penny for your thoughts

[noon]

First cycle for me. Using 250
1ml twice a week for 10 weeks. just had my first dose.
is this a good place to start?

[austinite]

Hey noon, whats your BF %?

[noon]

Last check was at 15%

[Capebuffalo]

Something is too easy about this. Which is good for a change. AI? Hcg? Pct plan?

[noon]

At the end I will be using nolv .
what can I expect to keepihave a clean diet high in protein

[adamjames]

not really

[noon]

Nice to meet u both

[noon]

At the end I will be using nolv .
what can I expect to keepihave a clean diet high in protein

[Capebuffalo]

I would run armidex. Novla and clomid for pct.

[noon]

Not realy ... what?

[swm1972]

At 5'7" carrying 175lbs you have a decent base as far as size goes. How much you gain and keep depends on a number of things. Genetics. Diet. Training. Etc. you might gain 30lbs and keep it all. You might gain 10 and lose it all. All you can do is run your cycle as well as you can and see how the cards fall in the end. These things are very individual and no way any of us can answer that question.

Good luck! Enjoy your first cycle.

[gearbox]

Op- hope you are over 25 yrs old.
Also if your going to run a cycle run 400-500 a week. 250 is to small a dose for shutting your natty system down imo..
And run an ai as said above. Like adex
Pct is clomid/ nolva
Most important have everything in your procession before your first pin. Good luck

[Capebuffalo]

Op- hope you are over 25 yrs old.
Also if your going to run a cycle run 400-500 a week. 250 is to small a dose for shutting your natty system down imo..
And run an ai as said above. Like adex
Pct is clomid/ nolva
Most important have everything in your procession before your first pin. Good luck

Says he's 34.

[adamjames]

when you stop cycling you will lose most of your gains and go back to what you could have achieved naturally or just slightly above that unless your an alien

picture a balloon being popped

[JohnnyVegas]

Op- hope you are over 25 yrs old.
Also if your going to run a cycle run 400-500 a week. 250 is to small a dose for shutting your natty system down imo..
And run an ai as said above. Like adex
Pct is clomid/ nolva
Most important have everything in your procession before your first pin. Good luck

Looks like he is using 250mg twice a week...so 500mg. Solid advice though. I agree with all you guys that said to run an AI and standard Clomid/Nolva PCT.

[noon]

Yes I am 34 and I am dipping my toes in the water I will basefurther use on how this goes.
Am I supposed to run a product at the same time along with the cycle

[noon]

Does every one agree that almost all gains will be lost??

[Capebuffalo]

Does every one agree that almost all gains will be lost??

No. I hope not. If your diet needs work go to the nutrition section. Eat big workout hard. Grow. During pct increase cals and lower time of workout. Get in get out.

[JohnnyVegas]

Does every one agree that almost all gains will be lost??

Not necessarily. But this is why you will want to keep reading, so that you learn what needs to be done to keep gains.

[adamjames]

once your hormones go back to normal so will your physique, end of story

if your planning on doing 1 short cycle then coming of steroids forever you may aswell stay natural in the first place IMO

[noon]

Thanks johny and cape any ideas or help will be appreciated

[Capebuffalo]

once your hormones go back to normal so will your physique, end of story

if your planning on doing 1 short cycle then coming of steroids forever you may aswell stay natural in the first place IMO

So If I am 190 lbs get to 210 lbs during cycle. Do pct and continue to eat and train like a 210 lbs man. I will go back to 190 lbs or less? I have to disagree.

[austinite]

No. I hope not. If your diet needs work go to the nutrition section. Eat big workout hard. Grow. During pct increase cals and lower time of workout. Get in get out.

Agree. Keep eating. Folks lose all gains because they come off cycle and go back to the old lifestyle.

[austinite]

once your hormones go back to normal so will your physique, end of story

if your planning on doing 1 short cycle then coming of steroids forever you may aswell stay natural in the first place IMO

Can you provide any evidence to this? Because maybe I am super human.

[Capebuffalo]

Can you provide any evidence to this? Because maybe I am super human.

Me too. I've kept a little from each one but the first. As long as you understand you have to work to maintain off cycle. You can. You get lazy you lose your gains. You have to commit.

[adamjames]

i guess ignorance is bliss but the fact of the matter is that you cant run a car without petrol im afraid

[austinite]

i guess ignorance is bliss but the fact of the matter is that you cant run a car without petrol im afraid

That analogy doesn't really make sense. You really shouldn't advise anyone on anything.

