I need education on pros and cons of running two cycles in a row.....

**REBORN52** · 01-02-2013, 04:45 PM

I've tried to do diligence and find the info without having to bother you guys, but haven't been successful. I'm 37, just run my first cycle of test e 250 and Stanozolol . I did (2) shots a week at 1cc of the test and 1cc twice a week of the Stano.

I want to run another cycle behind this one and the start my PCT. I'm thinking of going to 2cc's twice a week on the Test E and 1cc 4 times a week on the Stano.

For someone who's knowledgeable, would this be fine, and still get decent results, or would I bet better to run something totally different? Thanks in advance......

**Lunk1** · 01-02-2013, 04:47 PM

You need to tak appropriate time off from your first cycle and PCT properly. Failure to do so could easily result in permenant shut down of your HPTA requiring a life of TRT!

**Atomini** · 01-02-2013, 04:50 PM

Bad idea. This really wouldn't be 'two cycles in a row' and instead to me sounds like one giant cycle.

The problem with doing this is of course the negative impact on your health, your HPTA recovery (which become severely compromised the longer you are on a cycle without sufficient recovery), and so on and so forth. But aside from that, from a gains standpoint why would you want to do this? Gains begin to slow down and level off at around the 8 - 10 week mark for most people and after that it becomes stagnant. Therefore, any further time spent on cycle is not just an increased risk to your health in spite of increasingly shittier and shittier gains, but you're wasting money now as the cost:gains ratio now drops to rock bottom. Without adequate time off, your gains will be almost nonexistent beyond a certain number of weeks on, tempered with a messed up HPTA and deathly dangerous cholesterol values.

You also haven't stated how long your previous cycle was, and how long you plan on your next one to be. Overall, it is a bad idea and I hope you don't do it.

**gixxerboy1** · 01-02-2013, 05:17 PM

i agree with everything Atomini said.
and again you didnt say how long the first cycle was.
You didnt even use the winny properly
You didnt mention an ai

**Atomini** · 01-02-2013, 05:31 PM

^^ correct. Also judging by the fact that the OP refers to the administration of his AAS as "CCs" instead of mg or an actual dose measurement is a very strong indication that he is not very well educated in the use of AAS. Likely not educated enough to engage in any cycles properly or safely...

**REBORN52** · 01-02-2013, 05:44 PM

Thank you guys. I really appreciate the information, and I'm absolutely going to take some time off. My future brother-in-law is an IBF pro, I talked with him after posting, and he said the same. My cycle was supposed to be 10 weeks, but the bottles were a little short and it will be more like nine. I have 1-2 shots left. Any information on what I can take during my PCT phase would be helpful. I've tried to read on it as much as possible, but honestly there's a lot of info, and I just don't want to mess up. Also, he feels like I should take off at least 4 weeks.

I have a regimented diet. I plan on staying with it and making sure my intake is sufficient. I do CrossFit and lift, so I should be good on my conditioning...

I really appreciate the help....

**REBORN52** · 01-02-2013, 05:49 PM

Originally Posted by Atomini

^^ correct. Also judging by the fact that the OP refers to the administration of his AAS as "CCs" instead of mg or an actual dose measurement is a very strong indication that he is not very well educated in the use of AAS. Likely not educated enough to engage in any cycles properly or safely...

I understand the difference between mg's and cc's and how they convert. I ran 500 mg's per week of the test e. I also understand (now) that the Winstrol needs to be used more, but I just didn't want to overdo it. But you're right, I'm new and that's why I'm asking. I did consult beforehand on how much of the Test, but took it upon myself to gauge the Winstrol.

**Lunk1** · 01-02-2013, 05:57 PM

Time on + PCT = time off. 4 weeks off will not suffice! Getting blood work done after PCT is the best way of etermining if you are ready!

PCT Clomid 100/50/50/50 Nolva 40/20/20/20

Hve you used an AI? HCG ?

**songdog** · 01-02-2013, 05:58 PM

Glad you understand the dangers of doing such a long cycle.Now I hope you take the time in between cycles to do some research on wat you are doing.Read all of the stickys then hit the educational threads you will find a lot of good info there.

**REBORN52** · 01-02-2013, 05:59 PM

Originally Posted by Lunk1

Time on + PCT = time off. 4 weeks off will not suffice! Getting blood work done after PCT is the best way of etermining if you are ready!

