Gaining Cycle (Sust, Deca+Equipoise + Dbol)

[Marc81]

HI

here are my stats:

Age 32
Weight : 180 lbs
Bodyfat: 16%

I have been training for 5 years. Did my 1st cycle 2 years back (Test E only for 12 weeks). It was really good with Nolva, clomid 6 weeks pct.

Now I am planning to do my 2nd cycle. I have my trainer working with me. Diet is spot on.

He suggested my this modified Mass gainer cycle:

D-bol 1-12 weeks (isn't it too long?)
Sust 250 4-16 weeks
Deca +Equipoise combo (4-16 weeks)

then PCT with Nolva & Clomid for 4-6 weeks.


He says that he has tried this cycle with clients & everyone dd great but my main doubt is D-bol for 12 weeks. Is it a good idea to run it for 12 weeks.
Second thing is Equipoise combined with deca- if I am already taking D-bol then equipoise is kind of injectable d-bol- so why should i take oral & injectable D-bol at same time. He says equipoise will provide me hardness & vascularity & I wont be having much water weight from Deca. It makes sense to me.

I wont be going for HCG as that compound gave me acne on my first cycle.

I would like to have experts' views before putting this stuff inside.

[austinite]

Welcome aboard, Marc. Really glad to see you've stumbled upon our community. You're in the right place.

The first thing I would recommend is to refrain from any further communication with your trainer regarding steroid cycles. No offense to him, but he is either clueless and/or does not have your best interest at heart. That being said, let me explain further...

- You're correct in your assumption; dianabol or 12 weeks is excessive.
- 250 mg of testosterone will yield little to no results.
- Cycle in general just seems excessive for a second run.
- hCG is vital on cycle, it's likely other compounds that caused acne.

With regards to Equipoise , you need to be extremely cautious with this compound. Hepcidin is your master iron regulator, when you use anabolic steroids , this peptide is suppressed and leads to excess RBC production. This is normal with most steroids, however, EQ supresses this compound to extreme levels and the result is increased RBC at alarming rates. This will cause your blood to become thick as mud, and you need to be aware that the risks involved with high hematocrit (blood thickness) are very dangerous. In order to combat this iissue, you'll need to donate blood far more frequently than you would with any other steroids, or donate double RBC's. This is not the type of vascularity you want. You want vascularity from high nnitric oxide levels and low body fat.

Furthermore; EQ gains are very mild. For having to run this compound at high doses for 16+ weeks, it just seems to be a waste of time and money. Especially when there are quite a few better and more effective compounds.

Lastly, it certainly can help with your food intake. It will likely make you extremely hungry, at all times. This may be good for some folks, but generally counter productive for me. Injecatble B12 can be used if increased appetite is required.

Anyway, back to your cycle. I think your testosterone base is a good idea. If you decide to run dianabol, stick to 4 to 6 weeks maximum.

Be aware that nandrolone is a progestin and causes side effects that need to be addressed, such as increased serum prolactin. You'll need a dopamine agonist such as Cabergoline or Pramiexole to combat this issue. Estrogen management will be your first line of defense against progestin side effects, so you'll need an aromatase inhibitor on cycle, such as arimidex or aromasin .

hCG on cycle is vital as stated earlier. Many folks assume that it's sole purpose is to prevent testicular atrophy. Frankly, that's far from the truth. hCG will maintain stimulation for your testosterone-producing leydig cells in your tetses. This will prevent the potential chance of your cells becoming desensitized, which will hinder recovery. Do it for the betterment of recovery.

Hope that sheds some light onto your next cycle.

Have a powerful day.

[Marc81]

Hi

Thanks for your detailed reply.

After reading your post, I thought it might be better to change the cycle to this:

Dianabol 1-4 weeks
Test E (or Sust) 4-16 weeks
Deca – 4-16 weeks

Arimidex – while ON the cycle
HCG - while ON the cycle

Now, can you put the dosage amount for the above considering that I have done only one Test E (500 mg per week) Cycle for 12 weeks 2 years back.

