Doing steroids before genetic potential

Before I ask my question ...I just want to say I have no intention of doing steroids for at least 5 years minimum.
So I have been on this site on and off the past year because when I was in high school I was pressured to do steroids because of how into PL I was ( I have not yet done them) but some of my fellow highschool PL's (grade 12 age 18) did and they have kept a lot of there size.

So my question is if you do steroids with a good pct to reach your genetic potential and have a very large caloric intake with good nutrition can you keep your size when off steroids? or will it eventually diminish?
Also would it make your genetic potential less after your body loses all the muscle you put on cycling ?

Thanks for your sharing your knowledge!

There are way to many variables to answer this. Training diet etc. truth be told you will screw up your HPTA by playing with steroids before your system is done developeing. Good choice to stay away with proper diet and a good exercise program you can be bigger and stronger than your buddies.

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Originally Posted by fit2bOld

There are way to many variables to answer this. Training diet etc. truth be told you will screw up your HPTA by playing with steroids before your system is done developeing. Good choice to stay away with proper diet and a good exercise program you can be bigger and stronger than your buddies.

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^^^Spot on! At 19 years of age why would you want to impair your natural testosterone when you could achieve a lot of gains eating and training correctly?

Thank you guys! should you wait till your mid 20's to start using gear even if you hit your Genetic potential at say 19/20 ( i am not anywhere near that due to a neck injury i just started lifting again)

It is impossible to hit your genetic potential at 20 yrs old. You can reach your 20yr old potential but since your body is not done growing you will not be able to reach your genetic potential until your late 20s.

I don't understand that could you clarify? Like didn't arnold start using gear at a ridiculously young age and in his 20's and he was huge!!! and i know he genetics played a part in that but...how did he not hit his genetic potential?

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Originally Posted by Palentia

I don't understand that could you clarify? Like didn't arnold start using gear at a ridiculously young age and in his 20's and he was huge!!! and i know he genetics played a part in that but...how did he not hit his genetic potential?

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I've seen this argument offered before (i.e. Arnold starting at a young age) and it rarely makes sense to me. The guys who started really young and went on to compete made a decision that this was going to be their profession. Body building was more than a recreational or lifestyle choice - it was a career. They were driven to become professional BBs and were willing to do what ever it took to WIN.

The majority of people on this board aren't using steroids to compete professionally. Yes, some chose to compete but even that level is often not at a professional card level.

Most people clearly have no clue the level of commitment these professionals make to BB. The amount of food intake and anabolic use at the professional level would blow most people's minds.

Frank McGrath, shown below, who I've met and chatted with a few times, takes extreme doses of gear at levels that are dangerously unhealthy, but at the pro level it's about winning - health and future consequences are secondary.



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Frank often cycles 2-3 grams of test a week during MAINTENANCE periods between competitions. More when he competes! His caloric intake ranges from 3000-6500 depending on where he's at in his contest preparation.

Antoine Vaillant, another pro IFBB out of Montreal who I've met several times also takes insane doses of gear on and off cycle - doses that would likely kill a horse!!! Lol



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There are very few guys on this board that are ready to make the level of commitment the pros make. Very few guys here will or have given up their school, family, or jobs to make a career out of body building at a professional level.

So unless you are ready to commit to BB full time and pursue a career at the professional level, you really can't make comparisons with the pros and ask, "why not, they did it when they were young".

^^^^^^^ Can you shed more light on pro's gear usage, Ive know 2-3 grams of test a week is pretty commonplace, what about tren ? is this the main culprit ?

This was extremely informative! like holy shit I cant imagine what ****ing health issues they have internally . Sorry for asking so much questions but this is the last one I swear! :P does that mean if these guys ever stopped like for a year they would end up like losing most of the mass they have on them?

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Originally Posted by MR-FQ320

^^^^^^^ Can you shed more light on pro's gear usage, Ive know 2-3 grams of test a week is pretty commonplace, what about tren ? is this the main culprit ?

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I don't quite follow you. What do you mean, "main culprit".

Yes, these guys use "buckets" of gear at a time but remember, their diet and training routines are at a level well beyond what most of us have experienced (there will be a few exceptions on this board as we do have guys that have competed at pro levels, but I'm quite confident, most have not).

Gear alone won't make you look like Frank or Antoine. Yes, it's a critical piece of their success but gear doesn't come before nutrition and training - even among the pros.

I can ask Frank or Antoine what they cycle, but it be willing to bet they keep that information a closely guarded secret. Remember, these guys are out for titles and keeping their trade secrets close to their chest so the competition doesn't know exactly what or how they cycle is a competitive advantage. You're not likely to see them post their cycles, nutrition plans, or training routines for public consumption because these things are what gives them an edge over their competitors.

^^^^ I was stuck for a word when I got the end of that sentence, main compound (tren) would probably have sufficed.

Thanks for an in depth answer though, it's been on my lips for a while now. I chickened out of asking Jay, Phil Heath and Kai how much gear they were on when I met th at body expo. It would be nice to have an example year round cycle ( and not a dreamt up one).