PCT Clomid 100/50/50/50 Nolva 40/20/20/20

Hve you used an AI? HCG?

No, I have not.....

And when should my PCT start? I appreciate the response.....

**Lunk1** · 01-02-2013, 06:09 PM

Originally Posted by REBORN52

No, I have not.....

And when should my PCT start? I appreciate the response.....

PCT should start 14 days after last injection. I would love to see you spend the time off needed learning about cycling. An AI is a must to keep your E2 levels down and avoid negetive estrogen related side effects. HCG on cycle will assist in speedy recovery and testicular atrophy!

**REBORN52** · 01-02-2013, 06:24 PM

Originally Posted by Lunk1

PCT should start 14 days after last injection. I would love to see you spend the time off needed learning about cycling. An AI is a must to keep your E2 levels down and avoid negetive estrogen related side effects. HCG on cycle will assist in speedy recovery and testicular atrophy!

Thanks, and you can count on it. I don't want to do anything to my body that can have negative effect or can't be reversed. The entire purpose is to look and feel better, but if I can't do it the right way, it's just not worth it to me. I really wish I would've ran the HCG during. Is it too late now (with one week in cycle left)? And I assume the AI should've been ran during, as well?

**DanB** · 01-02-2013, 06:27 PM

matter of interest op

what were your pre cycle and now current stats?

**REBORN52** · 01-02-2013, 06:32 PM

Originally Posted by DanB

matter of interest op

what were your pre cycle and now current stats?

Forgive me for being new, but I assume you're talking about what I gained?

**Lunk1** · 01-02-2013, 06:34 PM

Originally Posted by REBORN52

Thanks, and you can count on it. I don't want to do anything to my body that can have negative effect or can't be reversed. The entire purpose is to look and feel better, but if I can't do it the right way, it's just not worth it to me. I really wish I would've ran the HCG during. Is it too late now (with one week in cycle left)? And I assume the AI should've been ran during, as well?

Yes...and that is a great attitude as you move ahead. Your right you cant take back yesterday but....
Get your PCT and seriously blood work should be done after you PCT to see where things stand!

**DanB** · 01-02-2013, 06:37 PM

Originally Posted by REBORN52

Forgive me for being new, but I assume you're talking about what I gained?

yes

height
starting/current bodyfat
starting/current weight

**REBORN52** · 01-02-2013, 06:54 PM

I have zero idea on the body fat.

I'm 5'9" started at 245 lbs, and down to 227 lbs. I've lost 4" in my waist the last three months. Obviously I've put on a good deal of muscle. My abs are much for defined than when I started. Four months ago I put down all alcohol and went on a regimented diet. I eat a ton a protein, greens, etc. I do CrossFit 5-6 times a week and lift 3-4. I'll max out about once a month just to see what I've done...

I'm sure this hasn't helped, but it's all I got.

I'm guessing you're a Notre Dame fan, Bama Boy here....Roll Tide.....you guys have a classy team......

**Lunk1** · 01-02-2013, 06:58 PM

Originally Posted by REBORN52

I have zero idea on the body fat.

I'm 5'9" started at 245 lbs, and down to 227 lbs. I've lost 4" in my waist the last three months. Obviously I've put on a good deal of muscle. My abs are much for defined than when I started. Four months ago I put down all alcohol and went on a regimented diet. I eat a ton a protein, greens, etc. I do CrossFit 5-6 times a week and lift 3-4. I'll max out about once a month just to see what I've done...

I'm sure this hasn't helped, but it's all I got.

I'm guessing you're a Notre Dame fan, Bama Boy here....Roll Tide.....you guys have a classy team......

HAHAH...Dan thinks Football is played with a round ball and 2 nets lol

**DanB** · 01-02-2013, 07:00 PM

Originally Posted by REBORN52

I have zero idea on the body fat.

I'm 5'9" started at 245 lbs, and down to 227 lbs. I've lost 4" in my waist the last three months. Obviously I've put on a good deal of muscle. My abs are much for defined than when I started. Four months ago I put down all alcohol and went on a regimented diet. I eat a ton a protein, greens, etc. I do CrossFit 5-6 times a week and lift 3-4. I'll max out about once a month just to see what I've done...

I'm sure this hasn't helped, but it's all I got.

