2ND cycle question ..Would like suggestions

**crunkee** · 07-24-2012, 10:31 PM

Hi I just came off of my 1st real cycle and i am halfway thru PCT. I was a little disappointed in this cycle and would like some suggestions for my next cycle in a couple of months..

experience with Steroids is as follows 3 cycles of Anavar (ok i know thats not a real cycle ha ha)

coming off Test E 500mg per week 12 weeks

My age 37 years old
weight 187 lbs
bf id guess about 11%
workout 5 days per week
diet avg. should eat more.. should eat a lil less junk

I feel like i didnt gain much lean mass or weight on this last cycle . I feel like the last 12 weeks was as if i wasnt on anything really as far as strength goes and ive kept about only 8lbs of what i gained which isnt bad just i thought it would be a lil more

Anyways moving forward can someone with more experience than i have give me a decent take on a good 2nd cycle ..10 to 12 weeks thanks for any help.

This cycle will start around November or December

**austinite** · 07-24-2012, 10:39 PM

Originally Posted by crunkee

Hi I just came off of my 1st real cycle and i am halfway thru PCT. I was a little disappointed in this cycle and would like some suggestions for my next cycle in a couple of months..

experience with Steroids is as follows 3 cycles of Anavar (ok i know thats not a real cycle ha ha)

coming off Test E 500mg per week 12 weeks

My age 37 years old
weight 187 lbs
bf id guess about 11%
workout 5 days per week
diet avg. should eat more.. should eat a lil less junk

I feel like i didnt gain much lean mass or weight on this last cycle . I feel like the last 12 weeks was as if i wasnt on anything really as far as strength goes and ive kept about only 8lbs of what i gained which isnt bad just i thought it would be a lil more

Anyways moving forward can someone with more experience than i have give me a decent take on a good 2nd cycle ..10 to 12 weeks thanks for any help.

This cycle will start around November or December

There's the problem.

Visit the nutrition forum. You simply don't know how to eat. The guys at the nutri forum can teach you how by tweaking your diet, eating times, etc... I would recommend you don't start a second cycle until you get your diet fixed.

**btern** · 07-24-2012, 11:10 PM

austinite is right bro diet plays a massive roll in your gains along with sufficient rest and good training program, just slow down do your research etc etc..... dont worry about juicin for now.... if your gonna do it why not do it the right way??? btern...

**Capebuffalo** · 07-25-2012, 05:36 AM

Both right. Diet is 90% of a cycle in my opinion. Its that important.

**fit2bOld** · 07-25-2012, 08:01 AM

You are what you eat!!!

**austinite** · 07-25-2012, 01:29 PM

Originally Posted by fit2bOld

You are what you eat!!!

Are you calling me a chicken??

**fanof** · 07-25-2012, 02:49 PM

Originally Posted by austinite

Are you calling me a chicken??

is he calling me a p*ssy (LOL bad joke but i couldnt help it)

**crunkee** · 07-25-2012, 10:42 PM

Well the problem isnt that i DONT KNOW how to eat. The problem is knowing and doing. Ive done plenty of research on a good diet...But at any rate ..between now and then i plan to get my diet in check..

Anyways if someone would like to have any incite on the question that was asked then that is fine . Ultimately Im going to do some research and decide myself what is right for me. I just wanted some suggestions from other members...

Ive never really understood the whole hi-jacking of threads and understood less the Bus people like to jump on with them.. Ever here when the 20 year old kid asks a juicing question? You know hes gonna do it .. But still the same you will have 50 people tell em why he shouldnt ..which is not bad .. but it would be better to tell him why not to followed by some advice what he should do cus hes gonna do it anyhow ...

**austinite** · 07-25-2012, 11:01 PM

Originally Posted by crunkee

Well the problem isnt that i DONT KNOW how to eat. The problem is knowing and doing. Ive done plenty of research on a good diet...But at any rate ..between now and then i plan to get my diet in check..

Anyways if someone would like to have any incite on the question that was asked then that is fine . Ultimately Im going to do some research and decide myself what is right for me. I just wanted some suggestions from other members...

Ive never really understood the whole hi-jacking of threads and understood less the Bus people like to jump on with them.. Ever here when the 20 year old kid asks a juicing question? You know hes gonna do it .. But still the same you will have 50 people tell em why he shouldnt ..which is not bad .. but it would be better to tell him why not to followed by some advice what he should do cus hes gonna do it anyhow ...

