My first cycle and PCT plan.

[AliYousaf]

Here's what my first cycle looks like..
14 days prior to actual cycle..
.25mg Ltrozole ED ( inspired by Bino's article on Gyno prevention in educational threads 'All you need to know about Gyno' )

The actual (12 week plus three week PCT) Novice Cycle 1 mentioned on this website.
Test-Enth 500 mg / week with Dbol 25 gram Ed for 6 weeks..
If Gyno appears during the cycle I ll taper my dose up a little like .50mg

PCT
Depending upon any Gyno I ll either continue taking Letrozole for a week or two or start taking Nolvadex 40 mg ED three weeks from my last Test Enth shot and taper it down in the last week.
One question, do I need to run hCG with this protocol ? If yes, how to adjust that in and in what quantity for how long etc.

I am 35 weight 157 lbs height 5ft. 7
Training experience 2 yrs.

[kronik420]

have you had gyno before??

[AliYousaf]

have you had gyno before??

None..

[kronik420]

no need for the letro then, have it on hand tho just in case..

use either arimidex or aromasin to control estrogen on cycle

HCG is a good idea, run it at 500IU per week (split 250IU 2x a week) and stop it just before you start PCT

add nolva to your PCT
nolva 40/20/20/20
clomid 100/50/50/50

[kronik420]

also dbol is not needed (you should get great gains off of test only), if you really want to use it tho, i would keep it to 4 weeks, as it is harsh on the liver, and use some sort of liver protection, TUDCA, liv 52 etc..

[AliYousaf]

Thanks for info will research on TUDCA now..
1.) I thought since Letrozole is the strongest of AI I should go for that. And by stacking it in the body before my actual cycle I'll be keeping Gyno at a fair distance. If Gyno can be prevented why wait for it to happen.. You say Armidex and that too on cycle only..
2. ) I might be pinning test enthate at 250mg twice a week. Like on Monday & Thursday.. Should I pin the hCG the same days ??
3.) Should I use Nolvadex and Clomid both on PCT ?? I want to know if hCG is an optional thing for cycle like mine or a MUST HAVE ??

[alexISthrowed]

What's your bf? At your height and weight you should be able to gain more naturally unless your 5% bf.

[AliYousaf]

What's your bf? At your height and weight you should be able to gain more naturally unless your 5% bf.

No brother I am not at 5 % BF.. At 15 at the moment.
But here actually I need help with my cycle plan.

[alexISthrowed]

No brother I am not at 5 % BF.. At 15 at the moment.
But here actually I need help with my cycle plan.

At 5'7" 157lbs and 15% bf you are no where near being ready to cycle. You need to learn how to eat and train properly otherwise aas would be a waste. With your stats you obviously lacking in both those departments and need to focus on getting that in order for the next few years. You have a ton of room to grow naturally. Steroids are not magic, if you can't grow naturally you will not grow on aas.

[AliYousaf]

At 5'7" 157lbs and 15% bf you are no where near being ready to cycle. You need to learn how to eat and train properly otherwise aas would be a waste. With your stats you obviously lacking in both those departments and need to focus on getting that in order for the next few years. You have a ton of room to grow naturally. Steroids are not magic, if you can't grow naturally you will not grow on aas.

Yeah ok!! Appreciate your advice.. What about my plan ? Does it look ok ??

[AliYousaf]

Oh and by the way.. Only to understand your point of view better .. What do you think how much should i weigh with my height naturally ??

[OdinsOtherSon]

Ali, why didn't you post the same background info you place in your first thread?

http://forums.steroid.com/showthread...71#post6348271

[The Bear 79]

Yeah ok!! Appreciate your advice.. What about my plan ? Does it look ok ??

Don't act like that, the man is just trying to put you on the right track & save you some time & money. As it stands, you WILL lose EVERYTHING you gain from this cycle because you don't know how to eat to sustain new / additional lean mass. In other words, all the time you put into the gym while on this cycle & all the money you spend on the drugs will be wasted because you will retain ZERO.

[OdinsOtherSon]

Don't act like that, the man is just trying to put you on the right track & save you some time & money. As it stands, you WILL lose EVERYTHING you gain from this cycle because you don't know how to eat to sustain new / additional lean mass. In other words, all the time you put into the gym while on this cycle & all the money you spend on the drugs will be wasted because you will retain ZERO.

This^^^

The Truth will set you free...but it might make you miserable first.

[The Bear 79]

Oh and by the way.. Only to understand your point of view better .. What do you think how much should i weigh with my height naturally ??

At your height, there's absolutely no reason why you cant reach 170 maybe even 180 or more, & 12% naturally, if you're really into this lifestyle & really dedicated to health. These are by no means unrealistic goals, I know a couple 5 & a half foot tall guys that broke well over 200 lbs naturally before ever touching steroids.

