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  1. #1
    msoda's Avatar
    msoda is offline New Member
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Posts
    5

    Questions on Gyno, HCG, & Mixing Orals

    My stats:

    Age: 36
    Weight: 185
    Height: 5' 10"
    BF% - not sure but I'm lean (lots of regular endurance training)
    Cycle experience: 6 cycles in 7 years (always Test, & have tried EQ, Deca , Masteron , Tbol, Dbol , Winny, Halo)

    AAS Goals: I have permanent low test & want all the good stuff that comes with "normal test levels" - drive, motivation, better recovery times, added strength, etc. I don't want to yo-yo strength/side-effects.

    I never got a baseline for Testosterone levels before my 1st cycle at 29. I hated the crash even after PCT (did PCT with every cycle Nolva/Clomid 4-6 weeks). After a few cycles started adding HCG while on cycle & having my test levels checked a few months after each cycle. I never got Test level over 220. That explains why my post cycle crash was worse than expected, my test probably sucked since even before my 1st cycle. I am now on a long period off of AAS (12+ months). Still terrible, Test: 192, Free Test: 3.51

    I have explained all to my Endocrinologist - I've taken other medications for 20 years that he says certainly could have hurt my ability to produce test - so maybe it wasn't just my cycles. I guess I'll never know since I had no baseline. My Endo only wants to boost me to the bottom range of normal test & wants me to start with that cream bullshit. I also went to an anti-aging clinic that will boost me to top of normal (900-1000), plus will give me HCG & HGH (6iu/week to aim for IGF-1 = 375). I like the idea but the cost to go the anti-aging route is INSANELY expensive.

    For cost reasons I've decided to get my own gear for TRT & blast occasionally. My Endo will monitor me with a full understanding of the compounds that I'll be taking. This week I have ordered my new gear. I'm going to cruise for a while & with additional blood work I'll find my optimal dosages, then I'll blast & see exactly what it does to my new TRT baseline levels. Note, I'm taking DHEA & some other supplements where I'm deficient.

    TRT Cruise: Same as outlined by Anti-Aging doc except he recommended less --> test=200mg/w & 6iu/w HGH.

    1mg Arimidex /w
    250 mg Test/w
    1,000 iu HGC/w
    14 iu/w HGH

    My 1st Blast - 10 weeks

    2 mg Arimidex/w
    250 mg Test/w
    200 mg Tren /w
    1,500 iu HGC/w
    24.5 iu/w
    50-75mg Tbol/day (weeks 1-4)

    Note: I'm going to leave the HGH at 24.5 iu/w for a good 6 months while back on my TRT cruise levels (if I like what it does to my IGF-1 levels compared to 14iu/w).

    On my very last cycle I got a tiny hard bump & a tender nip - so stopped my last cycle early & did PCT. Nips are normal now but I really want to be sure I focus on staying gyno free. I didn't use Adex on my last cycle because I read it might hurt gains & I had never had any sign of gyno on previous cycles so figured maybe I'd leave it out, never again! have also ordered Letro in case it happens again - I'll be ready.

    Questions:

    1. I got 50mg Dbols as a FREEBEE when I ordered my gear. I tried Dbol once 50mg/day (w/o Adex) & didn't like the bloat/acne. I liked Tbol results OK & the lack of sides. However I recognize that the Dbol gave better gains & I "felt" it more. I know the mantra "don't mix orals" but figure it is the cumulative effect of mixing orals that is the problem. For example 50mg Dbol/day + 50mg Tbol/day would add additional strain to the liver as I'm taking 100mg/day combined. What if instead to get some of that extra Dbol kick while minimizing the sides I tried 25mg Tbol & 25mg Dbol each day? HAS ANYONE TRIED THIS? This would total the same 50mg/day that I would have if I just picked one or the other. If mixing is undesirable, I might up the Tbol to 75mg/day.

    2. Considering my slight gyno last cycle - are the precautions I've outlined above enough (staying on Adex with Letro on hand just in case)?

    3. Should I increase my HCG dose while blasting (as outlined above)?

    FYI - I'll be posting progress/blood-work & my future questions as they come to cycle logs & TRT board. But since my questions here are not specifically TRT related - I figured I'd post this one here.

    All comments welcomed - I'm a long time reader on this board & respect the deep knowledge base! Thanks for reading.
    Last edited by msoda; 11-04-2012 at 01:41 PM.

  2. #2
    MickeyKnox is offline Banned
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    CANADA
    Posts
    13,200
    Quote Originally Posted by msoda View Post
    My stats:

    Age: 36
    Weight: 185
    Height: 5' 10"
    BF% - not sure but I'm lean (lots of regular endurance training)
    Cycle experience: 6 cycles in 7 years (always Test, & have tried EQ, Deca , Masteron , Tbol, Dbol , Winny, Halo)

    AAS Goals: I have permanent low test & want all the good stuff that comes with "normal test levels" - drive, motivation, better recovery times, added strength, etc. I don't want to yo-yo strength/side-effects.

