moving up from PH

**TYHO127** · 10-11-2012, 02:01 PM

Need advice on planning a good cycle. I have done a couple cycles of a Ph called mdrol. Wanting to step it up though, but I know I will have to be a lot more cautious with stronger gear. I am thinking I want to keep bulking. I would like and advice. A lot of you have a crazy amount of knowledge and I would appreciate it thanks!

**Phased** · 10-11-2012, 02:10 PM

Stats
Age, body weight, bf%
How long you been training
What your goals are.

**TYHO127** · 10-11-2012, 02:27 PM

27. 5"11. 180lbs. 10%bf. Trained steady HS and military 5 years inconsistantly for two. Then been steady again for two. But the last six Months been going pretty hard!

**Phased** · 10-11-2012, 02:48 PM

Solid first cycle

Weeks
1-12 test cyp 500mg EW (250mg pinned Monday morning and thursday night)
1-4 dbol 60mg Ed spread throughout the day
1-12 Aromasin 10-12.5mg EOD (hone in and adjust based on feeling)
1-12 HCG 250iu pinned same day as test

Liver support
NAC 600mg

Pct
Nolvadex 40/40/20/20
Clomid 70/70/35/35

Eat like a beast, sleep like a princess and train like the hulk.

Best

**TYHO127** · 10-11-2012, 03:08 PM

Solid! Can I use the same pins for hcg and test?

**Phased** · 10-11-2012, 03:16 PM

Originally Posted by TYHO127

Solid! Can I use the same pins for hcg and test?

Slin needles for hcg 31g 1/2cc
Test needles 25-28g 5/8"

**TYHO127** · 10-12-2012, 12:11 AM

So for pct 40mg the first two weeks then 20mg the next two weeks?

**Phased** · 10-12-2012, 12:14 AM

Yes sir

**DanB** · 10-12-2012, 12:14 AM

Originally Posted by TYHO127

So for pct 40mg the first two weeks then 20mg the next two weeks?

Correct

Edit

Beat me to it

Phased did you consume any ephedra based products recently?

You typing very fast today lol

**calstate23** · 10-12-2012, 12:18 AM

Originally Posted by TYHO127

So for pct 40mg the first two weeks then 20mg the next two weeks?

I don't know...Personally I do 20mg nolva, 40mg seems excessive to me..And since you're taking it with clomid I personally don't think it makes a difference to go that high....And to go further on that, I used to only do nolva 20mg ALONE way back in the day as my PCT and I never had any problems..Do I think it's optimal? No.

But it shows how strong nolva is...Pound for pound nolva is better in my book but there is other reasons clomid has it's place to run both..

**Phased** · 10-12-2012, 12:21 AM

Tests show that 20mg of nolva is probably just as effective as 40mg however the boards group think is the way I described. I try not to go against the grain to hard but 20/20/20/20 with the nolva and clomid will work just fine. I personally have always done 40/40/20/20.
Thanks Cal
Best

**Phased** · 10-12-2012, 12:23 AM

Originally Posted by DanB

Correct

Edit

Beat me to it

Phased did you consume any ephedra based products recently?

You typing very fast today lol

150mcg t4

**kmms** · 10-12-2012, 12:42 AM

Originally Posted by Phased

Tests show that 20mg of nolva is probably just as effective as 40mg however the boards group think is the way I described. I try not to go against the grain to hard but 20/20/20/20 with the clomid will work just fine. I personally have always done 40/40/20/20.
Thanks Cal
Best

thought i remember reading one of swifto's stickies that supported the idea of 20mg of nolva being just as effective as dosing higher in the beginning and tapering down over the course of the month. this is the protocol i'll be following in 5 more weeks when my PCT begins. if i'm citing the wrong source or the wrong SERM i'd appreciate being corrected.

**Phased** · 10-12-2012, 12:43 AM

Originally Posted by kmms

thought i remember reading one of swifto's stickies that supported the idea of 20mg of nolva being just as effective as dosing higher in the beginning and tapering down over the course of the month. this is the protocol i'll be following in 5 more weeks when my PCT begins. if i'm citing the wrong source or the wrong SERM i'd appreciate being corrected.

You are correct swifto did post that.
Best

**Sworder** · 10-12-2012, 12:49 AM

Nolva & Clomid have a 5 day half life. If you have some understanding of biochem it would be wise to have clomid and nolva dosed higher the first week(personally I just load it all on day 1; )

**shredded** · 10-12-2012, 12:57 AM

Don't you think 60mg D Bol ED is a high dosage for first cycle.

**calstate23** · 10-12-2012, 01:05 AM

Originally Posted by shredded

Don't you think 60mg D Bol ED is a high dosage for first cycle.

Yeah that's pretty high

**shredded** · 10-12-2012, 01:09 AM

Agreed ^^

I would personally get rid of d Bol all together and just run one compound or lower the dosage.

