Estrogen, Prolactin, Progesterone Management + Gynecomastia Prevention & Reversal

**austinite** · 08-12-2014, 02:47 PM

What was your baseline? You may just run high naturally, which would be fine. I would not increase AI dose at this time.

**M@D MIKE** · 08-12-2014, 03:30 PM

i am unsure what baseline levels were at as i specifically asked for prog measured. im just feeling tired and lost interest in sex over the past 3 or so weeks i may lower hcg to 500iu per week or drop it completely and do bloods in a couple of weeks. may add proviron at 50mg per day to boost libido which was insane until recently

**M@D MIKE** · 08-12-2014, 03:52 PM

another question Aus when running trenbolone or deca would you suggest low test with higher tren /deca and a dht based steroid ie stanozolol or masteron as a means of keeping E2 low and combating potential progesterone sides?

**austinite** · 08-12-2014, 05:55 PM

Well, Mike. Without baselines, most bloodwork is pretty much worthless.

I don't have recommendations on Tenbolone. Use whatever dose you can that allows you to manage E2 properly.

**M@D MIKE** · 08-13-2014, 02:06 PM

thanks Aus ive decided to dump hcg and will get retest in 2 weeks and post results also i will start and get boodwork off cycle too. Thank you for taking time to answer my questions much appreciated brother

**austinite** · 08-13-2014, 07:35 PM

I have no idea why you would drop hCG . That is a terrible idea in my opinion. You should always get baselines. But either way, best of luck to you.

**farfarrrr** · 08-14-2014, 04:48 AM

hi aus.
i have letro and exemestan.wich is better for ai?
thank u

**Nimbusdp** · 08-14-2014, 07:10 AM

Thank you so much! This really helped me to understand a whole slew of things I didn't understand. It also explains why I'm having such a rough time with losing fast in my chest area, when its gone from almost every other area. My gym partners always told me you take arimidex to not get man boobs and to drop the water out of your system so you look skinnier. I wish I had really done more research before jumping into my first cycle. I also like the part where you talk about aromotase being found in fat cells, so more fat = higher risks, which really is going to help me get down to a lower body % before I run my next cycle. Thanks for all your help austinite.

**austinite** · 08-14-2014, 08:33 PM

Originally Posted by farfarrrr

hi aus.
i have letro and exemestan.wich is better for ai?
thank u

as stated in the article, there is rarely ever a reason to use Letro.

**farfarrrr** · 08-15-2014, 04:42 AM

Originally Posted by austinite

as stated in the article, there is rarely ever a reason to use Letro.

thank u aus so i use exemestane

**BMUS3** · 08-29-2014, 05:01 PM

Awesome awesome article man! I have mild gyno right. I've never used steroids or anything either. Guess I'm just super prone. What did you use to reverse your case? I'm currently doing the tamoxifen (nolvadex ) route right now (:

**austinite** · 08-29-2014, 08:40 PM

Originally Posted by BMUS3

Awesome awesome article man! I have mild gyno right. I've never used steroids or anything either. Guess I'm just super prone. What did you use to reverse your case? I'm currently doing the tamoxifen (nolvadex) route right now (:

Raloxifene.

**mackbutter** · 09-06-2014, 01:36 PM

Great and interesting thread.
I'm currently on pct. Clomid/Nolva. 100/100/50/50/25/25 and 20/10/10/10/20/20 . I think I'm 4 weeks in . Plan on going to 6 weeks. I'm as emotional as a pregnant woman those past 3 weeks. I just started to drop my clomid to 25 and bumped my nolva to 20. I feel a bit better yesterday and today....
I'm on the road now and can't get any BW for the next 3 - 4 weeks.
I was wondering if u would recommend an AI during my pct? BUT, I only have access to letro.... Is taking 1/4 tab of femora twice/week be an option for the next 2 weeks?
Thanks !

**austinite** · 09-06-2014, 03:14 PM

Originally Posted by mackbutter

Great and interesting thread. I'm currently on pct. Clomid/Nolva. 100/100/50/50/25/25 and 20/10/10/10/20/20 . I think I'm 4 weeks in . Plan on going to 6 weeks. I'm as emotional as a pregnant woman those past 3 weeks. I just started to drop my clomid to 25 and bumped my nolva to 20. I feel a bit better yesterday and today.... I'm on the road now and can't get any BW for the next 3 - 4 weeks. I was wondering if u would recommend an AI during my pct? BUT, I only have access to letro.... Is taking 1/4 tab of femora twice/week be an option for the next 2 weeks? Thanks !

no need for AI during pct.

