why does PIP always show up 3-5 days later?

**MakeUpLostTimeFast** · 01-25-2013, 05:58 PM

I don't feel pain right away after an injection.

Does anyone know why (at least in my case), why does PIP always show up 3-5 days later?

I do use concentrated gear Test 400mg/ml, but draw out .6 mL every 3 days for a total of 500 mgs/week till I taper off dosage.

I did my 1st glute injection last week and I loved it--no pain--upon penetration,

but now almost 4 days later--I got a pain in my glute which hurts, but is bearable when I sleep on my right side (the glute that was injected).

Should I just grin & bear it...and this comes with the territory?

I'm just curious.

It's probably a good thing, because the Test when it's injected Intra Muscular(I guess) slowly makes its way throughout the bod in 3-5 days and that's when the Post Injection Pain is felt???

Thanks in advance for your help.

**swm1972** · 01-25-2013, 07:17 PM

High concentration gear has more suspended hormone in a relatively small amount of oil. Oil is absorbed by the body at a fairly standard rate. The reason pharmaceutical companies suspend hormones like test cyp at 200 is because by the time the oil is absorbed, so has the hormone. In your case the oil is absorbed and some of the raw hormone material is left behind sitting in the muscle tissue without any oil to suspend itself in. Hormone powders are crystalline in nature. You have tiny crystal fragments in your muscle tissue after a few days once the oil has dissipated. That's where the pain often comes from. Not always but in your case of test 400, I'd bet on it.

**Sick_beard** · 01-25-2013, 07:20 PM

Originally Posted by swm1972

High concentration gear has more suspended hormone in a relatively small amount of oil. Oil is absorbed by the body at a fairly standard rate. The reason pharmaceutical companies suspend hormones like test cyp at 200 is because by the time the oil is absorbed, so has the hormone. In your case the oil is absorbed and some of the raw hormone material is left behind sitting in the muscle tissue without any oil to suspend itself in. Hormone powders are crystalline in nature. You have tiny crystal fragments in your muscle tissue after a few days once the oil has dissipated. That's where the pain often comes from. Not always but in your case of test 400, I'd bet on it.

So does the raw hormone material left behind get absorbed eventually?

**Stosh_112** · 01-25-2013, 07:22 PM

Never thought about that, very informative. Dont mean to hi-jack, but why does prop have more pip than other esters? Is it becouse of the higher BA content?

**MakeUpLostTimeFast** · 01-25-2013, 07:45 PM

Originally Posted by swm1972

High concentration gear has more suspended hormone in a relatively small amount of oil. Oil is absorbed by the body at a fairly standard rate. The reason pharmaceutical companies suspend hormones like test cyp at 200 is because by the time the oil is absorbed, so has the hormone. In your case the oil is absorbed and some of the raw hormone material is left behind sitting in the muscle tissue without any oil to suspend itself in. Hormone powders are crystalline in nature. You have tiny crystal fragments in your muscle tissue after a few days once the oil has dissipated. That's where the pain often comes from. Not always but in your case of test 400, I'd bet on it.

yes. with the pain & hassle im going to use all the stock i have of test 400 and move on to something more expensive & less concentrated.

test 400 is inexpensive and more bang for the buck

but these sides are a pain in the butt, pun intended...

u can't workout to the max when either ur delt, ur pecs, or ur glutes all are in a moderate amount of pain...so that defeats the purpose & effectiveness of A.A.S.

onto more expensive stuff cos high price ususally is a good indicator of good value a/k/a u get what u pay for

until then i will just bear the pain...and it does bother me enough when i shift sleep positions.

thanks

**Wes201** · 01-25-2013, 08:29 PM

Originally Posted by swm1972

High concentration gear has more suspended hormone in a relatively small amount of oil. Oil is absorbed by the body at a fairly standard rate. The reason pharmaceutical companies suspend hormones like test cyp at 200 is because by the time the oil is absorbed, so has the hormone. In your case the oil is absorbed and some of the raw hormone material is left behind sitting in the muscle tissue without any oil to suspend itself in. Hormone powders are crystalline in nature. You have tiny crystal fragments in your muscle tissue after a few days once the oil has dissipated. That's where the pain often comes from. Not always but in your case of test 400, I'd bet on it.

WOW, very impressive response. We all learn something new everyday. I have never experienced the op's issue. My pip is usually about 18-24 hours later, but then again i have never ran high concentration gear. Thanks for that swm

**swm1972** · 01-26-2013, 06:52 AM

Originally Posted by Sick_beard

So does the raw hormone material left behind get absorbed eventually?

Yes. Just results in some localized pain and maybe even swelling.

**swm1972** · 01-26-2013, 06:55 AM

Originally Posted by Stosh_112

Never thought about that, very informative. Dont mean to hi-jack, but why does prop have more pip than other esters? Is it becouse of the higher BA content?

The propionate ester is notoriously painful. Anything with a prop ester will be more uncomfortable. See if you can locate some boldenone prop and try it. I envision a vial with 9ml getting thrown away. It's truly brutal stuff. I've head the prop ester is chemically similar in nature to bee venom, but I can not verify this as accurate.

