First Time Steroid User, Please Help me PROs (football)

Okay so I'm going to start steroids (d-bol first cycle, dbol+ winstrol second cycle) ONLY 2 CYCLESto help my progress and i had a couple of questions.

1) should i take anything before starting? like a Pre cycle therapy?
2) does steroids just help with strength/mass or can i use it to increase my performance when it comes to sports (faster sprints, etc)
3) What pct should i Use? I read a couple of places that people could use Ostarine as a Post cycle and I could easily get a hold of that So i could use that. If not what should i use? Nolva ??
4) between my dbol and dbol+ windstrol cycle do i need to take a break?
5) i already have a workout regime which is primarely compound movements but it's only 3x a week. on my cycle should i be looking to add another workout for a 6-7x workout a week? Keep in mind i'll also be doing sprinting drills 3-4x a week.

and I don't really want a bloating effect and i don't want to gain too much weight. I'm currently 180 lbs and by the end of this i don't want to be over 200lbs (190ish with an 8%)
and once i'm off do i lose most of my gains? strength, mass? etc? because i know a lot of people say this but i'm only doing 2 cycles.

1. Yes. Commit to a great and proven resultful diet. And get blood work.
2. Steroids amplify the effects of your diet.
3. Clomiphene and Tamoxifen.
4. You should't even consider dianabol just yet. Cycles without testosterone are unacceptable.
5. No need to change training routine.

That was merely to give you some answers so you're not left with nothing. However, let me be very clear... you're not ready. Not even remotely close (no offense).

Read the following threads in the order listed, and let us know if you have further questions...

- http://forums.steroid.com/anabolic-s...ffect-you.html
- http://forums.steroid.com/anabolic-s...rst-cycle.html
- http://forums.steroid.com/anabolic-s...njections.html
- http://forums.steroid.com/anabolic-s...all-costs.html
- http://forums.steroid.com/anabolic-s...od-counts.html

Best of luck to you.

1. You need to do more research before you buy or use any drugs.
2. Again, your choice for using an oral only cycle is poor, not optimal, and you need to do more research.
3. Go to the PCT section. Read the stickies. There's a whole subforum just dedicated to PCT talk.
4. There is a general rule, (also depending on what your goals are) that you should take just as much time off as you are on. So that means, Time during steroid use+time before starting PCT+Time on PCT=Time off of steroids.
5. If you don't want any side effects or bloating, dont use drugs. But bloating, weight gain, keeping your gains and strength, will depend mostly on your diet, and your training. Sounds like you need to hit up the nutrition section as well. I personally don't think your ready to cycle anything. You say you want to only do 2 cycles, but what happens if you cant recover properly? Are you prepared to take exogenous hormones for the rest of your life if you dont? By the way most people who cycle, don't stop cycling as long as they're training. Most people cant wait to get right back on it.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by austinite

1. Yes. Commit to a great and proven resultful diet. And get blood work.
2. Steroids amplify the effects of your diet.
3. Clomiphene and Tamoxifen.
4. You should't even consider dianabol just yet. Cycles without testosterone are unacceptable.
5. No need to change training routine.

That was merely to give you some answers so you're not left with nothing. However, let me be very clear... you're not ready. Not even remotely close (no offense).

Read the following threads in the order listed, and let us know if you have further questions...

- http://forums.steroid.com/anabolic-s...ffect-you.html
- http://forums.steroid.com/anabolic-s...rst-cycle.html
- http://forums.steroid.com/anabolic-s...njections.html
- http://forums.steroid.com/anabolic-s...all-costs.html
- http://forums.steroid.com/anabolic-s...od-counts.html

Best of luck to you.

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I agree with Austinite. Listen to what he says, he's very knowledgeable.

You came to the right place. You need to educate yourself.

yeah guys, Thanks so much for the advice. I'm not planning on starting anytime soon this is just to gain knowledge and get a good milestone that's why i'm here. I'm not just going to buy a bottle of dbol and start popping them tomorrow, I'm trying to acquire as much knowledge as I can.