I'm guessing you're a Notre Dame fan, Bama Boy here....Roll Tide.....you guys have a classy team......

have a look at this and and it should give you close enough idea of b/f
http://forums.steroid.com/showthread...n#.UOTX96xZiVo

**DanB** · 01-02-2013, 07:02 PM

Originally Posted by Lunk1

HAHAH...Dan thinks Football is played with a round ball and 2 nets lol

im allergic to that game unless my country is playing, bunch of bitches going off the pitch on a stretcher when they get kicked on the shin, gimme a fvcking break, i get extremelly pissed off watching it, womens tennis is more of a contact sport these days then football

**REBORN52** · 01-02-2013, 07:45 PM

Originally Posted by DanB

im allergic to that game unless my country is playing, bunch of bitches going off the pitch on a stretcher when they get kicked on the shin, gimme a fvcking break, i get extremelly pissed off watching it, womens tennis is more of a contact sport these days then football

I actually agree with you, and the new "targeting" rules are getting ridiculous. They'll be playing with flags before long. And as we speak Florida's safety just laid out Louisville QB and they threw a flag....geez....when I played it was natural to lead with the head.....

Anyway, I'm between 15-20% judging by the pictures. My arms, legs, back, and top four abs are closer to the 12%, but I still need to get rid of some fat around my chest and stomach.

I was 25% or over when my cycle started. I still have a long way to go....

**DanB** · 01-02-2013, 07:47 PM

llmao we talking about 2 totally different sports, lunk knows what i mean

upping the juice isnt the answer, cutting the calories is what you need to do mate

**warmouth** · 01-02-2013, 10:01 PM

Just wanted to say it for the OP: ROLL TIDE ROLL!!!!!!!

**REBORN52** · 01-03-2013, 08:53 PM

Guys, a supposed knowledgeable body builder give me some more advice today and I would like your input. He said once I'm off this cycle to not do a PCT, and do two low dose Test Cycles in a row, then do a PCT, wait 4-6 weeks for my natural test to start producing, and hop back on. He said that the theory of time on equals time off plus PCT is the biggest misconception out there among beginners and novices. He said your body doesn't know how long you've been on Test, and once it starts to produce it's safe to get back on. Also said I would lose everything once I'm off.

Thanks in advance, again......

**Atomini** · 01-03-2013, 08:57 PM

Originally Posted by REBORN52

Guys, a supposed knowledgeable body builder give me some more advice today and I would like your input. He said once I'm off this cycle to not do a PCT, and do two low dose Test Cycles in a row, then do a PCT, wait 4-6 weeks for my natural test to start producing, and hop back on. He said that the theory of time on equals time off plus PCT is the biggest misconception out there among beginners and novices. He said your body doesn't know how long you've been on Test, and once it starts to produce it's safe to get back on. Also said I would lose everything once I'm off.

Thanks in advance, again......

lol....

Please, listen to the advice you've been given... that's all i'm going to say right now.

**Lunk1** · 01-03-2013, 09:06 PM

Originally Posted by REBORN52

Guys, a supposed knowledgeable body builder give me some more advice today and I would like your input. He said once I'm off this cycle to not do a PCT, and do two low dose Test Cycles in a row, then do a PCT, wait 4-6 weeks for my natural test to start producing, and hop back on. He said that the theory of time on equals time off plus PCT is the biggest misconception out there among beginners and novices. He said your body doesn't know how long you've been on Test, and once it starts to produce it's safe to get back on. Also said I would lose everything once I'm off.

Thanks in advance, again......

Your friend is wrong but is only preaching what he knows and I'm guessing he is a bit older...meaning protocols have advanced over the last 5-8 years!

Lots of BB back in "the day" never PCT'd and were ok. Some still do not. But PCT increases your odds of restart GREATLY! Thus the thought of if it helps and is safer than you should always take that approach!

The longer you introduce synthetic test to your system and it stays shutdown...the longer and harder it is to get natty test to restart. Sometimes never happens!

the time off guidline is a rule of thumb used to play it safe. This time could be more or less but getting Blood work done is the only sure method of knowing!

Keeping gains after cycle is diet related mainly! PPL dont eat to sustain gains!