[fit2bOld]

Yeah ok!! Appreciate your advice.. What about my plan ? Does it look ok ??

Very nice of you to just dismiss the advice when alexISthrowed is correct, you are not ready to cycle at those stats.

[AliYousaf]

Oh come on boys .. I mean seriously, you all are masters and I am just learning.. Did I do something to get flamed ?? I wasnt beinf rude or something. It was just an honest question nothing else.. I know you guys won't recommend me doing roids at this level and I appreciate all your concerns...but hey, it's just a simple question (let's just say for someone else) does the cycle even look ok to you guys ?? HCG or not ??

[The Bear 79]

Oh come on boys .. I mean seriously, you all are masters and I am just learning.. Did I do something to get flamed ?? I wasnt beinf rude or something. It was just an honest question nothing else.. I know you guys won't recommend me doing roids at this level and I appreciate all your concerns...but hey, it's just a simple question (let's just say for someone else) does the cycle even look ok to you guys ?? HCG or not ??

Nobody is flaming you.
The way you dismissed Alex was rude.

I can't speak for everyone, But I don't give cycle advice to anyone that can't even take the time to nail down a sufficient diet & bring their NATURAL stats up to a level that at least looks as though you've been trying. Right now it appears as though you're looking for the magic pill.

Good luck to you.

[AliYousaf]

Nobody is flaming you.
The way you dismissed Alex was rude.

I can't speak for everyone, But I don't give cycle advice to anyone that can't even take the time to nail down a sufficient diet & bring their NATURAL stats up to a level that at least looks as though you've been trying. Right now it appears as though you're looking for the magic pill.

Good luck to you.

Ah come on mate!! It's not like I dissed him.. Ok I'll apologize to him.
Hey Alex..my man.. I am sorry I was being a jerk to you.You were giving me your honest opinion and I somehow acted nuts and apparently made the rest of senior members mad at me.. Hope you forgive me bro.. :-)

[The Bear 79]

Would you like help putting together a diet that will surely facilitate large gains?

[AliYousaf]

Ok.. Lets just start it over..in fact from the last advise I got from Mr. The bear 79 gave..
So you Sir say that I should first concentrate on my diet and gain some more like 20 lbs at least.. Wow.. Seems like my New Years resolution is hammered ( I would say screwed but don't know if the policy of these forums permits me to) Ok .. Honestly I wasn't even sure if I could gain some extra 20 lbs on all natural diet.. But since you guys insist I say it might be possible.. I have been reading a lot for sometime on these forums, collecting data and compiling.. even got my blood work done.. a whole lot of them.. Cost me big buck.. Bought the gear already with all PCT.. Only hCG is remaining haven't ordered yet.. But it doesn't matter now.. All that money I spent is gonna go waste cus these extra 20 lbs is not yet on me ... And by the time I am able.. I am sure that stack will reach its expiry..
So stupid of me.. Damn. I suck...

[AliYousaf]

Would you like help putting together a diet that will surely facilitate large gains?

Yes please Mr. The Bear 79.. I am sure I do... Would love to get some real help here.

[kelkel]

Take Bear up on his offer. He knows what he's talking about.....

[The Bear 79]

Ok.. Lets just start it over..in fact from the last advise I got from Mr. The bear 79 gave..
So you Sir say that I should first concentrate on my diet and gain some more like 20 lbs at least.. Wow.. Seems like my New Years resolution is hammered ( I would say screwed but don't know if the policy of these forums permits me to) Ok .. Honestly I wasn't even sure if I could gain some extra 20 lbs on all natural diet.. But since you guys insist I say it might be possible.. I have been reading a lot for sometime on these forums, collecting data and compiling.. even got my blood work done.. a whole lot of them.. Cost me big buck.. Bought the gear already with all PCT.. Only hCG is remaining haven't ordered yet.. But it doesn't matter now.. All that money I spent is gonna go waste cus these extra 20 lbs is not yet on me ... And by the time I am able.. I am sure that stack will reach its expiry..
So stupid of me.. Damn. I suck...

Yes please Mr. The Bear 79.. I am sure I do... Would love to get some real help here.

You gotta lose that condescending attitude, that sh!t doesn't settle well with me.

Post your current daily intake, include calories, carbs, proteins, fats & times of each meal.

Once we see what you ARE doing, we can help you with what you AREN'T doing.

[alexISthrowed]

I'm not angry and I don't think you have caused too much damage with anyone else. We know what we are talking about and we are just trying to help. No one pays us to come on here. You asked for advice and a bunch of very knowledgeable people all told you the same thing, and it's the right advice. Wether you want to hear it or not is not our problem. We would be more than happy to get you off on the right foot with diet and training but I will not give aas advice to someone who I feel is not ready to take that step.

[AliYousaf]

Take Bear up on his offer. He knows what he's talking about.....

