Review my planned cycle (first cycle in 8 years)

[m16a2]

Okay, I'll begin with some cycle history:

2002 - deca/test enan
2003 - fina/winny
2003 - eq/test/winny
2003 - var only (I know, I would have put test in there but I could not due to circumstances beyond my control)
2004 - tren/prop/stanzol and igf
2003-2011 - around 10 low-dose cycles of DNP intermittently

Now, I'm 29 y/o and ready to plan my next cycle. Based on my past results and thinking about what worked and what didn't, I am thinking about a cycle consisting of... (this is a total rough draft and I'm very open to suggestions and feedback)

test enan - wk 1-16 600mg/wk with frontload wk 1
eq - wk 1-16 400mg/wk with frontload wk 1
var - wk 14-19 40mg/day
t3 - wk 10-16
l-dex - wk 1-22 .25mg/day
nolva - wk 1-22 10mg/day
wk 19-22 PCT

To put it simply, my best cycle was test/eq/var so I'm thinking that might work for me again. I would really appreciate some VET/senior member feedback on my proposed cycle. Also, when I was younger (I'm 29 now, and my first cycles were almost 10 years ago....), I stayed away from HGH because I wanted to wait till I was older before using it. I still think that I might be a few years away from needing it but I would appreciate some opinions on it.

Training: I decided to start a cycle again because my personal/professional situation now offers me a lot of time to dedicate to my training. I will be in the gym everyday, although I have every intention of getting enough rest. I have been consistently training naturally for the last 4 years and needless to say, I'm at a natural plateau. However, my routine is second nature to me and I believe adding the AS edge will yield great results. I run/jog 15 miles/week consistently with ease. This should help to keep the gains lean and trim some of the excess bf.

Diet: Low-carb, high protein pretty disciplined. I was at a perfect bf% about a year ago but professional/personal life interrupted my training regimen. I do have about 10 lbs of fat to loose to get to ideal bf%. Either I will wait until I achieve this before starting my cycle or I'll try to cut it during my cycle (open to opinions on this).

Current Stats/Goals: I am currently 176 lbs, 6'2, estimated BF% 18, decent build but 5% over ideal bf. My goal is for lean gains and trimming the 5% bf


Well, that's the story! I would greatly appreciate some solid feedback and recommendations.

[gixxerboy1]

you said 176 but no height. Also 5% over ideal bf. That can be a big difference between what dif people think is ideal. so what is your actual bf%

[m16a2]

Sorry about that, I'm 6'2. I'll edit my original thread to include this since it is pretty important.

Also, my estimated BF% is around 18%.

[DanB]

your a little light at 6'2 176lbs 18% i.m.o.

why not bump carbs and cals? im willing to bet you can bulk naturally while losing b/f quite easily right up to 200-210 lbs without any AAS

fasted am cardio, HIIT cardio pwo and lift heavy 4-5 days a week is all you need right now

[m16a2]

Everyone's body is different... naturally, my peak is 170 lbs at 12-13% bf. I look a LOT heavier but my body doesn't gain weight (LBM pounds)... It's true that I could gain weight if I bulked with heavy lifting and bulk diet but it is a bulky gain. With that said, my recommendation if I had read my post would have been similar to yours... but I know my body pretty well at this point.

I'm looking for feedback on the proposed cycle.

[Bossman]

You won't add muscle and burn fat on cycle, even more so with your body type. I would diet, cardio to cut fat and when you get sub 14-`15% think about bulkiing.

18% is kinda high, and when you're 6'2" at 176 and 18%, something is wrong. Jogging will give you a runners physique. Cardio to burn without muscle loss should be slowwww. Stop jogging.


The consensus on EQ is that it is worthless. I've used it, I think it's worthless too. Think test/deca to add mass. Cut, then add mass. Wait until after PCT and then cut out added fat on bulk.

Pick bulk or cut, can't do both.

[cebby1985]

I also think your bf is a little high . Cut down to 13-15% first using a balanced diet if light to moderate carbs, high protein and eat a calorie deficient diet. If I were you, id try hiit on an empty stomach in the morning and heavy lifting in the evening or a good 3-4 split routine w compound exercises and some cardio after wards. I use eliptical to burn bf best. Everyone's different, so pay attention to find what heart rate burns fat best for you.

[m16a2]

You won't add muscle and burn fat on cycle, even more so with your body type. I would diet, cardio to cut fat and when you get sub 14-`15% think about bulkiing.

18% is kinda high, and when you're 6'2" at 176 and 18%, something is wrong. Jogging will give you a runners physique. Cardio to burn without muscle loss should be slowwww. Stop jogging.

Good points. I also think it is best to cut the fat before starting but I wanted to check the consensus. I can slim down to my ideal weight in about 3 months and then start my cycle. BTW - I am using a pretty inaccurate way to check my bf% (neck, naval, waist, hips calculation). It doesn't account for your frame or muscle mass. I do know that at 166 lbs (10 lbs down), I'm able to see a full six-pack. I'm probably not 18% bf but I definitely have some fat to loose on my stomach.