Austinite, I want to thank you so much for helping me. I just read all the links you gave me and I understand a lot of what i need to do and what i'm missing out on.

another question. For my first cycle, you said i should be going on testosterone. But i read that when you stop taking testosterone you body stops producing it, and i'm relatively young (20) and i don't really want that. any other suggestions?

I know i'm a steroid virgin but i don't want to be mistakes when it comes to permanent changes so i will ask you a lot of questions..

Thanks again mate,

You are smart for doing your research and asking questions.

Read the threads Austinite recommended. You aren't the first young guy to come on here and recommend a crazy destructive cycle. Don't be discouraged by the comments. We are here to help and honestly, your proposal is way off base. Dbol only and then Dbol+winnie?!?! Someone is filling your head with bad ideas. Any single vet on here will know more than any collection of guys in the locker room or gym who are clearly advising your incorrectly.

There are plenty of threads on here from guys 19-23 looking for help to fix the problems they created by cycling too young and now they have emotional issues, can't get it up, have no sex drive, and many have lost most of their gains and feel like crap.

Don't throw your life away on one or two poorly planned cycles. Steroids have been around for decades and aren't going anywhere. There's plenty of time for you to learn and work on nutrition and training and when you've reached an age where there is less risk of destroying your endocrine system (about 25), that's when you can give anabolics some serious consideration.

Good luck. I hope you'll make the wise choice and hang around and learn from the knowledgable guys and stop listening to the "know-it-all" guys.

Here's an example of what I'm talking about:

http://forums.steroid.com/hormone-re...97-anavar.html

This young guy learned the lesson the hard way and will now need TRT for LIFE to function like a normal man.

We just want to keep you safe brother. ;)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by MuscleInk

Read the threads Austinite recommended. You aren't the first young guy to come on here and recommend a crazy destructive cycle. Don't be discouraged by the comments. We are here to help and honestly, your proposal is way off base. Dbol only and then Dbol+winnie?!?! Someone is filling your head with bad ideas. Any single vet on here will know more than any collection of guys in the locker room or gym who are clearly advising your incorrectly.

There are plenty of threads on here from guys 19-23 looking for help to fix the problems they created by cycling too young and now they have emotional issues, can't get it up, have no sex drive, and many have lost most of their gains and feel like crap.

Don't throw your life away on one or two poorly planned cycles. Steroids have been around for decades and aren't going anywhere. There's plenty of time for you to learn and work on nutrition and training and when you've reached an age where there is less risk of destroying your endocrine system (about 25), that's when you can give anabolics some serious consideration.

Good luck. I hope you'll make the wise choice and hang around and learn from the knowledgable guys and stop listening to the "know-it-all" guys.

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^^^beautifully worded and excellent content

vvvv

just learning how to use this forum, sorry!

so far, the things i need thus far are:
HCG,
Aromatase inhibitor,
N-Acetyl Cysteine
the actual steroid/ testosterone
a job
am i missing anything?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by MuscleInk

Read the threads Austinite recommended. You aren't the first young guy to come on here and recommend a crazy destructive cycle. Don't be discouraged by the comments. We are here to help and honestly, your proposal is way off base. Dbol only and then Dbol+winnie?!?! Someone is filling your head with bad ideas. Any single vet on here will know more than any collection of guys in the locker room or gym who are clearly advising your incorrectly.

There are plenty of threads on here from guys 19-23 looking for help to fix the problems they created by cycling too young and now they have emotional issues, can't get it up, have no sex drive, and many have lost most of their gains and feel like crap.

Don't throw your life away on one or two poorly planned cycles. Steroids have been around for decades and aren't going anywhere. There's plenty of time for you to learn and work on nutrition and training and when you've reached an age where there is less risk of destroying your endocrine system (about 25), that's when you can give anabolics some serious consideration.

Good luck. I hope you'll make the wise choice and hang around and learn from the knowledgable guys and stop listening to the "know-it-all" guys.