I did already Mr.Kelkel ! I want to learn what have I been doing wrong.. Thanks

[AliYousaf]

I'm not angry and I don't think you have caused too much damage with anyone else. We know what we are talking about and we are just trying to help. No one pays us to come on here. You asked for advice and a bunch of very knowledgeable people all told you the same thing, and it's the right advice. Wether you want to hear it or not is not our problem. We would be more than happy to get you off on the right foot with diet and training but I will not give aas advice to someone who I feel is not ready to take that step.

Appreciated Mr. AlexISthrowed. Thanks much.. I understand totally..

[AliYousaf]

You gotta lose that condescending attitude, that sh!t doesn't settle well with me.

Post your current daily intake, include calories, carbs, proteins, fats & times of each meal.

Once we see what you ARE doing, we can help you with what you AREN'T doing.

Mr. TheBear 79.

Here is what I have been doing for a long time like for the past eight months at least. I dont say I wasn't watching my diet before that but it wasn't sufficient.. After watching a 6 episode dieting video that I found as a sticky post in Diet and nutrition section of these forums.. I revamped the whole dieting deal.. My wife's kinda pissed at me ever since..
Ok
I take 7 meals a day.. Of which I make sure that I get at least 300-350 grams of protein every day. ( I kinda loose track of my carbs and fat)
8:30 Meal one .. 2 whole eggs.. one can Tuna.. One beef kebab ( 200 grams) two cup of rice cakes that my wife bakes at home with my whey protein powder..one tortilla with low fat cottage cheese.. And my protein shake.

Two hours later Meal two :: 300 grams chicken breast.. With white beans, one banana.. 3 egg white ..one small bowl oat meal with skimmed milk ( that's the nastiest thing on my entire diet plan so far)

3 hours later when I get back home Meal three.. Large bowl of salad ( a combo of cashew nuts, cottage cheese or peanut butter, half can tuna, 3 egg whites & broccoli, lettuce sprinkled with virgin olive oil ) orange juice.. I know I can replace the orange juice with my protein shake but I love to have orange juice while there's some day light left outside)

Two hours later Meal four: Protein shake and some white beans.. ( my stomach can't tolerate the red kidney beans) Home grilled Fish 300 grams.

Hour and a half later Meal 5 : Only Protein shake .. Pre work out..

Meal 6: Protein shake post work out.. With the same salad as mentioned in meal three..

Meal 7 : 300grams Beef stake.. ( I suspect I haven't been eating lean beef, my wife though insists it is.. Now who can argue with women.. )
3 egg whites , broccoli, brown rice.. Green tea.
And if I am not too exhausted to go to bed by this time I do take another shot of protein shake before bed..
That's the whole thing.. Or the idea of it..

[The Bear 79]

Your schedule is kinda odd, you should be eating every 3 to 4 hours, it takes your body at least that long to process / absorb the nutrients of each meal, if you're eating 1-1/2 to 2 hours apart you're over loading & much of it will go to waste (in the toilet).

In my opinion protein shakes should only be used post workout (to flood the body with muscle building nutrients while it's in a state of extreme need) & pre bed (because we don't want to eat too heavy before bed)

I haven't done the math, but what you posted doesn't look like much of a lean mass building diet, I would like to see you try this:

Meal 1 - 6:00 AM = 8 egg whites, 2 yolks, 1 cup of oats (not that flavored garbage, real oatmeal) 4 slices wheat toast.

Meal 2 - 9:00 AM = 2 cans of tuna with fat free mayo, 1 cup of wheat rice or wheat pasta or 2 large sweet potatoes.

Meal 3 - 12:00 PM = 10 oz of steak or chicken, 2 cups of wheat rice or wheat pasta or 2 large sweet potatoes.

Meal 4 - 3:00 PM = 10 oz chicken salad with fat free, low or no sodium dressing.

Meal 5 - 6:00 PM = 10 oz of chicken or steak or 3 large tilapia, 2 cups of wheat rice or wheat pasta or 2 large sweet potatoes.

Meal 6 - 9:00 PM = 60 grams whey protein shake.

After you've been on this regime for a bit, you can work in 2 more meals in the middle of the night:

Meal 7 - 12:00 AM = 7 oz of chicken.

Meal 8 - 3:00 AM = 2 cans of tuna with fat free mayo.

[AliYousaf]

Thanks a lot Mr. The Bear 79.. Honestly I am thankful for your effort to take the time and help me out..
I am going to discuss my new diet plan with my wife in the morning.. I am sure she won't be much happy but there's nothing love and some cuddling, smooching and kissing wouldn't do..
Hopefully I am going to get on this new diet with in two days..
I will set a target to gain 20 lbs in three months (dont know if its even possible in three) and will still be on these forums for further research I guess.. Heart broken though for not being able to use my stack .. I guess in three months then .. Or may be sooner..
What if I am frustrated in the middle and want to start the cycle so bad.. I mean its lying in my closet for Christ's sake..
Anyways..