The consensus on EQ is that it is worthless. I've used it, I think it's worthless too. Think test/deca to add mass. Cut, then add mass. Wait until after PCT and then cut out added fat on bulk.

My last test/deca cycle wasn't good. I get too many sides with deca, so it isn't an option for me. I had good experience with EQ but it was stacked with test, stan, and var so the EQ might not have actually helped. I know that I want test (obviously) and var in my cycle. Any recommendations on what would be good to stack with the test other than deca?

[Bossman]

What was your dose of test and deca? I can not handle high doses of deca even after years of cycling. Anything over 525 a week for me starts bringing too many sides. I gain well on 350 mg of deca a week along 525 of test.

It's been a long time since you've cycled. You may do very well with a test only cycle with the addition of anadrol or dbol for the first 4 weeks to jumpstart.

[m16a2]

What was your dose of test and deca? I can not handle high doses of deca even after years of cycling. Anything over 525 a week for me starts bringing too many sides. I gain well on 350 mg of deca a week along 525 of test.

It's been a long time since you've cycled. You may do very well with a test only cycle with the addition of anadrol or dbol for the first 4 weeks to jumpstart.

I think I was at 400 mg of deca and 400 mg of test - my sides continued for more than 6 months after ending the cycle; I need my libido dude!. I also think that a test only cycle would have a good response since I should be like an AS virgin after 8 years... I don't know about dbol or anadrol... what about test enan 600 mg/test prop to jump start/var the last 5 weeks till PCT?

[Blitz88]

Can someone help me out. I can not post a new thread. I am new and trying to figure this out. Can someone message me with some ideas please?

[DanB]

Did you run a pct for the test/deca?

Personally I would just run test e/c or sust at 500-600mg week for 12 weeks, depends how your gear is dosed

only difference will be pct start times

kickstart with dbol or tbol, I wouldnt bother with the prop

Var last few weeks, emmm its up to you, I reckon you wont see much from it at 18% b/f and it isnt the cost effective either so why not save it until future and your lower b/f?

What would you run for pct? have you an a.i. planned for the cycle such as armidex or aromasin?

And hcg is also benefical, have you looked into it at all?

[DanB]

Can someone help me out. I can not post a new thread. I am new and trying to figure this out. Can someone message me with some ideas please?

You cant pm until your post count is up,

Why cant you start a thread? only reason I can think of is that the spam filter is stopping you, so if you are trying to include lab/source names or links then try post it without them

[Blitz88]

Thank you for the help.

[Bossman]

Like Dan asked, "Did you run a PCT?" With proper PCT you should have recovered. He made a good point with the var also.

I also always run my test higher then deca. 525-600 a week of test and 350-400 a week of deca is a decent cycle.

I do like to jump start. Can't wait 4 weeks to notice I'm on cycle. Prop, dbol, adrol would be a good jump start, but that's me. Not necessary.

[m16a2]

Did you run a pct for the test/deca?

Personally I would just run test e/c or sust at 500-600mg week for 12 weeks, depends how your gear is dosed

only difference will be pct start times

kickstart with dbol or tbol, I wouldnt bother with the prop

Var last few weeks, emmm its up to you, I reckon you wont see much from it at 18% b/f and it isnt the cost effective either so why not save it until future and your lower b/f?

What would you run for pct? have you an a.i. planned for the cycle such as armidex or aromasin?

And hcg is also benefical, have you looked into it at all?

I've never done a cycle without PCT. The only concern with kickstarting with dbol is the increased bp which gets in the way of my training. Maybe I can just frontload to get the kickstart. I don't plan on starting this cycle until I'm down to 14% BF, which is less than 3 months away. Var kicks up my strength and eases me through the off-time before PCT starts. I loved the aussie var that I had, even though it is pricy.

PCT, I'm thinking l-dex, nolva, and clomid - using this before helped to maintain most of my gains. Do you think I need to add something else? As for HCG, I was never convinced that this is useful/necessary to include in cycles. However, I do know that perceptions have changed in the last 8 years so maybe I'll check into it again and see what the big bros are saying these days.

[m16a2]

Like Dan asked, "Did you run a PCT?" With proper PCT you should have recovered.

Definitely ran my PCT. That was my first cycle and I only did a nolva/clomid PCT without an AI. I had bulky gains but I did maintain them. However, the recovery that I'm referring to is sexual sides, psychological (depression?), etc. probably a result of low testosterone (I got this tested). It took a long time to fully recover in all ways. Anyways, like I said, I'm not considering deca for this cycle because I know what it did to me last time. It is like going back to your ex-wife... you just know it isn't going to work out.

I do like to jump start. Can't wait 4 weeks to notice I'm on cycle. Prop, dbol, adrol would be a good jump start, but that's me. Not necessary.

I'm with you bro... I don't want to wait 4 weeks to feel the edge. I love frontloading or kick starting. Prop has worked as a good kick start for me before but to be honest, I've never tried dbol or adrol because the high BP does bug me and interferes with my training which is counterproductive. However, I haven't tried either so I'm open to trying them out if you guys think it is a better option than front-loading or using prop to kickstart.