Bro. I know this is not what you want to hear, and no offense. But you're displaying a picture of a weak and lazy man. If you really know how to eat and refuse to implement it, cycling should be the last thing on your mind. You asked for suggestions and you got it. But it's not what you wanted to hear, so you got a little cranky. You want folks to give you advice on gear, but gear is clearly not the issue here.

I disagree. We've had countless threads where kids were convinced not to cycle early. To continue and advise them would be a disservice. Frankly, I wouldn't even worry about that until you develop some discipline yourself.

Again, I don't say anything with malice and sincerely wish you the best of luck.

**kelkel** · 07-26-2012, 07:02 AM

Austinite is on target here. If just "gear" were the answer then we'd all be looking like Arnold, right! You'll get there, just be patient! Eating properly and enough can seriously be hard.

**crunkee** · 07-26-2012, 10:33 PM

well weak and lazy i am not .. i have the pics to prove that ... go to my thread under cycles. Im at the gym 5days a week ..so wrong again you are. Kelkel i dont think your pic looks any better than i do .. if you work out with gear or without gear and keep same diet .. you will be stronger and will gain mass with gear period.. when u get off the juice and pct you will be stronger than if you never juiced period.. if you diet right you will gain more than without .. for gods sake yall acting like i eat only twice a day and chow down on twinkies, soda, and potato chips! do you know what i eat? do you know how i workout.. no no and no.. so please troll another thread if you do not have any suggestions for the ? asked..

Which words should we highlight this time Austinite?

**austinite** · 07-26-2012, 10:44 PM

Originally Posted by crunkee

well weak and lazy i am not .. i have the pics to prove that ... go to my thread under cycles. Im at the gym 5days a week ..so wrong again you are. Kelkel i dont think your pic looks any better than i do .. if you work out with gear or without gear and keep same diet .. you will be stronger and will gain mass with gear period.. when u get off the juice and pct you will be stronger than if you never juiced period.. if you diet right you will gain more than without .. for gods sake yall acting like i eat only twice a day and chow down on twinkies, soda, and potato chips! do you know what i eat? do you know how i workout.. no no and no.. so please troll another thread if you do not have any suggestions for the ? asked..

Which words should we highlight this time Austinite?

There you go. Just for fun, I'll be like you and choose what I want to read and ignore the rest. Good night.

**kelkel** · 07-27-2012, 03:33 PM

Wow op. We've done nothing other than give you honest opinions. Nothing derogatory. Did I do or say something wrong? Please explain. And btw, I'll be 55 years old later this year and only do TRT. Haven't done a cycle since 1989 when I last competed, and that is how I look any day of the week. I'm glad you look good as that's what it's about.

**Capebuffalo** · 07-27-2012, 05:39 PM

Two questions. How small were you before your cycle? Your 187 lbs now? 12 weeks later. If you are 5-2 ft. you probably did alright. Second question. What is everything you ate yesterday. You diet should be even a little higher now than it was on cycle. Third thing not question. Do you have illusions of grandure? Or are you just delusional ? You have to post a pic , no face of the physique that rivals kelkel.

**crunkee** · 07-27-2012, 07:09 PM

Ive just realized im in the company of idiots.. i guess u can have illusions of grandure ..but its usually delusions of grandeur. i have posted pics duh! aug is a man with a pic of a female for his pic....weird ......kelkel is the only respectful one here and if hes 55 years old he looks damn good for his age. I dont member aug showing any real pics

**Capebuffalo** · 07-27-2012, 07:16 PM

List what you ate yesterday. Simple question. What are your macros? Your tdee. Help us help you. And you need to change your attitude. SMART PHONE AUTOFILL SMART ASS.

**Bevsta123** · 07-27-2012, 10:12 PM

Assuring your diet is up to check a good 2nd cycle would look something like this

Week 1-4 DBOL 30 mg/day
Week 1-12 Test E 500mg/week
Week 1-12 Aromasin (Exemestane) 10mg/ED on cycle incase of estrogenic sides.

14 Days after last Test E Pin
week 1-6 Tamox 20mg/ED (40mg/ED week 1)
week 1-6 Clomid 25mg/ED (50mg/ED week 1)

**MuscleInk** · 07-28-2012, 12:59 AM

Originally Posted by Bevsta123

Assuring your diet is up to check a good 2nd cycle would look something like this

Week 1-4 DBOL 30 mg/day
Week 1-12 Test E 500mg/week
Week 1-12 Aromasin (Exemestane) 10mg/ED on cycle incase of estrogenic sides.