    I never got a baseline for Testosterone levels before my 1st cycle at 29. I hated the crash even after PCT (did PCT with every cycle Nolva/Clomid 4-6 weeks). After a few cycles started adding HCG while on cycle & having my test levels checked a few months after each cycle. I never got Test level over 220. That explains why my post cycle crash was worse than expected, my test probably sucked since even before my 1st cycle. I am now on a long period off of AAS (12+ months). Still terrible, Test: 192, Free Test: 3.51

    I have explained all to my Endocrinologist - I've taken other medications for 20 years that he says certainly could have hurt my ability to produce test - so maybe it wasn't just my cycles. I guess I'll never know since I had no baseline. My Endo only wants to boost me to the bottom range of normal test & wants me to start with that cream bullshit. I also went to an anti-aging clinic that will boost me to top of normal (900-1000), plus will give me HCG & HGH (6iu/week to aim for IGF-1 = 375). I like the idea but the cost to go the anti-aging route is INSANELY expensive.

    For cost reasons I've decided to get my own gear for TRT & blast occasionally. My Endo will monitor me with a full understanding of the compounds that I'll be taking. This week I have ordered my new gear. I'm going to cruise for a while & with additional blood work I'll find my optimal dosages, then I'll blast & see exactly what it does to my new TRT baseline levels. Note, I'm taking DHEA & some other supplements where I'm deficient.

    TRT Cruise: Same as outlined by Anti-Aging doc except he recommended less --> test=200mg/w & 6iu/w HGH.

    1mg Arimidex /w
    250 mg Test/w
    1,000 iu HGC/w
    14 iu/w HGH

    My 1st Blast - 10 weeks

    2 mg Arimidex/w You may find this too much.
    250 mg Test/w What ester?
    200 mg Tren /w What ester?
    1,500 iu HGC/w 250iu 2/wk should be fine unless you have had bloodwork that states otherwise.
    24.5 iu/w
    50-75mg Tbol/day (weeks 1-4) Fine.

    Note: I'm going to leave the HGH at 24.5 iu/w for a good 6 months while back on my TRT cruise levels (if I like what it does to my IGF-1 levels compared to 14iu/w).

    On my very last cycle I got a tiny hard bump & a tender nip - so stopped my last cycle early & did PCT. Nips are normal now but I really want to be sure I focus on staying gyno free. I didn't use Adex on my last cycle because I read it might hurt gains & I had never had any sign of gyno on previous cycles so figured maybe I'd leave it out, never again! have also ordered Letro in case it happens again - I'll be ready. Never cycle without an AI bro.

    Questions:

    1. I got 50mg Dbols as a FREEBEE when I ordered my gear. I tried Dbol once 50mg/day (w/o Adex) & didn't like the bloat/acne. I liked Tbol results OK & the lack of sides. However I recognize that the Dbol gave better gains & I "felt" it more. I know the mantra "don't mix orals" but figure it is the cumulative effect of mixing orals that is the problem. For example 50mg Dbol/day + 50mg Tbol/day would add additional strain to the liver as I'm taking 100mg/day combined. What if instead to get some of that extra Dbol kick while minimizing the sides I tried 25mg Tbol & 25mg Dbol each day? HAS ANYONE TRIED THIS? This would total the same 50mg/day that I would have if I just picked one or the other. If mixing is undesirable, I might up the Tbol to 75mg/day. Tbol is milder as you know. So it's your call on which one you choose, but using both is not recommended.

    2. Considering my slight gyno last cycle - are the precautions I've outlined above enough (staying on Adex with Letro on hand just in case)? AI on cycle.

    3. Should I increase my HCG dose while blasting (as outlined above)? I wouldn't. 250iu 2/wk should be fine to keep the buys plump while on cycle.

    FYI - I'll be posting progress/blood-work & my future questions as they come to cycle logs & TRT board. But since my questions here are not specifically TRT related - I figured I'd post this one here. Looking forward to your bloods.

    All comments welcomed - I'm a long time reader on this board & respect the deep knowledge base! Thanks for reading.
    reds..

  3. #3
    msoda's Avatar
    msoda is offline New Member
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Posts
    5
    Thanks for the info. Both Test & Tren are Enanthate esters. I ran HCG at 250 2x/w the 1st time I used it but didn't feel like it was doing it's job. I was happy when I cycled taking HCG at around 400 2x/w. My thoughts to start at 1,000iu/w was just based on what the Anti-Aging doc recommended to me (along with 200mg/w Test Cyp). And I was unsure about increasing HCG when blasting - I def need more research & would love to know what results I'm hoping to attain with HCG & Adex regarding lab results. What numbers should be effected & how? I know my estridriol level being at over 30 was not good considering how low my test is. I'll get my current blood work posted soon. Thx again.

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