[Simon1972]

i guess ignorance is bliss but the fact of the matter is that you cant run a car without petrol im afraid

i think he means you cant maintain muscle without fuel ( food or natural testosterone) analogy is sound i think, but yet you will end up with as much muscle as you could have naturally maintained if you were running at the same natural level of testosterone (maybe slightly more if diet is on point) - aas is just a short term sythetic performance spurt- when you come off you body will balance out and you should end up bigger for sure. if natty levels are 150 before aas, you can kiss your gains goodbye when you come off. thats why its always good to get BW done before you embark and good pct protocol- good luck

[austinite]

This is getting silly. It's almost like saying that if you don't juice you can't make gains. It's just mind boggling. He's not talking about food, he's talking about AAS, so yeah.. analogy is stupid. Unless he's assuming that we would stop eating all together.

[Papa-pwn]

i guess ignorance is bliss but the fact of the matter is that you cant run a car without petrol im afraid

You are wrong. To say that one cannot keep any gains made on cycle is ludacris. One can very well lose all their gains, but it is hardly guaranteed. Just like keeping your gains is not guaranteed, either. PCT and good diet manipulation will help, however, as will specific genetics.

For what it's worth there's a juice monkey at my gym that run the most simplistic PCTs ever and still manage to keep damn near every pound. I'm 4 weeks into my first cycle of test e, DMZ, and test p(along with adex and hcg) and have put on 31.4 lbs as of today. You cannot tell me I will lose every ounce of that during/after PCT.

Maybe I'm in the wrong here but I don't want to believe that lol.

[Simon1972]

You are wrong. To say that one cannot keep any gains made on cycle is ludacris. One can very well lose all their gains, but it is hardly guaranteed. Just like keeping your gains is not guaranteed, either. PCT and good diet manipulation will help, however, as will specific genetics.

For what it's worth there's a juice monkey at my gym that run the most simplistic PCTs ever and still manage to keep damn near every pound. I'm 4 weeks into my first cycle of test e, DMZ, and test p(along with adex and hcg) and have put on 31.4 lbs as of today. You cannot tell me I will lose every ounce of that during/after PCT.

Maybe I'm in the wrong here but I don't want to believe that lol.

ive heard of dmz, whats it like?

[gixxerboy1]

once your hormones go back to normal so will your physique, end of story

if your planning on doing 1 short cycle then coming of steroids forever you may aswell stay natural in the first place IMO

Complete bullshit. Juar because you or your friends do doesnt mean its a rule

[adamjames]

lol i love this forum, like i said ignorance is bliss : ) i guess the truth hurts sorry for saying it

please dont take offence to what i say people i said you will lose most of your gains not all, my analogy of popping a balloon was slightly exaggerated i admit lol but what you keep will be within the limit of what you could have achieved naturally after many years of training, steroids are just a fast track to that potential so yes you may be very impressed with what you keep but the more cycles you do the less you will keep, yes there is a limit to what you can keep when you stop taking the steroids i thought that was quite obvious especially to all you post whores out there

gixxerboy your assumptions are ridiculous , i wasent aware we were friends and you knew all of my friends, i guess its a small world

27,300 posts what an achievement congratulations maybe the queen will give you a knighthood for being such a loser, joke

[gixxerboy1]

lol i love this forum, like i said ignorance is bliss : ) i guess the truth hurts sorry for saying it

please dont take offence to what i say people i said you will lose most of your gains not all, my analogy of popping a balloon was slightly exaggerated i admit lol but what you keep will be within the limit of what you could have achieved naturally after many years of training, steroids are just a fast track to that potential so yes you may be very impressed with what you keep but the more cycles you do the less you will keep, yes there is a limit to what you can keep when you stop taking the steroids i thought that was quite obvious especially to all you post whores out there

gixxerboy your assumptions are ridiculous , i wasent aware we were friends and you knew all of my friends, i guess its a small world

27,300 posts what an achievement congratulations maybe the queen will give you a knighthood for being such a loser, joke

Lol. I love how you try and completely change what you origanally said then call me a loser. Well what you were originally were stating was not fact. So logic would say you were speaking from personal experience or observation.

Do you understand that or do I have to use smaller words?