**kyawookie** · 09-14-2014, 11:32 PM

I've been told that once the tissue grows for gyno it's there and it will always be there. Your saying this can be reversed? I'm not question your knowledge at all because a "bro" told me that information. I will trust your word way over his. But I guess my question is I have caught gyno at such an early stage it doesn't even look like gyno (nipples aren't puffy at all or sensitive I can feel just a very small lump under my nipples) can the small amount really be reversed? I have pharm tabs of tamoxifen (20mg) I'm going to take for 100 days (I'll order more if needed) but I'm just curious if it can really be totally reversed. And I'm taking your advice and getting bloods done tomorrow because I'm mid cycle.

**austinite** · 09-15-2014, 04:29 AM

Yes, it can go away. Check the studies posted in the gynecomastia thread, under Austinites Educational Article Database sticky.

**kyawookie** · 09-15-2014, 02:20 PM

Ok. Thank you very much for the quick reply. And great post!

**minotaur74** · 09-23-2014, 02:23 PM

For a few months I took Arimidex but was never really able to get my E2 down. (During this same time my prolactin was high so this probably didn't help.) Finally about a month ago I switched to Aromasin and I've been on 25mg Aromasin every day now. I've had two blood tests in this time: one about two weeks ago my E2 was at 232 and the other I just got back was at 261. (Range for E2 is 7.6-42.6) My prolactin is in range; I take .5mg caber every 6 days and it's working well. My progesterone is in range too.

Should I up the Aromasin or would adding DIM perhaps be more effective?

**austinite** · 09-23-2014, 11:06 PM

^ More than 25mg usually isn't needed. Aromasin is weak, but still a decent AI.

Are you sure your products are legit? You can add DIM anytime, but it won't help if you're that high. Try a different brand AI, or use Arimidex daily and retest. You might be a rare case of a Letro needer.

**Call me reptar** · 09-23-2014, 11:18 PM

Dim actually works as an ai?

**austinite** · 09-23-2014, 11:21 PM

DIM works if you're hovering over range to help drop it a bit. DIM is mostly beneficial for low dose TRT patients who prefer/are able to not use an AI. DIM should not be the sole AI when cycling steroids .

DIM is an amazing compound and a staple for me.

**Call me reptar** · 09-23-2014, 11:27 PM

I havnt had any estrogenic problems while cycling. I can't get my hands on an ai. I could only get nolvadex . So with no estrogenic problems so far what would be a good ai. I've always been fine without one.
Thank you for the information by the way.

**austinite** · 09-23-2014, 11:30 PM

Originally Posted by Call me reptar

I havnt had any estrogenic problems while cycling. I can't get my hands on an ai. I could only get nolvadex . So with no estrogenic problems so far what would be a good ai. I've always been fine without one.
Thank you for the information by the way.

huh? What do you mean you don't have estrogenic problems? You're not human? You don't convert test to E2?

**Call me reptar** · 09-23-2014, 11:31 PM

Oops you listed the ai's above. What I'm getting at is do I 100% for sure need one?

**Call me reptar** · 09-23-2014, 11:32 PM

I havnt had any gyno problems lol.

**austinite** · 09-23-2014, 11:34 PM

Please read the article. Gyno is not your only problem. You really need to stop cycling and learn more. Sounds like you're just winging everything. Respect your body.

Have a powerful day.

**Call me reptar** · 09-23-2014, 11:36 PM

Thank you.

**minotaur74** · 09-24-2014, 07:52 AM

Originally Posted by austinite

^ More than 25mg usually isn't needed. Aromasin is weak, but still a decent AI.

Are you sure your products are legit? You can add DIM anytime, but it won't help if you're that high. Try a different brand AI, or use Arimidex daily and retest. You might be a rare case of a Letro needer.

I'm sure the Aromasin is legit and I've tried two different brands. Same with the Arimidex I used to take; I'm sure it was legit but it didn't lower my E2.

I've got Letro (Fempro) but it's dosed at 2.5mg pills. There's no way I could break that down to the recommended 50mcg. idk, maybe pulverize it and weigh out tiny portions?? I know it's legit because it crashed me years ago. (Of course I had no idea what I was doing back then and took 2.5mg every day for a week.) What do you think? Should I try half, or maybe a quarter every other day and get blood work after a week? What do you suggest?

Also, given the difficulty of dosing the Letro is there a reason just adding more Aromasin would not be the way to go? Would it just not be effective?

Thanks.

**sgtanal** · 09-29-2014, 04:29 AM

thanks!

**austinite** · 09-29-2014, 09:44 AM

Originally Posted by minotaur74

I'm sure the Aromasin is legit and I've tried two different brands. Same with the Arimidex I used to take; I'm sure it was legit but it didn't lower my E2.