14 Days after last Test E Pin
week 1-6 Tamox 20mg/ED (40mg/ED week 1)
week 1-6 Clomid 25mg/ED (50mg/ED week 1)

Hey crunkee.....sorry I'm late to the party on this one. It's been a long day of eating, working, lifting! Lol

I know what you really wanted was some second cycle suggestions, but the guys here are right. DIET truly is everything. The pros didn't get as big as a house being lazy or uncommitted to a nutrition plan. I use a spreadsheet daily to log every piece of food that passes my lips. All food is weighed and the cals, fat, protein, and carbs for EVERYTHING are entered in to the spreadsheet which also contains a built in formula indicating the remaining number of cals, fat, protein, and carbs I have left based on my intake goals supporting my overall program (i.e. to gain lean mass or to cut more bf). All of my food for the next day is prepared at night so I never have to sacrifice my nutrition for something that is convenient and crap. Is it a lot of work? Hell ya! Is it worth it? Damn straight! The most common comment I hear is, "that's to much work", or "I'm too busy to do all that", to which I say steroids are not a quick answer and if you are not committing to a near perfect nutrition plan, you are committing to failure. If your nutrition is as perfected as you argue, why not post a nutrition log or typical daily summary as CapeBuffalo asked to validate your claim?

With respect to body fat, I'm not calling your bluff, but, a lot of people don't really know what 14% looks like and frequently overestimate their bf. Again, I'm not calling you a liar so let's not go on the defensive here, but take a look at my avi, that's about 10-12%. If you are not looking that lean, you may be more than 14%. Why is this important? Excessive body fat often increases estrogen levels which is counterproductive for body building. Excessive fat also reduces receptor sensitivity and testosterone binding reducing the effectiveness of steroids. This is why you hear a lot of people in this forum insisting a bf% of less than 20%, ideally even less than 15%.

I see Bevsta123 has recommended a cycle. It's not one I would personally recommend unless water retention is your goal. Sure, you will see some solid gains but if you don't have the nutrition to support it, you'll deflate like a balloon post cycle and this would be a tremendous waste of time, money, and effort. Moreover, and Bevsta I mean you no disrespect, but your (Bevsta) profile says you are 18 and 100% natural. I commend you in that achievement but how does this make you an authority on steroid cycles? Perhaps you've done a lot of research and are well educated on anabolic cycles and use, but my money would be on the experience of those who have successfully completed several cycles, achieved gains in mass and strength, and maintained those achievements following each cycle. Again, no disrespect intended Bevsta.

Lastly, if you are in the "company of idiots", to coin your expression, wouldn't that make you an idiot as well? I do not believe you to be an idiot any more than I would characterize those people trying to help you here. I know it's antagonizing when people aren't giving you a straight answer, but most of the time, the offer to help is genuine and not meant to inflame you.

Hopefully we'll get some constructive comments going.

Cheers,

MI

**crunkee** · 07-28-2012, 11:39 AM

Well that cycle posted by Bevsta123 is basically what my last cycle looked like minus the DBOL . The best diets or at least in my opinions that Im going to model mine after is one that i seen where the guy while training ate the same thing everyday . What is nice about it is the simplicity. Easy to shop and only having to count the protein carbs and fat once. I was going to modify it by doing 2 diff meal plans and alternate them every other day or every other week, just to break it up a lil. With that if you count up 6000-7000 calories per day you can just break it easy into small meals every 2 hours or so adding in some supplements and have it ready to go. As far as the cycle goes Im not sure yet I still have a bunch of time b4 i can cycle again, but i was thinking of some Prop first 4 weeks with some test e or c, throughout last 4 weeks adding in some var.. i kinda wanted to try Tren though so ill be looking into that. Aromosin worked good for sides as i found out. i think next go around i wont wait as long to start it though.

**dbw1968** · 07-28-2012, 05:59 PM

To be honest it is hard for the avg person to eat like you guys suggest. I work outside sll day and there is no way I could eat perfect everyday. I am not looking to be a professional bodybuilde. I think most of the peiple here are recreational guys who workout hard looking for a boost in muscle mass and strength. We are not full time body builders. I have made really good gains on a decent diet with Increased calorie and protein intake. I have lost fat and gained lean muscle. I only took test e with stane and am in my 8th week. I wonder if you possibly got some bogus test. I feel like I could lift a house every week so my stuff is legit. I know you guys know your stuff and diet is extremely important, but it is possible to make good gains on avg diets and working hard. Granted gains would be even better if I could eat like you guys do, but can't. The cycle is doing what I wanted and needed without eating 4000 calories. I guess yall are gonna hammer me now. Lol