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Thanks so much man, so what would you recommend? I am really in consideration to doing this. If i do this, even correctly, will it still screw up my sex drive, test levels permanently, etc?

how do i get austinites and musleInks attention again so they could post here again? :S I really want to learn more about what they have to say!

honestly bro, 20 is too young. your body (as a male) is at its peak, of producing testosterone. your really don't need, and definitely shouldn't and don't want to be cycling. at least not yet. take advantage of your young age now, and then when your older, and your body starts to loose its abilities thats when u wanna bump shit up.

cycling now for you at such a young age has SO many consequences.

you are far better off changing and or dialing in your routine and diet to get better results. and you can easily obtain the results you seek with just a little persistence, determination, and discipline

usually i tell people to take advice from people with a grain of salt, but all the people above that have given u advice are not only good people, but are on point as well.

we all hope you do the right thing.

go get it bud,

Not to split hairs but your profile says 23 which is still too young
But being 20 is really too young.
Since no one has asked what are the rest of your stats. Height. Weight. Body Fat.

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Originally Posted by JeremyFootball

another question. For my first cycle, you said i should be going on testosterone. But i read that when you stop taking testosterone you body stops producing it, and i'm relatively young (20) and i don't really want that. any other suggestions?

I know i'm a steroid virgin but i don't want to be mistakes when it comes to permanent changes so i will ask you a lot of questions..

Thanks again mate,

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I'm actually impressed that you read and digested the stickies before getting all uptight and defensive. (That's the usual progression of a "I'm 18 and I want to cycle" thread) Your question that I quoted is really intelligent and probably THE most important question you could ask. The answer is, of course: it's very dangerous at 20 and most here will recommend that you wait until 25. You seem open minded, keep reading and I think you'll become more convinced that they are right.

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Originally Posted by Capebuffalo

Not to split hairs but your profile says 23 which is still too young
But being 20 is really too young.
Since no one has asked what are the rest of your stats. Height. Weight. Body Fat.

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you're absolutely right, i'm rushing into things. I'm not that big, i'm 6'0 180 lbs at 10%, i was at 192 at about 10% but most of it due to studies and football.

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Originally Posted by Zodiac85

I'm actually impressed that you read and digested the stickies before getting all uptight and defensive. (That's the usual progression of a "I'm 18 and I want to cycle" thread) Your question that I quoted is really intelligent and probably THE most important question you could ask. The answer is, of course: it's very dangerous at 20 and most here will recommend that you wait until 25. You seem open minded, keep reading and I think you'll become more convinced that they are right.

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Thanks Zodiac, I think i'll stay away from juice. The majority of the football team is on roids in my school alone, and the level i'm going to enter in i'm against people that are my height, with 30 pounds over me and the same speed so obviously i'm going to get ****ed, but that's merely not as bad as getting ****ed permanently. So if you guys are strongly urging me to stay away and saying that i will more than likely get permanent side effects i will stay away.

Thank you all for the sound advice.

SINCE I'M HERE, i could get a hold of Ostarine, do you guys think that's safe for me to take? lemme know!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by JeremyFootball

The majority of the football team is on roids in my school alone,

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Seriously?

I'm assuming this is "American Football" and at your age it would be college, governed by the NCAA?

When I played I was tested before fall ball and spring ball and even had two random tests. Did they change how often they drug test?

From reading lots of threads here, it seems like a realistic expectation for a first cycle is 5-15 lbs of lbm. At your size and age that's very doable with a proper diet.

It took me until 35 to learn this, but a food scale is more powerful than any steroid.

I got nothing to say, just agreeing with the posts above.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by evander87

Seriously?

I'm assuming this is "American Football" and at your age it would be college, governed by the NCAA?

When I played I was tested before fall ball and spring ball and even had two random tests. Did they change how often they drug test?