I've got Letro (Fempro) but it's dosed at 2.5mg pills. There's no way I could break that down to the recommended 50mcg. idk, maybe pulverize it and weigh out tiny portions?? I know it's legit because it crashed me years ago. (Of course I had no idea what I was doing back then and took 2.5mg every day for a week.) What do you think? Should I try half, or maybe a quarter every other day and get blood work after a week? What do you suggest?

Also, given the difficulty of dosing the Letro is there a reason just adding more Aromasin would not be the way to go? Would it just not be effective?

Thanks.

You'll have to figure out how to split your tabs. There are pill cutters available out there for small pills.

Adding more aromasin will not make much difference. Again, it's a weak AI. 25 and 50mg will give you the same results. 50mg will probably get you there a bit faster, but won't make much more overall impact.

**jab824** · 09-29-2014, 04:03 PM

Hi-
Thanks for the valuable information.

So if someone has the beginning symptoms of gyno, treatment with arimidex will not reverse the gyno; it will only prevent its progression. To reverse the gyno, you need a drug like nolvadex .

Is this correct?

**austinite** · 09-30-2014, 05:07 AM

correct. ^

**minotaur74** · 10-15-2014, 01:23 PM

Originally Posted by austinite

You'll have to figure out how to split your tabs. There are pill cutters available out there for small pills.

Adding more aromasin will not make much difference. Again, it's a weak AI. 25 and 50mg will give you the same results. 50mg will probably get you there a bit faster, but won't make much more overall impact.

Austinite--
I've got 2.5mg letro tabs. For a week I took a quarter of a tab every other day. This moved my E2 from 261 to 215pg/mL (in range is 7.6 - 42.6). Pretty negligible results. So then I started taking a half a tab every other day for a week and a half. I just got my blood work back and my E2 is at 198. It barely moved! I'm sure the letro is legit and I'm actually starting to feel shut down. I have no idea how the hell this is happening. Any ideas?

**headkick** · 10-15-2014, 02:51 PM

good read.

can I ask questions here or should I make my own thread?

**brojas13** · 10-15-2014, 03:04 PM

so when is the best time to take Estrogen blockers? during cycle, after, Etc... sorry im new to all of this

**Bodacious** · 10-15-2014, 03:05 PM

Originally Posted by jab824

Hi-
Thanks for the valuable information.

So if someone has the beginning symptoms of gyno, treatment with arimidex will not reverse the gyno; it will only prevent its progression. To reverse the gyno, you need a drug like nolvadex .

Is this correct?

Austinite....so what would be the beginning symom's of gyno? Everyone say nipples beginning to get sore but if I am not mistaken your nipples will get sentive as your test goes up but doesn't necessarily mean it's gyno right?

**Bodacious** · 10-15-2014, 03:06 PM

Originally Posted by brojas13

so when is the best time to take Estrogen blockers? during cycle, after, Etc... sorry im new to all of this

Day two of cycle...

**juicn91** · 10-24-2014, 05:24 PM

I had gyno caused from estrogen rebound, i was overseas for 6 weeks while it kept getting larger, once i came back i had started 60mg of Ralox with 0.25mg adex and .5mg caber x2 a week. I am on a low dose of test (200mg) and 350mg Tren E (Tren has never given me gyno even at 800mg as I have always run caber). My question is, is it possible to reduce my gyno while on cycle? I just bought some pharma grade Ralox as i think the research chem product isn't the best.
P.S sorry if you have already answered this question before, I've been trying to search everywhere!

**austinite** · 10-24-2014, 10:12 PM

Originally Posted by juicn91

I had gyno caused from estrogen rebound, i was overseas for 6 weeks while it kept getting larger, once i came back i had started 60mg of Ralox with 0.25mg adex and .5mg caber x2 a week. I am on a low dose of test (200mg) and 350mg Tren E (Tren has never given me gyno even at 800mg as I have always run caber). My question is, is it possible to reduce my gyno while on cycle? I just bought some pharma grade Ralox as i think the research chem product isn't the best.
P.S sorry if you have already answered this question before, I've been trying to search everywhere!

Raloxifene or Tamoxifen on cycle. But mainly, blood work and E2 management via AI's. Anything else is a guessing game and likely a waste of time.

**crazyclown666** · 10-25-2014, 12:54 AM

Great post OP, you did much better then a lot of Doctors would! However I still have some questions:

1. You mention managing estrogen levels is first line defence for other hormonal imbalance issues, so would estrogen levels resolve on their own with time or taking one of the mentioned methods are a must?

2. Lets say I have an estrogen problem along with a prolactin problem, would I need to treat both at the same time?

3. If I get tested for estrogen and its out of range, Would I need to re-test so I know my estrogen is at a normal range?