2nd cycle

[t-dogg]

Ok, I believe Ive decided my 2nd cycle but want input.

I will be running Test E. for 18weeks at 300ml per week. I will also be running winny as this will be more for cutting. My question is that I will be injecting winny and want to know how long is ok to stay on this? All information I read is saying 6weeks all the way to 12weeks.

So my questions are this. How long can I cycle this? How much can I take while running this "Ive seen from 50-100"?

Thanks, sorry to ask this question as I know its asked alot lol...

[warren916]

You know you have to inject winny EVERYDAY right?? And will still cause just as much liver damage as oral...i would suggest nothing over 6 weeks..

[t-dogg]

You know you have to inject winny EVERYDAY right?? And will still cause just as much liver damage as oral...i would suggest nothing over 6 weeks..

Yes I know its liver toxic, but its less toxic then orals I believe. Also isnt it every other day for injecting?

[t-dogg]

double post.

[DanB]

Yes I know its liver toxic, but its less toxic then orals I believe. Also isnt it every other day for injecting?

Yes its less toxic and you can get away with alot less than orals, but dont forget its toxic none the less, so 18 weeks no

Why 18 week cycle at 300mg? A bit unconventional, what is your line of thinking for it?

What are your stats?

[gearbox]

t-dogg
18 weeks is a long time to be shut down and for only 300 mg. I agree with Danb and would like to understand your thoughts behind why such a low dose for a long period of time.
Regarding the winny- yes you are right it is easier on your liver if you inject im, but it still cycles through your liver just not right away. The standard is 6 weeks, but many people may push past this rule. I personally would not run for more then 6 on my second cycle.

[gearbox]

t-dogg
18 weeks is a long time to be shut down and for only 300 mg. I agree with Danb and would like to understand your thoughts behind why such a low dose for a long period of time.
Regarding the winny- yes you are right it is easier on your liver if you inject im, but it still cycles through your liver just not right away. The standard is 6 weeks, but many people may push past this rule. I personally would not run for more then 6 on my second cycle.

[t-dogg]

Yes its less toxic and you can get away with alot less than orals, but dont forget its toxic none the less, so 18 weeks no

Why 18 week cycle at 300mg? A bit unconventional, what is your line of thinking for it?

What are your stats?

Thanks for the reply. I didnt say I would be using winny for 18weeks, I said 6 to 12weeks. I ask what others thought about winny seeing that Ive seen people say 6weeks to 12weeks for cycles.

I want to do 18weeks at a lower dose because Im more focused on staying leaner on this cycle and not putting alot of weight on. Plus Im taking Test E which takes alittle bit longer to kick in compared to other Test froms correct?


Stats
1) 28yeears old
2) been lifting weights since high school
3) train full time in mma " meaning 6days a week, 2-3 times a day"
4) I eat 3-6 times a day
5) 1st cycle I went from 170lbs to 186lbs "ran Test E for 12weeks at 400ml" "kepted about all of my strenght, but lost some weight"


Its very hard for me to keep and hold weight. I burn it off seeing that I train, compete so much. My goal is to be able to walk around at 185lbs and stay at 10% bodyfat.


And please if you have input on why/why not to run test e for that long please explain. Im taking advice from others that have done the same type cycle before.

[t-dogg]

t-dogg
18 weeks is a long time to be shut down and for only 300 mg. I agree with Danb and would like to understand your thoughts behind why such a low dose for a long period of time.
Regarding the winny- yes you are right it is easier on your liver if you inject im, but it still cycles through your liver just not right away. The standard is 6 weeks, but many people may push past this rule. I personally would not run for more then 6 on my second cycle.

So you feel 6-8weeks tops for winny at the most then correct?

I went into more detail about 18weeks of test e on the other post. Again if you feel something would be better, please go ahead and explain what and why.

[DanB]

18 weeks is a long time to be shut down and will make recovery wery hard, also myostatin will come into play after approx 8-12 weeks and slow gains to a crawl, hence why people deload during long cycles

if you find it hard to keep weight you simply need more cals, somebody training as much as you need up to 7000cals a day, and you said ypu eat 3-6 times a day so I reckon you are severely lacking there

test e will kick in approx 4-6 weeks and i would run for 12-14 weeks max after that gains will be too slow to be worth continueing

i misread thinking you were asking could run winny for 18 weeks, 6-8 weeks max but it isnt a good idea for you, it will dry your joints and there a very good chance you will pick up an injury because of this due to your training regieme

if i was you i would run prop for 8 - 10 weeks and as many cals as possible, get them any way you can, i know shakes arent ideal but take 3 weight gainers per day, thats 1500 extra cals straight away and its better to have a shake then to simply go without and in turn lose weight

[gearbox]

18 weeks is a long time to be shut down and will make recovery wery hard, also myostatin will come into play after approx 8-12 weeks and slow gains to a crawl, hence why people deload during long cycles

if you find it hard to keep weight you simply need more cals, somebody training as much as you need up to 7000cals a day, and you said ypu eat 3-6 times a day so I reckon you are severely lacking there

test e will kick in approx 4-6 weeks and i would run for 12-14 weeks max after that gains will be too slow to be worth continueing

i misread thinking you were asking could run winny for 18 weeks, 6-8 weeks max but it isnt a good idea for you, it will dry your joints and there a very good chance you will pick up an injury because of this due to your training regieme

if i was you i would run prop for 8 - 10 weeks and as many cals as possible, get them any way you can, i know shakes arent ideal but take 3 weight gainers per day, thats 1500 extra cals straight away and its better to have a shake then to simply go without and in turn lose weight

T-dogg this is why a 12 or 14 week cycle is best. going longer your body is being shut down for very little no no more gains. Danb did a great write up for you!