[AliYousaf]

Ah one more thing.. I am sure some one also pointed out my BF.. It shamefully stands at 15 % at the moment.
I know I must do cardio.. But plenty of cardio isn't my thing.. I am a smoker..
I was wondering if any one could let me know what would be nearly perfect cardio in my case..I am sure I am also lacking on that level too.. Any guidance or any article that you guys would want me to read.
Thanks a bunch.

[t-dogg]

At 15%bf at 157lbs i would fix your diet first. My guess is you will lose whatever you gain if anything.


P.s i didnt read what others posted. On my phone.

[The Bear 79]

Ah one more thing.. I am sure some one also pointed out my BF.. It shamefully stands at 15 % at the moment.
I know I must do cardio.. But plenty of cardio isn't my thing.. I am a smoker..
I was wondering if any one could let me know what would be nearly perfect cardio in my case..I am sure I am also lacking on that level too.. Any guidance or any article that you guys would want me to read.
Thanks a bunch.

Nicotine is an apatite suppressant.

And cigarettes don't fit this life style, you're either healthy or you're not, not mention cardiovascular health should be priority number one above all else.

[Edwin23q]

Wow as always I've learnt from the senior members, that's why I love reading all the threads on this forum.
OP, I was a smoker of 15 years, also occasional weed smoker. The day I decided to change my life and go back to what I was like in my late teens and early 20's is the day I quit all that crap. I've never felt better and get sick when I see people doing it.
Trust me quit that toxic sh*t and do Cardio hard after your weights, you won't regret it.
There's no benefit from smoking , it clog up your lungs and arteries.
By the way I read that your worried about the money you already spent in aas's as they will expire??? How much do you spend on cigarettes? No need to answer that as I'm sure we all know in a year it's a lot more than aas, specially if your from Australia and a packet cost $18, that's $18 per day 365 days a year.
Good luck with your diet.

Sent from my iPhone using Forum Runner

[AliYousaf]

Wow as always I've learnt from the senior members, that's why I love reading all the threads on this forum.
OP, I was a smoker of 15 years, also occasional weed smoker. The day I decided to change my life and go back to what I was like in my late teens and early 20's is the day I quit all that crap. I've never felt better and get sick when I see people doing it.
Trust me quit that toxic sh*t and do Cardio hard after your weights, you won't regret it.
There's no benefit from smoking , it clog up your lungs and arteries.
By the way I read that your worried about the money you already spent in aas's as they will expire??? How much do you spend on cigarettes? No need to answer that as I'm sure we all know in a year it's a lot more than aas, specially if your from Australia and a packet cost $18, that's $18 per day 365 days a year.
Good luck with your diet.

Sent from my iPhone using Forum Runner

Yes Edwin23q ..You are absolutely right about that sh!t habit. Unfortunately where I come from a pack of cigarettes is way much cheaper.. I took the habit in college.. Always thought I have a control over it and can quit anytime I want... Apparently I couldn't. I tried though, a couple of times and gotten back to it thinking ahhhh!! Whateva rehabs for quitters anyway.. :-)
Kidding

Anyways!! I have completely taken up the diet plan Mr. The bear 79 suggested.. I am totally new to cardio training.. Reading articles on heart rate and cardio workouts, I m no where near though but Will be on track soon..
Cardio... Here I come..

[The Bear 79]

Good for you, if you need any further help or maybe just some encouragement (Lunk is a cheerleader) we'll be here. Keep your head up, you'll get there.

[joazn09]

nolva 40/20/20/20 means 40mg per day for first week right? or 40mg for the week

[AliYousaf]

Hmmmmm!! Guess someone still trying to break me and put me back to my initial question.. Tempted.

[AliYousaf]

Mr The Bear 79 ! I am on the diet plan you suggested to me now. This is a weight gaining diet this I know, but I just wanted to know if this is a lean mass gaining diet or my face gonna look like a balloon in a month.Believe me the effects of careless diet do immediately show up always first on my face. You know cardio hasn't been into my gym routine for a while and I am just new to that.. So I can't burn this much at the moment.. If this a lean mass diet then I am good I guess.

Sent from my iPhone.

[The Bear 79]

Everyone's body reacts differently to foods, drugs, weather / temps & son on, this diet is the exact same diet I followed when I first got started on my journey to 300 lbs, I never had any bloat issues & I doubt you will either, this diet is pretty dry & clean, I can't foresee any issues.

One thing that has always helped me when I'm trying to shave a few lbs, is to drop dairy & sugars / simple carbs completely out of my diet. If you eat only what I showed you, & stick to a vigorous training regime, I'm sure you will cut pretty nice.