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yeah, it's disgusting. this is college football. and i'm not sure. i played rugby and there were no tests but in football they don't test everybody in the team, they just randomly test 2-3 players on about 50, and so far the only 2-3 players that have been tested are the 25% that aren't juicing.

zodiac, do you think you could be able to help me with my diet? i made another thread but nobody commented on it. the gist of it is...

i'm 180lbs at 6'0 (184cm) my ultimate goal is to be 190-195lbs at 8% but the tricky thing is i don't ever want to be over 10% at anytime because i don't like the fat/puffiness it adds on to my face

so how would i approach this? thanks a lot buddy

Quote:

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Originally Posted by JeremyFootball

zodiac, do you think you could be able to help me with my diet? i made another thread but nobody commented on it. the gist of it is...

i'm 180lbs at 6'0 (184cm) my ultimate goal is to be 190-195lbs at 8% but the tricky thing is i don't ever want to be over 10% at anytime because i don't like the fat/puffiness it adds on to my face

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Eat eat eat and eat some more. I thought I was eating a lot when I was playing ball but it wasn't until I started pounding a gallon of milk a day along with what I was eating that I had a great growth spurt.

I'm assuming at your stats your a safety or receiver? You can't give up speed for size. Dieon Sanders was not a big guy and he didn't hit for shit but he could close down half the field with his quickness.

Up your calories with whole foods eat chicken breasts like a mother effer and do plyometric workouts to build your explosive power. I imagine at your age you have a load of test naturally in your system and you just need to up your calories to grow.

You've gotten a lot of great feedback Jeremy and I applaud you for acknowledging that it is too early and risky for you to dabble in anabolic. With the correct nutrition and eating well above your TDEE (about 2,430 based on a bf of 10% and weight of 180lbs) you should be able to put on and maintain 190-195lbs without a problem. This will require dedication to a great nutrition plan and regular training. I know its hard achieving all this and being in school - I spent 18 years in university and it can be very demanding of your time (but so will a family and career be one day for you).

The guys in the nutrition forum will provide you with some great information and will help build a plan for you. Stick with it and your goals will come.

Regarding your cycle questions.....any steroid will suppress or shut down your natural production - some more than others. No one can guarantee you will recover well (at any age for that matter). You may, or may not, but at 20 (or 23) most guys here will honestly tell you not to take the risk and let your natural testosterone, nutrition, and training guide you to your goals. My concern with Enobosarm (Ostarine) is that it is still largely investigational. Yes, its used a lot off label in body building but there is very little safety data on the compound as it is still relatively new. There is no way to know if it will have any long term impairments simply because it hasn't been in use long enough.

You will be amazed how much you will achieve if you commit to a nutrition plan developed for lean muscle growth. Down the road when you are 25 (or older) and body building is still a lifestyle and passion for you, we'll still be here to guide you on the safe use of anabolics. :)

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Originally Posted by Docd187123

^^^beautifully worded and excellent content

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Thanks Doc. :)

I keep seeing these threads for football players wanting to go on gear. I wasn't a big kid in high school and I really wasn't that good at football. Taking steroids might have made me bigger but it wouldn't have improved my skills any, and the guys I know that went on to play in college and the NFL made it there because of their skill and knowledge of the game, not their size or muscle mass.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by JeremyFootball

zodiac, do you think you could be able to help me with my diet? i made another thread but nobody commented on it. the gist of it is...

i'm 180lbs at 6'0 (184cm) my ultimate goal is to be 190-195lbs at 8% but the tricky thing is i don't ever want to be over 10% at anytime because i don't like the fat/puffiness it adds on to my face

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I would be happy to, but I'm not really the best person for diet advice. The guys in the nutrition section are way more knowledgeable than me, and are very helpful.

I can share my diet strategy though. I measure and weigh every single thing. I used to be pretty sloppy and lazy about it, but after a 6 mo cut, I'm tired of cutting and really enjoying my lean bulk right now. I don't eat anything that I can't weigh or measure. That means eating out maybe twice a month, and then picking something off the menu that I can find in myfitnesspal. I eat the exact same thing every day, with a little bit of variation on my evening meal (thanks to my wife). If I get tired of something (egg whites for instance), I'll plan well ahead for what to replace it with and make sure I hit my macros every day. This is way easier on a bulk (about 3000 calories) than my cut (2000 cal). Eating natural whole foods all day is pretty filling and I'm rarely very hungry. I don't think this strategy is for everyone, most people would put more time into planning a variety of meals and stuff, I guess I'm too lazy for that.