How does this cycle look?

[Whiteboyy0]

First cycle. 21 years old 6'5 220 lbs. I have enough gear for 14 weeks but am planning on 12.
1-4 40 mg dbol Ed
1-12 test e 250 mg 2x a week
Hcg 250 iu 2x a week
Ldex .25 mg eod

Pct starting 2 weeks after last pin
1-30 ldex .25mg 100.mg clomid and 20 mg nolva

I also plan on taking 5 mg cialis 2x a day and livercare tablets.

All this Is based on info I found on here. Opinions?

[kronik420]

http://forums.steroid.com/anabolic-s...-steroids.html

[Whiteboyy0]

Already read that. A lot of people say waiting till age 25 is overkill. I understand the risks

[kronik420]

Already read that. A lot of people say waiting till age 25 is overkill. I understand the risks

by 'alot of people' you mean the guys at the gym?

[Whiteboyy0]

People In that thread and on the forum. Don't need to be a smartass man, I have put a lot of research into this

[Back In Black]

What is your bodyfat%?

Goals? Diet plan?

[bookie]

Go for it then! If you know then risks, then good luck bro!

[Whiteboyy0]

What is your bodyfat%?

Goals? Diet plan?

i estimate around 13-15, macros 40 p 30 c 30 fat. Going to start at 4k cals and adjust from there. i work manual labor so i might need more cals. Want to add lean mass and hopefully lose some fat as well

Go for it then! If you know then risks, then good luck bro!

thanks man

[Bio-Active]

Ldex is not for pct. what are your stats training exp, bf%.

[Back In Black]

i estimate around 13-15, macros 40 p 30 c 30 fat. Going to start at 4k cals and adjust from there. i work manual labor so i might need more cals. Want to add lean mass and hopefully lose some fat as well

thanks man

You are bulking? How many cals do you eat now to bulk?

[Whiteboyy0]

Ldex is not for pct. what are your stats training exp, bf%.

pheednos stick thread in the pct section says to use that combo. Training 6 year. Bf is around 13-15

You are bulking? How many cals do you eat now to bulk?

im just maintaining now at 3500.

[Back In Black]

Why don't you just add 500cals to your current diet and bulk without AAS?

[Whiteboyy0]

Why don't you just add 500cals to your current diet and bulk without AAS?

I've been lifting 6 years I'm pretty sure I'm at or near my natty limit. I started At 130 lbs at this height

[Back In Black]

I've been lifting 6 years I'm pretty sure I'm at or near my natty limit. I started At 130 lbs at this height

How do you know if you aren't bulking? 220 isn't particularly heavy for 6' 5", you should really be taking advantage of your natural test levels and add 500cals to your diet.

[Whiteboyy0]

How do you know if you aren't bulking? 220 isn't particularly heavy for 6' 5", you should really be taking advantage of your natural test levels and add 500cals to your diet.

I have been bulking prior to this. It's not worth it IMO to do a 16 week bulk and gain 10 lbs of mostly fat.

[Back In Black]

I have been bulking prior to this. It's not worth it IMO to do a 16 week bulk and gain 10 lbs of mostly fat.

That would be poor diet management then, IMHO. Your carbs and fats are probably the wrong ratio. I'd suggest you went with 60-70g max of fat. If I go more than that with high carbs then I gain lots of fat too. Up your cals by 300 and see how that goes.

[Whiteboyy0]

That would be poor diet management then, IMHO. Your carbs and fats are probably the wrong ratio. I'd suggest you went with 60-70g max of fat. If I go more than that with high carbs then I gain lots of fat too. Up your cals by 300 and see how that goes.

my test is on the low end of normal according to my doc so I always keep my fat high. I don't think it's poor diet management though I've made great gains in the past but I just can't seem to make mass gains anymore. I still have progress with strength though

[Back In Black]

If you are concerned that your test levels are low then how will you feel after cycle when they come back, potentially, lower than they were when a cycle started?

[Whiteboyy0]

Yes that's another concern of mine. I was also considering self administering trt doses. Doctor wouldn't do anything for me since I'm young, even though I fit the profile.

[Back In Black]

Yes that's another concern of mine. I was also considering self administering trt doses. Doctor wouldn't do anything for me since I'm young, even though I fit the profile.

Then you really need to find a Dr that will refer you to the right people and absolutely not think about anything else until your issues are resolved. Good luck, I know you're in our HRT forum with some good guys.