[t-dogg]

18 weeks is a long time to be shut down and will make recovery wery hard, also myostatin will come into play after approx 8-12 weeks and slow gains to a crawl, hence why people deload during long cycles

if you find it hard to keep weight you simply need more cals, somebody training as much as you need up to 7000cals a day, and you said ypu eat 3-6 times a day so I reckon you are severely lacking there

test e will kick in approx 4-6 weeks and i would run for 12-14 weeks max after that gains will be too slow to be worth continueing

i misread thinking you were asking could run winny for 18 weeks, 6-8 weeks max but it isnt a good idea for you, it will dry your joints and there a very good chance you will pick up an injury because of this due to your training regieme

if i was you i would run prop for 8 - 10 weeks and as many cals as possible, get them any way you can, i know shakes arent ideal but take 3 weight gainers per day, thats 1500 extra cals straight away and its better to have a shake then to simply go without and in turn lose weight

Thanks for your input.


Yes taking in calories is hard for me, very hard.

I only choose test e because it was less pinning, but he hasnt put in the order yet so I can switch it. I will read more on Test types now.

Ok, if I didnt run winny to help in cutting/fat loss should I run anavar? masteron?

[gearbox]

no onw likes this answer but for fast loss you need to get a good diet and cardio. it shows your dedication and when you cycle again your diet will be spot on for some great gains

[DanB]

var would be my choice, 75mg prop ed and 60-100mg var is an great cycle

and what gearbox said above is 100% correct, and with the amount of training you do, and the struggle you have getting calories into you then there shouldnt be an ounce of fat on you to begin with. . . . .

what is your current bodyfat?

[gearbox]

[QUOTE=DanB;5920737]var would be my choice, 75mg prop ed and 60-100mg var is an great cycle

I have personally ran this cycle (60-80mgvar) and loved the results. I was 10% bf at the time, and I do not believe I would have like the results (or seen them) if I was 15%...

[t-dogg]

no onw likes this answer but for fast loss you need to get a good diet and cardio. it shows your dedication and when you cycle again your diet will be spot on for some great gains

I agree 100% with you. Diet is the main key. It is the hardest part for me considering how much I train.


OK, so ill go with 14weeks instead of 18weeks and up the ml to 400ml. I ran Test E as my first cycle, which I liked. Less pinning the better in my eyes, less scare tissue. To help with cutting what should I do then? The only thing that worries me with winny is injecting every other day, alot of pinning.

[gearbox]

Head over to the diet section and get some info and form a diet for yourself and I would go -500 less if you are cutting. You will need to be monitoring your calories though

[DanB]

I agree 100% with you. Diet is the main key. It is the hardest part for me considering how much I train.


OK, so ill go with 14weeks instead of 18weeks and up the ml to 400ml. I ran Test E as my first cycle, which I liked. Less pinning the better in my eyes, less scare tissue. To help with cutting what should I do then? The only thing that worries me with winny is injecting every other day, alot of pinning.

the thing is mate, if your diet isnt near perfect then its better waiting until it is for your cycle, otherwise you will be unhappy with results and lose weight like your previous cycle

[t-dogg]

I do not know my bodyfat % at the moment.


So you guys feel my bodyfat should be at 10% before running anavar?

You said to run 75ml of Test Prop? every other day Im assuming then? With 60-100 anavar correct?

[t-dogg]

Head over to the diet section and get some info and form a diet for yourself and I would go -500 less if you are cutting. You will need to be monitoring your calories though

I have been reading in that section. Just trying to figure out what is best for me. Lol, I dont think I could eat 7000 calories a day tho like what was said above.

[DanB]

no 75mg ed but yes var needs low bodyfat

what i would do if i was you is, get diet dialled in, i dont understand how you are carrying fat, doing that much training and not getting enough cals?

but when your diet is sorted the fat will fall off in no time at all, look at fighters who drop 20lbs when training for a fight

then run your cycle it will be 10x's more effective

[DanB]

have a look online at diet of the likes of mayweather and pacquaio, they similar weight to you and eat in that region just to maintain their current weight, but if youi are unhappy with your bodyfat then you prob dont need that amount yet

i still dont understand how you can train full time, with a poor diet and have a high bodyfat?

[t-dogg]

have a look online at diet of the likes of mayweather and pacquaio, they similar weight to you and eat in that region just to maintain their current weight, but if youi are unhappy with your bodyfat then you prob dont need that amount yet

i still dont understand how you can train full time, with a poor diet and have a high bodyfat?

I dont have a high body fat. I dont know my bf % but I can see my core and abs. You can also see the "v cut most people talk about.

Only thing I can think of that Im not losing the last of body fat is that Im not eating enought and my body is storing what I eat and turning it to fat. Just a thought, I could be very wrong tho.