**knuckles69** · 03-13-2013, 10:24 AM

Great post guys. Lots of good quality info. Cheers

**panntastic** · 03-13-2013, 10:35 AM

Originally Posted by knuckles69

Great post guys. Lots of good quality info. Cheers

Sorry to burst your bubble buddy but some very inaccurate info here

**panntastic** · 03-13-2013, 10:36 AM

Originally Posted by knuckles69

Great post guys. Lots of good quality info. Cheers

http://forums.steroid.com/showthread.php?t=526160

**johnnymctrance** · 03-13-2013, 03:07 PM

Prop is similar to bee venom???really?

**baseline_9** · 03-13-2013, 03:31 PM

Originally Posted by panntastic

http://forums.steroid.com/showthread.php?t=526160

Where in that thread do you talk about hormones that actually cause more PIP.....

PIP from prop has nothing to do with any of the points you have mentioned in that thread unless I missed it....

Pain from prop is due to the raw materials crystalline texture.....

It has nothing to do with BA or poor injecting technique....

Now pain from a highly concentrated Test E product is likely to be due to BA content since raw Test E will be a liquid at body temperature and will not cause the same discomfort as prop....

**baseline_9** · 03-13-2013, 03:33 PM

I'm not trying to bash ur thread.... Let me know if I missed a part about pain in relation to actual raw materials... I.e. Test Prop powder....

**panntastic** · 03-13-2013, 05:11 PM

Originally Posted by baseline_9

Where in that thread do you talk about hormones that actually cause more PIP.....

PIP from prop has nothing to do with any of the points you have mentioned in that thread unless I missed it....

Pain from prop is due to the raw materials crystalline texture.....

It has nothing to do with BA or poor injecting technique....

Now pain from a highly concentrated Test E product is likely to be due to BA content since raw Test E will be a liquid at body temperature and will not cause the same discomfort as prop....

I don't believe this is the case mate
Tren ace is also slightly crystalline in nature and can be painless.
It's all honestly in the brewer
I can and have made prop and tren ace at 300mg/ml pain free and goes in smooth as the day is long
If its brewed properly then it will be pain free

Once the prop molecules are in a solution they are no longer crystalline so unless people are jabbing crashed gear the state of the raw powder doesn't come into play.

Anavar is no harsher on liver due to its extremely crystalline state than say dbol which is very fine

**warmouth** · 03-13-2013, 05:17 PM

Originally Posted by panntastic

I don't believe this is the case mate
Tren ace is also slightly crystalline in nature and can be painless.
It's all honestly in the brewer
I can and have made prop and tren ace at 300mg/ml pain free and goes in smooth as the day is long
If its brewed properly then it will be pain free

Once the prop molecules are in a solution they are no longer crystalline so unless people are jabbing crashed gear the state of the raw powder doesn't come into play.

Anavar is no harsher on liver due to its extremely crystalline state than say dbol which is very fine

Wouldn't more EO also be more comfortable after the injection?

**panntastic** · 03-13-2013, 05:23 PM

Eo takes a lot of bite out of pip that's for sure
But as for keeping depot in solution longer we need to look at bb.
People say with high mg/ml the pip is due to the oil being absorbed faster than the hormone in this case the bb level needs to be increased

**baseline_9** · 03-14-2013, 01:48 AM

Originally Posted by panntastic

I don't believe this is the case mate
Tren ace is also slightly crystalline in nature and can be painless.
It's all honestly in the brewer
I can and have made prop and tren ace at 300mg/ml pain free and goes in smooth as the day is long
If its brewed properly then it will be pain free

Once the prop molecules are in a solution they are no longer crystalline so unless people are jabbing crashed gear the state of the raw powder doesn't come into play.

Anavar is no harsher on liver due to its extremely crystalline state than say dbol which is very fine

I have to disagree....

Are you trying to tell me that prop at 100mg/ml 2/20 is going to feel the same as test e at 100mg/ml at 2/20....... It's not gonna happen m8...

I'm telling you from experience that it will come down to the raw material.....

Just look at prop compared to tren ace...... No comparison m8... Prop is like crushed down glass..... Tren ace is a light powder....

Now this is bro-science here but my understanding is that the gear is crashing after injection, the oil/BA/BB are being pulled out leaving the raw material......

The reason test e is not painful must have something to do with the fact that its not going to be crystalline within the muscle if it crashes and therefore can easily be absorbed as a liquid....

**panntastic** · 03-14-2013, 03:07 AM

Originally Posted by baseline_9

I have to disagree....

Are you trying to tell me that prop at 100mg/ml 2/20 is going to feel the same as test e at 100mg/ml at 2/20....... It's not gonna happen m8...

I'm telling you from experience that it will come down to the raw material.....

Just look at prop compared to tren ace...... No comparison m8... Prop is like crushed down glass..... Tren ace is a light powder....

Now this is bro-science here but my understanding is that the gear is crashing after injection, the oil/BA/BB are being pulled out leaving the raw material......

The reason test e is not painful must have something to do with the fact that its not going to be crystalline within the muscle if it crashes and therefore can easily be absorbed as a liquid....

I've researched this a lot and never found anything regarding the oil ba and bb leaving the depot and leaving the raw material.

**panntastic** · 03-14-2013, 03:11 AM

I mentioned in my write up on pip if you look at the compounds that give the most pain they all have a higher melting point
That may be something to do with it.