confusing HCG article

[Granovich]

i found this article on some forum and im not sure if i can copy it and paste here . i just want your opinion on that article :



Now, I feel compelled to address it openly because I see more and more of what I characterized as “failed PCTs.” Heck, there must be one thread every other day on someone’s unsuccessful attempt to recover. So, I perceive that there is a need for this discussion and I’ll give my viewpoint accordingly.

First, it seems that the use of HCG on cycle has created, for many, a false sense of security regarding the continuous function of their testes while on cycle. Yes, 250 iu or 500 iu of HCG a week while on cycle **may** keep your testes functional but most never really know, they just ASSUME. That is the first mistake I regularly see. This assumption often leads to the next mistake which is…

SERM only PCT and no, it is not enough! I know many will argue this point and say “If it is only a light cycle SERM only PCT is OK.” To that, I say, look at all the 500mg test for 12 week cycles that have tried the SERM only approach and failed. It is not enough.
Finally, there is a general lack of accounting for the AMOUNT and HALF LIVE of the AAS used on cycle. Specificly, you don’t want to start your PCT while you still have supra-physiological levels of AAS in your system. What is a non-supra-physiological level? To keep it simple, it is the point where there is less than 200 mg of an active AAS in your system. That is not a perfect estimate but it will work for most people. By taking the time to do this math, you will greatly improve your chance at recover. So, account for the dosage and drug(s) used in planning your PCT

For long esters (cyp/ent/deconate) estimate 7 days half life

If you ran 1000 mg of test cyp/ent a week then plan to start the HCG blast between 17-21 days after your last shot.

How did I get that? Simple…using the 7 day half life estimate.

@ 1000mg a week of test cyp/ent 7 days after your last shot there is 500 mg active in the blood. 14 days after the last shot, there is 250 mg active in the blood, at 21 days after the last shot, there is 125 mg active in the blood.

It doesn’t matter what the drug is it only matters what ester is attached to it. So, make sure you do the homework and look up the half life for your drugs and figure out how long it will take you to approximate “normal blood levels.”

So what is the answer? A comprehensive PCT plan that address all parts of the recovery process. Yes, that means an HCG blast, even if you use HCG on cycle! It includes 2 SERMS because they work syngerisitcly together to enhance test levels, and an AI to mitigate aromatization that will cause suppression of the HPTA through the feedback loop.

Many will say “you don’t need HCG and two SERMs, and an AI for PCT. That is just overkill.”

To that I’d say, maybe, but would you rather go overboard and make sure your get HPTA recover or not go far enough and remain shutdown? That is what we are really talking about here, right, recover? So why try to skimp or take the lightest PCT possible when there is no real harm in going the whole 9 nine yards and doing everything possible to ensure recover?

Okay, so now I’ve stated my position. What do I suggest? Well, I suggest what I just did to exit from 2 years of HRT. By the way, it is very similar to the PCT that I’ve used on myself for almost 20 years and with countless others. The blood tests I’ve collected over the years support its effectiveness. In fact, I just tested at 1048 ng/dl on my last blood draw.

I’ve linked a Google Doc spreadsheet with the protocol that I found to be most effective.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/...kE&output=html


PS i checked the link and its not working
but baically he had something like that

WEEK 1-4 2000 iu ( every other day)
and with that some letro as AI
and then took few days off ( stopped the letro too)
then CLOMID and NOLVADEX for 8 weeks at same dose ( 50mg clomid/40mg nolvadex)

[MickeyKnox]

Its not confusing if you have a fundamental understanding of what hCG is, what its role is, how it reacts with your hormones, and when the ideal time to include it during your cycle based on medical articles, empirical data, and most importantly - personal experience.

[Granovich]

Its not confusing if you have a fundamental understanding of what hCG is, what its role is, how it reacts with your hormones, and when the ideal time to include it during your cycle based on medical articles, empirical data, and most importantly - personal experience.

well i know how to incorporate HCG during cycle as its mentioned all over the forum so many times
but this guy ( who wrote the article ) is saying that you dont need to run it on cycle. only last 2-4 weeks at doses of 2000 iu every other day then start regular PCT
so there is big difference

[MickeyKnox]

well i know how to incorporate HCG during cycle as its mentioned all over the forum so many times
but this guy ( who wrote the article ) is saying that you dont need to run it on cycle. only last 2-4 weeks at doses of 2000 iu every other day then start regular PCT
so there is big difference

Nothing new here. The author is correct. You can blast at the end, BUT.., most of use here would rather prevent testicular atrophy during cycle than roll the dice at the end and hope for a restart.

I can assure you that while im preventing TA on cycle, because i've included my hCG on cycle, I know that my transition form on cycle to PCT will smoother than glass. There are no assurances when blasting at the end.

[adamjames]

whats not confusing about this game, just when you think you know what your talking about you realise you were just talking ignorant all along

[Granovich]

Nothing new here. The author is correct. You can blast at the end, BUT.., most of use here would rather prevent testicular atrophy during cycle than roll the dice at the end and hope for a restart.

I can assure you that while im preventing TA on cycle, because i've included my hCG on cycle, I know that my transition form on cycle to PCT will smoother than glass. There are no assurances when blasting at the end.

thats good to no bro. one more question. lets say you wanna do 8 weeks cycle. what option will be better
1) 1-8 weeks 250-500 iu X2 weekly ?
2) like the author said only last 2-3 weeks at 2000 iu EOD
3) 1-6 weeks 250 iu X2 /WK
7,8 weeks 2000 iu EOD .

third one you can do both together. would that make recovery smoother or not ?
thank you

[Granovich]

whats not confusing about this game, just when you think you know what your talking about you realise you were just talking ignorant all along

you are right man. i guess its all about trial and error with as much knowledge as possible
safety is #1

[MickeyKnox]

hCG on cycle beginning to end @ 250iu 2/wk.

[Granovich]

hCG on cycle beginning to end @ 250iu 2/wk.

oh ok . So no need for blast at the end to maximize chances of recovery ?
also on heavier cycles like the ones include tren and deca
is it the same ? 250 iu X2 per week ? or 500 X2 per week ?
thank you

[MickeyKnox]

The same.

And that's not a "heavy" cycle, but i understand your point.

[Granovich]

The same.

And that's not a "heavy" cycle, but i understand your point.

hahaha thank you

[MickeyKnox]

Youre welcome