**Capebuffalo** · 07-29-2012, 07:09 AM

Originally Posted by crunkee

Well that cycle posted by Bevsta123 is basically what my last cycle looked like minus the DBOL . The best diets or at least in my opinions that Im going to model mine after is one that i seen where the guy while training ate the same thing everyday . What is nice about it is the simplicity. Easy to shop and only having to count the protein carbs and fat once. I was going to modify it by doing 2 diff meal plans and alternate them every other day or every other week, just to break it up a lil. With that if you count up 6000-7000 calories per day you can just break it easy into small meals every 2 hours or so adding in some supplements and have it ready to go. As far as the cycle goes Im not sure yet I still have a bunch of time b4 i can cycle again, but i was thinking of some Prop first 4 weeks with some test e or c, throughout last 4 weeks adding in some var.. i kinda wanted to try Tren though so ill be looking into that. Aromosin worked good for sides as i found out. i think next go around i wont wait as long to start it though.

Your 187 lbs and will be eating 6000-7000 cals a day?

**fit2bOld** · 07-29-2012, 07:46 AM

Originally Posted by austinite

Are you calling me a chicken??

Yeah Im a chicken too.....LOL

**fit2bOld** · 07-29-2012, 07:51 AM

Originally Posted by dbw1968

To be honest it is hard for the avg person to eat like you guys suggest. I work outside sll day and there is no way I could eat perfect everyday. I am not looking to be a professional bodybuilde. I think most of the peiple here are recreational guys who workout hard looking for a boost in muscle mass and strength. We are not full time body builders. I have made really good gains on a decent diet with Increased calorie and protein intake. I have lost fat and gained lean muscle. I only took test e with stane and am in my 8th week. I wonder if you possibly got some bogus test. I feel like I could lift a house every week so my stuff is legit. I know you guys know your stuff and diet is extremely important, but it is possible to make good gains on avg diets and working hard. Granted gains would be even better if I could eat like you guys do, but can't. The cycle is doing what I wanted and needed without eating 4000 calories. I guess yall are gonna hammer me now. Lol

You should start your own thread instead of hijacking this one

**dbw1968** · 07-29-2012, 09:27 AM

I didnt hijack. I was taking up for the OP. Everyone was kinda preaching to him. I was just telling me my story and that he may have ghot ahold of sime bad test.

**kelkel** · 07-29-2012, 10:44 AM

Originally Posted by dbw1968

To be honest it is hard for the avg person to eat like you guys suggest. I work outside sll day and there is no way I could eat perfect everyday. I am not looking to be a professional bodybuilde. I think most of the peiple here are recreational guys who workout hard looking for a boost in muscle mass and strength. We are not full time body builders. I have made really good gains on a decent diet with Increased calorie and protein intake. I have lost fat and gained lean muscle. I only took test e with stane and am in my 8th week. I wonder if you possibly got some bogus test. I feel like I could lift a house every week so my stuff is legit. I know you guys know your stuff and diet is extremely important, but it is possible to make good gains on avg diets and working hard. Granted gains would be even better if I could eat like you guys do, but can't. The cycle is doing what I wanted and needed without eating 4000 calories. I guess yall are gonna hammer me now. Lol

Agreed DBW. It is very hard and like MuscleInk said above, it takes sacrifice and discipline. Sometimes to the extent that other parts of your life will suffer to achieve your goals. Albeit, life does throw wrenches that get in the way for sure! Still, you need to eat as much as you can and when you can't, creative protein drinks will go a long way too.

**crunkee** · 07-29-2012, 09:53 PM

Yes eating what your suppose to when your suppose to can be more than challenging for an avg working person. IMO it can be done.. As far as the gear goes...without blood work which i did not get done ..its hard to say ..my guess is that is was underdosed ..since we can talk about UGLs now it was from Kalpa and the source i got it from checks out from them ..so i dont know what to make of that? I think the source is dec but ill go with a diff UGL next time and may see if i can get someone on here with a great cycle to tell me their source . DBW is right ..as of now im not thinking of going into competition ..it would be somewhat fun and i wouldnt mind it but for now its not my goal. Im no spring chicken either and that factors in to the big scheme of things as well. Im somewhat content with my body on a anyone else around my age level.. Nobody i even know is in better shape. I get compliments/mentions daily about my physique. I cant cycle again till around Nov/Dec so I decide my course of action between now and then. I appreciate Kelkel someone who competed which u have to be dedicated to do that.