[adamjames]

lol ok Einstein i agree with you, congratulations on another virtual world winning argument........lol

back to reality, read my post again then look at what you say in reply, then use the editor to change what you say because it doesent make sense

then go and do your usual routine of trying to get someone banned on the forum for not agreeing with you

then ponder this chain of events that take up your day and try and see that undeniably you are a gigantic loser and thats just the way God made you

dont worry theres always reincarnation if you believe in that sort of thing

[Capebuffalo]

lol ok Einstein i agree with you, congratulations on another virtual world winning argument........lol

back to reality, read my post again then look at what you say in reply, then use the editor to change what you say because it doesent make sense

then go and do your usual routine of trying to get someone banned on the forum for not agreeing with you

then ponder this chain of events that take up your day and try and see that undeniably you are a gigantic loser and thats just the way God made you

dont worry theres always reincarnation if you believe in that sort of thing

Wow I guess I'm the lucky one. I have disagreed with Gixxer on an open forum . I didn't get banned. Crazy. Oh by the way when I disagreed I did a little more research and found out I was wrong. You know what I did then? I told him I was wrong. Know what happened then? Nothing , life went on, felt pretty good about my acknowledgment .

[gixxerboy1]

lol ok Einstein i agree with you, congratulations on another virtual world winning argument........lol

back to reality, read my post again then look at what you say in reply, then use the editor to change what you say because it doesent make sense

then go and do your usual routine of trying to get someone banned on the forum for not agreeing with you

then ponder this chain of events that take up your day and try and see that undeniably you are a gigantic loser and thats just the way God made you

dont worry theres always reincarnation if you believe in that sort of thing

Yes look at it. I have not edited anything I wrote.
You said once your hormone s return to normal so will you. End of story. I said its not the rule. And then you back tracked and said well if your ovee you gentic limit and so on. Anyome who can read can see it. its ok to be wrong. You can tell you know it by how defensive you got a nd instantly went on the attack

[austinite]

Yes look at it. I have not edited anything I wrote.
You said once your hormone s return to normal so will you. End of story. I said its not the rule. And then you back tracked and said well if your ovee you gentic limit and so on. Anyome who can read can see it. its ok to be wrong. You can tell you know it by how defensive you got a nd instantly went on the attack

That's exactly what happened here.

[adamjames]

Wow I guess I'm the lucky one. I have disagreed with Gixxer on an open forum . I didn't get banned. Crazy. Oh by the way when I disagreed I did a little more research and found out I was wrong. You know what I did then? I told him I was wrong. Know what happened then? Nothing , life went on, felt pretty good about my acknowledgment .

Yeah i guess you are the lucky 1, Lucky if you consider being banned from a virtual forum bad in any way shape or form which i dont i come here for info on the cycles i do i couldnt give 2 shits about the pathetic post whores who roam about thinking they know it all i just find it hilarious how people suck up to them just because they want a source check or something, sorry gixxer but i would admit if i was wrong as i have on many debates BUT ITS SO OBVIOUS THAT STEROIDS INCREASE PERFORMANCE AND MUSCLE MASS BUT WHEN THE STEROIDS ARE NO LONGER IN YOUR SYSTEM YOU WILL INEVITABLY EVENTUALLY LOSE MOST OF YOUR GAINS AND GO BACK TO WHAT WAS NATURALLY ACHIEVABLE WITH NATURAL HORMONE LEVELS...........GOOD GOD ITS SO SIMPLE AND OBVIOUS WHAT I SAID, IF YOU PUT A TURBO ON A CAR IT WILL GO FASTER BUT WHEN YOU TAKE IT OFF IT WILL GO SLOWER, BUT I UNDERSTAND THAT YOU MAY BE UNDER THE ILLUSION THE TURBO IS STILL WORKING BUT IM AFRAID ITS NOT SO IF YOU SCROLL THROUGH RONNIE ROWLANDS POST ON SLINGSHOT TRAINING HE PROVIDES THE STUDIES TO PROVE WHAT I SAID IS TRUE BECAUSE I USETO THINK I COULD KEEP ALL MY GAINS ASWELL BUT KNOW I KNOW YOU CANNOT

LIKE I SAID IGNORANCE IS BLISS UNTIL YOU CANT DENY THE TRUTH, SO DO YOUR RESEARCH AND THEN COME AND ADMIT YOU WERE WRONG INSTEAD OF SWITCHING THE WHOLE THING ON ME AND TELLING ME IM THE BAD GUY HERE

[adamjames]

And i hope you all have a lovely day!!!!!!