Can long term use create an immunity.........?

[Capebuffalo]

Anabolics 2002 and 2004 author William Llewellyn

"I think the diminishing returns fact has more to do with losing a positive
protein balance as the muscle cells get bigger and bigger.. Androgens
actually increase their own receptor concentrations; very different from
what we see with most other drugs.. Other factors, like increased protein
degredation, and in inability to shuttle higher and higher amouts of
nutrients to the cells, probably play a more important role here.

What you see is a dramtic increase in androgen receptor levels when one goes on a cycle. A little counter-intuitative at first, but a well documented fact.."

[warmouth]

Man, if we get a definitive answer to this, we should sticky it. I would like to know long term gaining, such as cruising year around, if the need is more of the compound or just different compounds. Very interesting topic, and I have wondered alot about this topic. Thanks for posting this one Bear!

[Bio-Active]

Some of the biggest guys i know at the gym run 500 mg e/w of test year round and switch other compounds out all the time and swear by it. I am in no way advocating that this is a good idea but these guys only goal in life is to be huge and on the big stage. I don't think its worth it as only a few have he genetics to go pro.

[fit2bOld]

I'm pretty sure I have read an article that debunks receptor down regulating......

He got it from sworder

[Natureboy71]

I have no evidence to back it but I think after so much time you do not become immume per say but absolutley need more and more as others have said. I think at that point too genetics plays a huge role in how much bigger you can get or how much your genetics allow the AAS to be effective.

This with all other things being equal such as diet, training, rest and so on.

[warmouth]

I would have to say that human grade or 100% correctly dosed UGL gear, you can beat genetics. Just my opinion. Genetics do in fact play a huge role in growth, but more so than that, is adding to you own gene pool by adding alot of human grade gear and tons and tons of food. I would say that if money was no object, you could grow to the giant freaks you see on stage by being able to afford the needed meals and human grade goods.

[The Bear 79]

Anabolics 2002 and 2004 author William Llewellyn

"I think the diminishing returns fact has more to do with losing a positive
protein balance as the muscle cells get bigger and bigger.. Androgens
actually increase their own receptor concentrations; very different from
what we see with most other drugs.. Other factors, like increased protein
degredation, and in inability to shuttle higher and higher amouts of
nutrients to the cells, probably play a more important role here.

What you see is a dramtic increase in androgen receptor levels when one goes on a cycle. A little counter-intuitative at first, but a well documented fact.."

Outstanding Cape! Thank you. I found it & I'm gonna read every word. And thank you to the rest of you as well, everything everyone has posted makes perfect, logical sense & in fact, several of your posts have been very close to what appears to be the actual truth (Llewellyn's publishing's) That tells me I'm surrounded by a bunch of fvcking geniuses.................keep em coming geniuses, I'm interested in ANY other subsequent info pertaining to this subject.

[Capebuffalo]

De nada Bear.

[10nispro]

http://allanabolics.org/media/conten...76b8838d24.pdf

This is all I could find. It might be out dated of sorts. Scroll down to 10 most common errors part

[The Bear 79]

http://allanabolics.org/media/conten...76b8838d24.pdf

This is all I could find. It might be out dated of sorts. Scroll down to 10 most common errors part

Thanx 10. Good info here too. The good thing about the links that you all post is they usually lead to another link & another & another & so on, I think I'm on to something Gents. I'll get back soon with what I hope can be considered a definitive answer.

[The Bear 79]

OK, it appears the common denominator everywhere I have researched is myostatin, now, there doesn't seem to be an actual immunity created so much as an "obstacle" formed over time. After I determined that myostatin build up was commonly mistaken for an immunity, I started researching myostatin blockers / inhibitors & found some very interesting study's. Take into consideration some of the doctors final determinations are speculation but I'm still pretty well sold, especially seeing as how I cant find any study proving otherwise. Have a look here Gents. lots of good info in this link. And of coarse I still welcome any & all subsequent opinions & / or supporting study's. http://www.google.com/custom?domains...O-8859-1&hl=en

[The Bear 79]

Also, for those of you that haven't researched the effects of excessive myostatin, I strongly advise you to do so, there's a ton of valuable info pertaining to how debilitating myostatin can be to muscle growth, & why we (steroid users) can often mistake this "issue" for an immunity to our gear.

[OnTheSauce]

Gimme the myostatin blockers. Im innnn

[RoadToHuge]

Got more info in the myostatin blockers?

[The Bear 79]

Gimme the myostatin blockers. Im innnn

Have seen / researched the potential side effects? I'm not trying to talk you out of it, I just want everyone to be thoroughly informed in all aspects of this before making a decision, there are repercussions.

[The Bear 79]

Got more info in the myostatin blockers?

What would you like to know?

[jimmyinkedup]

Without anything to back this up, it doesn't make sense. The body produces it's own androgens, and needs them for proper function. They're constantly circulating through our bodies. But; thats at physiological levels. The body constantly strives for homeostasis, so I would THINK that supra-physiological doses of AAS over a prolonged period of time would cause the body to adapt in a way that the new, high levels would elicit the response a normal physiological dose would, hence returning to baseline results with above baseline hormones. If this is true it could be considered building an immunity in a way, or at least adapting. Or maybe I'm talking out of my ass and couldn't be further from the mark

Your not talking out of your ass. 6 months ago i decided to cruise. 225mgtest/150mgs/deca...fist 3 months i felt amazing. All you would expect , sex drive , well being, gains etc. After that it just became normal. Right now I feel normal , like I would off cycle. Its not at all what I expected. Do I have more muscle mass than if I didnt cruise - yes ...but not nearly as much as one might expect to be honest.

[jimmyinkedup]

Anabolics 2002 and 2004 author William Llewellyn

"I think the diminishing returns fact has more to do with losing a positive
protein balance as the muscle cells get bigger and bigger.. Androgens
actually increase their own receptor concentrations; very different from
what we see with most other drugs.. Other factors, like increased protein
degredation, and in inability to shuttle higher and higher amouts of
nutrients to the cells, probably play a more important role here.

What you see is a dramtic increase in androgen receptor levels when one goes on a cycle. A little counter-intuitative at first, but a well documented fact.."

Nandi wrote about this. Under normal circumstances the AR degrades in about 3 hours and is replaced with new receptor. In the presence of Androgens however , the receptor life is extended to 6 hours and the production rate of new AR doubles.

[OnTheSauce]

I feel pretty normal on 1200 test right. Off in a week. :X

[Times Roman]

maybe someone should make a thread regarding myostatin blockers?

....just a thought?

[Lunk1]

Have seen / researched the potential side effects? I'm not trying to talk you out of it, I just want everyone to be thoroughly informed in all aspects of this before making a decision, there are repercussions.

I'm unable to even find a legit scrip myostatin blocker. Seems as if they are still in research trials at this point. Maybe I have missed something????

[Times Roman]

I'm unable to even find a legit scrip myostatin blocker. Seems as if they are still in research trials at this point. Maybe I have missed something????

I know a Ukranian Company that will sell you 50 grams for cheap! =)

[Lunk1]

I know a Ukranian Company that will sell you 50 grams for cheap! =)

After I send them an extra $200???