**Sworder** · 10-12-2012, 01:12 AM

Running dianabol @ 40mg as a kick start or frontload the testosterone is easy, get the most out of your cycle! I would be more than happy to guide anybody through this personally if they needed help with any questions in regards to the whole "2 compounds issue". It's actually not even two different things, they are both androgens that are subject to aromatase.

**Phased** · 10-12-2012, 01:14 AM

He already ran a pro hormone so I factored that in. In my opinion it's a wasted first cycle with cause you have little strength gains with test e. I have never and would never suggest running a cycle where you have nothing to show for for 4-6 weeks. So then there is only 6 weeks left...bummer to me. I want people to see gains from start to finish.

On the dbol he could run 40mg Ed but I think 60mg is better. He will show strength gains within the first week and that's something test will not do.

Best

**Phased** · 10-12-2012, 01:15 AM

Originally Posted by Sworder

Running dianabol @ 40mg as a kick start or frontload the testosterone is easy, get the most out of your cycle! I would be more than happy to guide anybody through this personally if they needed help with any questions in regards to the whole "2 compounds issue". It's actually not even two different things, they are both androgens that are subject to aromatase.

Well said,
Best

**shredded** · 10-12-2012, 01:17 AM

Point being I just don't think the dosage need to be so high 40mg is much more appropriate.

**Sworder** · 10-12-2012, 01:17 AM

Haven't seen one complain from a Test + Dianabol kick start cycle. Those cycles usually have a lot better results as you are growing the whole time, if compared to a Test only cycle all other things equal.

**Phased** · 10-12-2012, 01:19 AM

Originally Posted by shredded

Point being I just don't think the dosage need to be so high 40mg is much more appropriate.

What is 40mg gonna do to him thats so bad that 20mg more will? It's dbol , not anadrol .
Liver support NAC 600mg Ed and your fine.

Best

**TYHO127** · 10-13-2012, 08:13 PM

So should I stick with the original plan?

**Sworder** · 10-13-2012, 08:15 PM

Originally Posted by Phased

Solid first cycle

Weeks
1-12 test cyp 500mg EW (250mg pinned Monday morning and thursday night)
1-4 dbol 60mg Ed spread throughout the day
1-12 Aromasin 10-12.5mg EOD (hone in and adjust based on feeling)
1-12 HCG 250iu pinned same day as test

Liver support
NAC 600mg

Pct
Nolvadex 40/40/20/20
Clomid 70/70/35/35

Eat like a beast, sleep like a princess and train like the hulk.

Best

Yes, this is solid advice.

**Devils Advocate** · 10-13-2012, 08:23 PM

Originally Posted by TYHO127

Need advice on planning a good cycle. I have done a couple cycles of a Ph called mdrol. Wanting to step it up though, but I know I will have to be a lot more cautious with stronger gear. I am thinking I want to keep bulking. I would like and advice. A lot of you have a crazy amount of and I would appreciate it thanks!

mdrol is strong gear bro. Stronger than dbol is.

**TYHO127** · 10-14-2012, 10:21 PM

Really? Wow I thought it was stronger than most Ph but not that strong. I have been getting great results though!

**ineedauser** · 10-15-2012, 07:10 AM

Mdrol as in Methadrol?

**Devils Advocate** · 10-15-2012, 07:53 AM

Originally Posted by ineedauser

Mdrol as in Methadrol?

Mdrol as in CEL's M-Drol. It's Methastoron(e)/Methyldrostanolone but more commonly known as Superdrol, which has just recently been put on the list of Schedule III controlled substances.

**Juced_porkchop** · 10-15-2012, 08:57 AM

Originally Posted by TYHO127

Need advice on planning a good cycle. I have done a couple cycles of a Ph called mdrol. Wanting to step it up though, but I know I will have to be a lot more cautious with stronger gear. I am thinking I want to keep bulking. I would like and advice. A lot of you have a crazy amount of knowledge and I would appreciate it thanks!

sory to break it to you but mdrol is much more toxic then most inject aas. juts because its OTC DOESNT make it safer.
it is liver toxic where as teste is not.
oral only cycles are also bad for you for other resons.

I would rec a teste cycle with maybe tbol or dbol . and although prob no needed, you could add HCG the last 4-5 weeks of cycle leading upto BUT NOT into PCT at 500iu 2X a week for extra help in recovery.

wk1-14 500mg teste ew
wk1-6 Tbol 40mg ed
wk1-15 AI Stane 12.5mg ed-eod
wk10-15 HCG 500iu 2X a week
wk15-19 PCT : Clomid 70/70/35/35mg , Tamox/nolva: 30/30/20/20

Thats what I would rec.
you could swap tbol for dbol, but keep in mind it may have more estrogen issues.

Good luck man!