[amcon]

cycle is fine... it would be more helpful if you had nova dex or letro in my op...

i would try the letro - just cuz if you say your 15PERSENT body fat - normally that means the person is really 20 % ... so, the problem you will have in increased chance of estrogen conversion (happens when body fat is higher levels)

and just finsh out the full product dont cut it short - nothing worst then having one or two weeks of stuff left and not enought to do any thing with.

again as stated above - to answer this extreamly accuately more info would be helpful...



now to address this... and please listen... "my test is on the low end of normal according to my doc so I always keep my fat high" bs!!! your diet is why your body holds more fat!!!

so what if your test is low! that doesnt mean your MUST PUT ON fat!!!

fat is a easy mathimatical equasion! eat more then you burn and fat is added for that day - burn more than you eat and fat is removed for that day... END OF STORY!

so the point... DIET< DIET > DIET, then WORK OUT, then DRUGS

[crazy mike]

Hey man let me apologize for some others that jumped on you before giving you a chance. You said you were learning not that you had it all under your hat, I know so with that I say, slow down. Stop ! look (research) and listen. Do more reading on all your Q's, do more general readings as to steroids and the young. You are light for your size, and you are young which tells me you got more natural growth using diet and supplements.
So read up, listen close to BIB. Get into the nutrition and HRT and TRT forums. Good luck, be patient it takes a long time to build a body like a true bodybuilder/ ...crazy mikee

[crazy mike]

Go for it then! If you know then risks, then good luck bro!

Not a productive thing to say, before taking time to talk to him and given another shot. The fact that he could lay it out somewhat shows he was doing some reading, and making showed an effort. I think we just got finished helping you with your deficiencies. As I say all the time. Be cool, be patient. I say it and it's the hardest thing for me to do and fail much of the time. But I try to help others like you and him. .... crazy mike

[ma_fighter]

Go see another Doc, those "Normal" test ranges can sometimes range from ages 18-65, and being at the low end of "normal" does not mean it IS normal. How you feel and what symptoms you have are actually more important than the test levels themselves.

Sadly, most docs are crap when it comes to hormones. Even a lot of Endos, who supposedly are specialists at the human Endocrine system, are crap.

Get properly tested first, thats just my suggestion.


Also, you will not need the Cialis on cycle mate.
Drop the D-bol!! Test only for #1 cycle.
No A-dex during PCT
You really are too young, especially if you ALREADY are having problems with your hormone levels.
I think you KNOW OF the risks, but I do not think you fully, and truly, UNDERSTAND the risks. There's a difference

Whatever you decide to do, I wish you Good Luck


/Maf

[Whiteboyy0]

Appreciate the advice man, I just feel like going this route would be a lot cheaper than repeated doctor visits plus cost of script. I intend to get regular bloodwork. Iirc test e won't take effect for 4-6 weeks, which would be after I'm done with the d Bol . Would that still be overkill?

[Whiteboyy0]

amcon i think you misunderstood I keep my fat macros high to assist in hormone production. Not my body fat. I'm fairly confident I'm below 15 I still have outlines of top 4 abdominals. Your post is very insulting I mentioned my macros in the above posts as well as calories, I understand cals in vs cals out

[Whiteboyy0]

Hey man let me apologize for some others that jumped on you before giving you a chance. You said you were learning not that you had it all under your hat, I know so with that I say, slow down. Stop ! look (research) and listen. Do more reading on all your Q's, do more general readings as to steroids and the young. You are light for your size, and you are young which tells me you got more natural growth using diet and supplements.
So read up, listen close to BIB. Get into the nutrition and HRT and TRT forums. Good luck, be patient it takes a long time to build a body like a true bodybuilder/ ...crazy mikee

thanks for the help mike. I'm not starting yet still have some questions. I plan on August at the earliest.

[Whiteboyy0]

I also see a lot of conflict with on cycle support. Some people say only an ai and others say an ai and serm. What go you guys think?

[Back In Black]

You would be a fool to try and self medicate. See another Dr.

[Whiteboyy0]

I don't see how that's foolish if I get regular labs, have reliable access to gear, and use responsibly. Please explain

[Back In Black]

You will always have regular access to everything you need? Always have funds? Do you even know the cause of your low test?

[Whiteboyy0]

If I were to go that route it wouldn't be very expensive taking say 200 mg a week. I haven't committed to anything but if I plan ahead and do more research I'm confident I won't have problems. Also no have not found the cause they did a full panel on me, perfectly healthy with normal t according to my doctor

[Back In Black]

You should revisit your thread in the HRT forum.

[ma_fighter]

get.. a... new... doc...

Also, FYI, Nebido which is *the* testosterone therapy for people with hypogonadism is 1000mg every 12 weeks, thats LESS than 100mg per week, and its with the undecanoate ester, so its even less test mg per mg then Enanthate.

Seriously, get another docs opinion, you do NOT want to f*ck up your HPTA even worse if you already have a problem.. It could even be a brain tumor thats the cause of your low T, in which case you'll end up killing yourself if you selfmedicate..

[crazy mike]

Get another opinion from a doc. WE are not doctors. Good luck. ...crazy mike

[Chx beach 79]

This might help. Dbol is extremely liver toxic, deca is way better and results aren't as watery. You are to young despite what others are telling you.