bulking gear and cutting gear was a bit of a myth, that it was more diet and exercise that would drive whether you lose fat or not, and gear was more of a kicker to get the body workinng on overdrive.

Either way, ur BF% is 11% above the recommended % for cycling. If u cycle with excessive BF, there is greater risk of heart attack due 2 hi BP. And the likelihood & severity of Gyno is greater.

[Firzt Timer]

About the 'more testosterone than deca' thing... i duno where that came from.. i think it's about impotence/deca dick? but when researching this, all i could find was that this is completely offset by the dostinex/cabergoline (to do with progesterone), and adding 150mg test in the cycle shoudl apparantly keep enough testosterone chugging around in my body as would normally be the case if i weren't on the cycle.

i would stop everything right now. Your trying to cut on Deca? Not a good choice.
Your bf is too high at this point. Get your diet and training sorted out and you will continue to make gaisn naturally and get a good base. And there is no risk of any sides.

Thanks for the honest feedback here. To be honest, I think looking back on it when I'm 90, I'd probably agree with this. That said, lately I've just gotten frustrated with waiting for it to all come together for me naturally. You're right, I do want the fat to come off as priority, but also to grow muscle. Combining clen initially and deca to hit around 4 weeks in sounded like a sensible way to really focus on this? At this stage, I'm thinking I'll continue the current course and in a fortnight, evaluate whether the clen and solid diet has brought my body fat down to somewhere I'm comfortable with to progress.

i would stop everything right now. Your trying to cut on Deca? Not a good choice.
deca can cause hairloss too.

Fair call - Less worried about this part though, from what I've read up, it doesn't convert to DHT, reducing this risk heaps.

[Firzt Timer]

whooo just read all the latest replies...

ok will go and think about this for a bit more

[BossMcBossBoss]

Your bodyfat is way too high to be on gear....

[Brohim]

read more bro. Deca is not the drug you need. Diet and cardio and some eca perhaps. Your BP would be way to high and could have gyno problems w/ your fat level.

[Brohim]

ECY stack helps to suppress appetite, it did that for me at least. You can get Ephedrine at walgreen's in a bronchial asthma relief medicine. 12.mg of Ephedrine in each pill.

[slfmade]

About the 'more testosterone than deca' thing... i duno where that came from.. i think it's about impotence/deca dick? but when researching this, all i could find was that this is completely offset by the dostinex/cabergoline (to do with progesterone), and adding 150mg test in the cycle shoudl apparantly keep enough testosterone chugging around in my body as would normally be the case if i weren't on the cycle.



Thanks for the honest feedback here. To be honest, I think looking back on it when I'm 90, I'd probably agree with this. That said, lately I've just gotten frustrated with waiting for it to all come together for me naturally. You're right, I do want the fat to come off as priority, but also to grow muscle. Combining clen initially and deca to hit around 4 weeks in sounded like a sensible way to really focus on this? At this stage, I'm thinking I'll continue the current course and in a fortnight, evaluate whether the clen and solid diet has brought my body fat down to somewhere I'm comfortable with to progress.



Fair call - Less worried about this part though, from what I've read up, it doesn't convert to DHT, reducing this risk heaps.

So there was a thread started earlier today about taking it easy on the newbies and not being mean. But guys....THIS IS WHAT IRRATES THE HELL OUT OF US!!!!! You come in an ask for advice from the experts...You get advice you don't want to hear, and then spit in our face and say you're gonna do it anyway, or try to justify it by reading one article and thinking you know better than the experts. I am by no means an expert but if the guys on here told me it was a bad idea...I WOULDN'T DO IT!!! Do you think in someway the guys are jealous and are afraid you will get bigger than them? What is the reasoning for asking for advice and not taking it? I don't get it. So to whoever it was that posted the thread about the vets need to play "Mr. Nice Guy", this is why people Like Dec11 finally give up with trying to help and start talking shit...maybe then it will get through to them.

My .02

[Firzt Timer]

So there was a thread started earlier today about taking it easy on the newbies and not being mean. But guys....THIS IS WHAT IRRATES THE HELL OUT OF US!!!!! You come in an ask for advice from the experts...You get advice you don't want to hear, and then spit in our face and say you're gonna do it anyway, or try to justify it by reading one article and thinking you know better than the experts. I am by no means an expert but if the guys on here told me it was a bad idea...I WOULDN'T DO IT!!! Do you think in someway the guys are jealous and are afraid you will get bigger than them? What is the reasoning for asking for advice and not taking it? I don't get it. So to whoever it was that posted the thread about the vets need to play "Mr. Nice Guy", this is why people Like Dec11 finally give up with trying to help and start talking shit...maybe then it will get through to them.

My .02

whoa easy tiger

Refer above to my quote: "ok i need to think about this some more".

The passion in your response is actually a little warming to me. I'm kinda shattered right now, whole plan i had been putting together for the past few months has just gone into the pooper yeah, that doesn't feel crash hot to me. I've spent probably a few hours a day for 6 weeks researching every drug and it's effects on my body, and was confident I'd found the right blend to meet my goals.

It sounds like the consensus here is otherwise, and that all my reading had led me astray on the fat% problem.

So this all throws one big spanner in the works buggeries! A question now guys (and please "i told you so's" and faceplants about newbies aside, what would you guys recommend I honestly do. I've taken two shots of deca, around 350mg, spaced a week apart. I'm stopping the clen becuase I don't like how it's sitting with me (tried it a little before I started the deca, didn't like it, gave it another crack and yeah defo don't like it!).

Soo how do i get my balls working again properly now? After 2 injections is there benefit to/a need for any type of PCT or such thing after 2 injections? I believe yes but thought i should ask the question.

And thank you all for the care in taking the time to help shift me back onto a healthier path. I don't want lady breasts or high blood pressure. Though at 28 yrs old, i hadn't really thought that would be a problem, and always tested fine for it.

Ok back to you guys, no need to be gentle, fire away.

[slfmade]

This tiger has settled down now!

Good to see you're taking some advice. The guys on here (well, the vets) will never steer you wrong. As far as the PCT after only 2 shots go....Wait to see what the pros say, take what the newbie's tell you with a grain of salt, and in the meantime due your research *extensively* and learn what pct is and why you need it. It's always good to ask for advice, but doing your own research and learning exactly what you're putting into your body and why will give you the knowledge to help people out down the road.

Also, get over to the dieting section! You can drop some serious BF by getting those guys to help you put a diet plan together. Do some research first...get an idea of what you think you need to do, then let them tweak it. Don't just go in and ask them to put a diet together. Again research is KEY! There's a ton BS out there on the web, so start with the sticky's on this forum.

Good luck with everything.

[The Bear 79]

Yes. After inj a 19 nor + Test., I would def do a PCT.

[slfmade]

Yes. After inj a 19 nor + Test., I would def do a PCT.

There's 1 vet for PCT. I'll ammend my post.

[gixxerboy1]

I agree with bear def run a pct