**REBORN52** · 01-03-2013, 09:29 PM

Lunk, I should get my blood work done right after my PCT, or give my body some time to to producing natural test? And once it's producing it's safe to get back on? And I assume I should eat like I am now. A lot of lean protein (chicken, sirloin, filet, fish) greens, potato for lunch, no carbs after 4 pm...etc?

I honestly feel like I'm getting better/more consistent info here, and I appreciate it.

**Lunk1** · 01-03-2013, 09:36 PM

Originally Posted by REBORN52

Lunk, I should get my blood work done right after my PCT, or give my body some time to to producing natural test? And once it's producing it's safe to get back on? And I assume I should eat like I am now. A lot of lean protein (chicken, sirloin, filet, fish) greens, potato for lunch, no carbs after 4 pm...etc?

I honestly feel like I'm getting better/more consistent info here, and I appreciate it.

Bloodwork done 2 weeks after PCT. If BW is clear then I say go ahead!

After cycle during PCT it's important to up cals even more and feed the gains! I suggest a good month! There is a good thread going about this here in Q&A right now!

**gixxerboy1** · 01-03-2013, 10:09 PM

I would wait 4 weeks for the bloodwork. You dont want the results to be off from the pct drugs

**Lunk1** · 01-03-2013, 10:19 PM

Originally Posted by gixxerboy1

I would wait 4 weeks for the bloodwork. You dont want the results to be off from the pct drugs

Given the short half live of nolva and clomi you dont think 2 weeks is enough Gixx....? JW what your thought on the time was?

**Atomini** · 01-03-2013, 10:29 PM

Originally Posted by Lunk1

Given the short half live of nolva and clomi you dont think 2 weeks is enough Gixx....? JW what your thought on the time was?

Nolvadex half life is actually 14 days, I believe.

**Lunk1** · 01-03-2013, 10:36 PM

Originally Posted by Atomini

Nolvadex half life is actually 14 days, I believe.

Yes...14 Nolva and 5 clomi...thanks A.

Disregard OP...wait at least 4 weeks!

**REBORN52** · 01-03-2013, 10:39 PM

Originally Posted by Lunk1

Yes...14 Nolva and 5 clomi...thanks A.

Disregard OP...wait at least 4 weeks!

No problem, and I assume the Nolva and Clomi is taken orally, and the amounts you gave in the first part of thread were daily for both? And basically I should wait two months regardless, unless my blood work comes back low?
And thanks....

**Lunk1** · 01-03-2013, 10:40 PM

Originally Posted by REBORN52

No problem, and I assume the Nolva and Clomi is taken orally, and the amounts you gave in the first part of thread were daily for both? And thanks....

Yes correct!

**likelifting** · 01-03-2013, 10:42 PM

OT...Peeps don't seem to like Torem on this board.

**REBORN52** · 01-03-2013, 10:51 PM

Originally Posted by likelifting

OT...Peeps don't seem to like Torem on this board.

I think I did read where Torem doesn't effect libido like Nolva?

**REBORN52** · 01-03-2013, 11:11 PM

Originally Posted by Lunk1

Yes correct!

on the Clomid and Nolva I assume that was MG's and did you mean to take those amounts 4 times daily or was that weekly? And if weekly would I alternate days. For instance on the Clomid, would I take 100/50/50/50 mg's daily or is that for an entire week and each set of mg's represents a different day? And I assume the site sponsor is good to go?

I apologize for asking so many questions, but once I have the info it will stay with me. And I appreciate it.....

**likelifting** · 01-04-2013, 12:34 AM

Originally Posted by REBORN52

I think I did read where Torem doesn't effect libido like Nolva?

Like anything, it will effect everyone differently. I use Torem. I probably shouldn't have made my post as you were getting great advice from the experienced peeps on the board. Just go with what they said.

**Lunk1** · 01-04-2013, 07:46 AM

Originally Posted by REBORN52

on the Clomid and Nolva I assume that was MG's and did you mean to take those amounts 4 times daily or was that weekly? And if weekly would I alternate days. For instance on the Clomid, would I take 100/50/50/50 mg's daily or is that for an entire week and each set of mg's represents a different day? And I assume the site sponsor is good to go?

I apologize for asking so many questions, but once I have the info it will stay with me. And I appreciate it.....

Each number represents the mg taken per day for that week ie: 100mg per day for week 1 and 50 mg per day week 2 and so on