It's a different ball game for sure being a pro, but they didn't just start doing 3 gram a week of test. They must have ramped up to it as their body develops.

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Originally Posted by Palentia

This was extremely informative! like holy shit I cant imagine what ****ing health issues they have internally . Sorry for asking so much questions but this is the last one I swear! :P does that mean if these guys ever stopped like for a year they would end up like losing most of the mass they have on them?

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Like I said, most people don't realize what it takes to compete at a pro level. Many of us would like to look like they do but we simply can't commit to their level of performance or discipline because most of us lift recreationally, not as a profession.

Have you seen Arnold recently? I've seen him a few times in California. He's certainly not the man he once was. That's not taking anything away from him. I respect what he did in his day but he's a long way off from competition form.

Anyone who stops cycling gear, lifting/training regularly or following a proper nutrition plan will of course lose some of their gains. It won't maintain itself. That doesn't mean you have to keep dosing at extreme levels, but maintaining a regular exercise program and nutrition plan will go a long way towards maintaining a good proportion of the success you achieve.

If you simply train hard for a few years and then stop everything, of course you will lose most gains and revert back to the way you were before (or worse).

For many guys here, training, nutrition, and anabolics aren't a hobby. It's a lifestyle. We may not be pursuing pro card status but we are looking for physical improvements that can be maintained long term.

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Originally Posted by MR-FQ320

^^^^ I was stuck for a word when I got the end of that sentence, main compound (tren) would probably have sufficed.

Thanks for an in depth answer though, it's been on my lips for a while now. I chickened out of asking Jay, Phil Heath and Kai how much gear they were on when I met th at body expo. It would be nice to have an example year round cycle ( and not a dreamt up one).

It's a different ball game for sure being a pro, but they didn't just start doing 3 gram a week of test. They must have ramped up to it as their body develops.

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Phil, Jay, and Ronnie are beasts!!!! I liked Phil and Jay the most. They seem really humble with their success. Have you ever say down to eat with them? It will blow you away watching these guys eat. Lol

EDIT: Yes, of course. They likely dose escalated in the beginning. Taking extreme doses right out of the gate would be a poor choice for anyone - pro or otherwise. :)

I liked Phil the best - so fkn chilled it was unbelievable, that was not a man on 3g of trst and 3g of tren training advice for everyone that wanted to talk to him, of course the queue was a mile long and only took an hour and a half to get to the front. I know why they call him 'the gift' now anyway. Can Phil overtake Ronnie in the all time greats ?

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Originally Posted by MR-FQ320

I liked Phil the best - so fkn chilled it was unbelievable, that was not a man on 3g of trst and 3g of tren training advice for everyone that wanted to talk to him, of course the queue was a mile long and only took an hour and a half to get to the front. I know why they call him 'the gift' now anyway. Can Phil overtake Ronnie in the all time greats ?

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Phil's my favorite. I'm hopeful for a "threepeat" at the O in November. The 2013 event should be good. Lots of possible contenders. Won't be easy. I gotta believe Phil is hungry for three in a row.

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Originally Posted by MuscleInk

I've seen this argument offered before (i.e. Arnold starting at a young age) and it rarely makes sense to me. The guys who started really young and went on to compete made a decision that this was going to be their profession. Body building was more than a recreational or lifestyle choice - it was a career. They were driven to become professional BBs and were willing to do what ever it took to WIN.

The majority of people on this board aren't using steroids to compete professionally. Yes, some chose to compete but even that level is often not at a professional card level.

Most people clearly have no clue the level of commitment these professionals make to BB. The amount of food intake and anabolic use at the professional level would blow most people's minds.

Frank McGrath, shown below, who I've met and chatted with a few times, takes extreme doses of gear at levels that are dangerously unhealthy, but at the pro level it's about winning - health and future consequences are secondary.



Attachment 140830



Attachment 140831



Attachment 140832


Frank often cycles 2-3 grams of test a week during MAINTENANCE periods between competitions. More when he competes! His caloric intake ranges from 3000-6500 depending on where he's at in his contest preparation.

Antoine Vaillant, another pro IFBB out of Montreal who I've met several times also takes insane doses of gear on and off cycle - doses that would likely kill a horse!!! Lol



Attachment 140833


There are very few guys on this board that are ready to make the level of commitment the pros make. Very few guys here will or have given up their school, family, or jobs to make a career out of body building at a professional level.

So unless you are ready to commit to BB full time and pursue a career at the professional level, you really can't make comparisons with the pros and ask, "why not, they did it when they were young".

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That guy got nothing against my boy Phil! Tell him he could just quit using roids in large doses and might save his health while its not too late!

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Originally Posted by abzlove

That guy got nothing against my boy Phil! Tell him he could just quit using roids in large doses and might save his health while its not too late!

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Lol, Phil's been at this longer and Frank was out of circulation 3-4 years ago when he almost lost his life in a car wreck. He wasn't expected to pull through let alone ever compete again.

Heck, I'd give my left arm to look like Frank now!!!

Antoine just turned 24. The kid is a beast for having only 6 years of training under him.

Amazing insight MI. great reading.