Moreover, Eating more would be good for me as I am a hard gainer. I don’t get fat that easily.

My concerns are: Can I control the water weight from Deca (while ON the cycle) as I don’t want to get aired up like a balloon while ON.

I am open to suggestions. If you want to suggest me something, please DO.

[Back In Black]

How tall are you?

[Marc81]

5' 9"

[carbo]

Why would you run Dbol weeks 1-4 by itself??

[Marc81]

Actually that was the idea of my trainer so that if I have any problem with D-bol I can identify. And the other point was to kick start before I start my main cycle.

I don't know whether it's a good idea or better to be conventional & start everything together & stop D-bol after 4 weeks.

[carbo]

What you're doing is running a small 'Dbol only cycle' prior to your Test+Deca cycle. IMHO this just adds additional 3/4 weeks of HPTA suppression with very modest results.

Ad your trainers advice - you won't be feeling much else than the Dbol for first few weeks anyway.

[Marc81]

I got your point. it makes sense.

What should be dosage of D-bol & other compounds. Can liquid D-bol do the job. I am getting 50ml/vial D-bol.

[carbo]

Considering this is your 2nd cycle, personally I'd try to keep the doses as conservative as possible.

Something like -
30mg/Day of Dbol Weeks 1-4
500mg/Week of Test and 400mg/Week of Deca Weeks 1-10.

You might want to run Test a week longer than the Deca to ease recovery. I'd leave the Boldenone out entirely.

Also please take good note of austinite's points regarding necessary cycle auxiliaries.

[Marc81]

I was thinking about at least 12-14 weeks cycle. Would that be too much.

I can stop Deca at 12th week & continue with Test for 2 more weeks. Would that be an overkill?

[Marc81]

Here is what I am planning to do now

Dianabol - Wk 1-4
Deca 400mg - Wk 1-12
Test E- 500mg Wk 1-14
Arimidex 0.5mg EOD Wk 3-14
HCG 5000 IU - Wk 3-14

PCT Nolva & Clomid for 4 weeks

Am I missing anything? I want to be 100% sure before putting any stuff in my body.

Any advice on Caber?

[Mp859]

Here is what I am planning to do now

Dianabol - Wk 1-4
Deca 400mg - Wk 1-12
Test E- 500mg Wk 1-14
Arimidex 0.5mg EOD Wk 3-14
HCG 5000 IU - Wk 3-14

PCT Nolva & Clomid for 4 weeks

Am I missing anything? I want to be 100% sure before putting any stuff in my body.

Any advice on Caber?

I personally run my ai from the start.

And just get liquid prami it works very well.

.5mg twice a week

[Marc81]

For AI, I just wanted to use once I start feeling any sides. Thats why kept it from Wk 3-14.
Liquid Prami is to encounter Deca effects- correct?

Would Liquid prami while on cycle is good option or Caber or both (in addition to Arimidex )

[redz]

Caber or prami not both. It is best to run the ai from the start.

[Marc81]

Thanks for the answer.

One more question- I am getting Liquid oral dianabol , 60ml vial dropper, 50mg per ml.

Should I keep 50 mg all 4 weeks or as a Pyramid
Wk 1- 25 mg
Wk 2- 50 mg
Wk 3 - 30 mg
Wk 4 - 25 mg

[Marc81]

Reply Anyone?

[KingJ243]

Do what works for you. If you have never run dbol before, I would say a safe dose to experiment at would be 30mgs. If you feel nothing and see no results from that after about a week and a half, bump up your dosage to 40-50mgs. I ran a cycle recently with 25mgs of dbol and gained or felt nothing from it until the last two weeks of my run when I bumped the dosage up to 50mgs. You have to figure out your own body chemistry. Recommended dosages are just that, recommendations.

[Marc81]

KingJ243 - That answers my question. Perfect Reply I guess.