Prolactin inhibitors… why are people taking them?

[docdoc]

Hey everyone,
I saw a few threads talking about taking prolactin inhibitors. My question was.. WHY THE HECK ARE PEOPLE TAKING IT?!

I get that prolactin inhibits GnRH.. so inhibition of prolactin would cause uninhibited production of GnRH and increased GnRH will cause increased synthesis of LH and FSH (giving you more testosterone cause of increased LH).

LH will give you more test
FSH will give you more Andrgen-binding protein and Inhibin.

If there is too much production of test.. Inhibin will go back to your anterior pituitary and tell it to shut down the production of test! so what's the point of taking prolactin inhibitors? body never allow itself to naturally over produce something unless there's a functional tumor or something.

And another thing… Decreasing prolactin will decrease dopamine!! you need dopamine for a lot of things! Why are people ****ing around with this system at a young age? They're asking for neurological problems.. from the top of head parkinsons and depression.

Why aren't people just sticking to anabolic steroids like the good old days? or am I missing something? As a doctor I always tell my patients to stay clear of any medication that messes with neurotransmitters in your brain. Because once you start messing with it, it's VERY hard to get it back to normal.. if possible. Those meds are strictly for people with sever psychological illness or certain brain tumors.

[jimmyinkedup]

AAS use in some situations results in a PRL increase which results in sexual sides and in more extreme cases even lactation. Dopamine agonists are usually taken on cycle when an unnatural increase in PRL occurs to offset this. While i too am not crazy about messing with thee neurological rewards system if it is to MANAGE PRL and keep it within clinical range I do not see that as a bad thing.

[docdoc]

If anything wouldn't an increase in testosterone cause a decrease in PRL? and Dopamine agonist are very serious, people should really take those with serious caution.. is it worth it?

[docdoc]

ohh I just realized.. If there's extreme testicular atrophy, very little inhibin would be produced to give a negative feedback to your brain…. is that why you would see increased PRL?

[austinite]

No issues taking dopamine agonists at all. Low prolactin causes no harm in men, high prolactin is problematic. Dopamine agonists are a smart move in the presence of progestins.

Your outlook is not considering cycling at all, docdoc.

Everything is dangerous when misused. That's why we educate on use and doses.

[austinite]

ohh I just realized.. If there's extreme testicular atrophy, very little inhibin would be produced to give a negative feedback to your brain…. is that why you would see increased PRL?

Why would there be atrophy?

[docdoc]

No issues taking dopamine agonists at all. Low prolactin causes no harm in men, high prolactin is problematic. Dopamine agonists are a smart move in the presence of progestins.

Your outlook is not considering cycling at all, docdoc.

Everything is dangerous when misused. That's why we educate on use and doses.

Hmm, Interesting… I've got something to research on my day off!

[docdoc]

Why would there be atrophy?

Jimmyinkedup said AAS in some situations cause an increase in PRL… everyone knows that exogenous use of anabolic steroids would cause testicular atrophy.

[austinite]

Yes, but we also recommend hCG on cycle to prevent atrophy. You see, we can come up with 100 scenarios. But if we discuss the safe cycle methods that we use, you shouldn't have any issues. Beyond that... all sorts of issues arise. Frankly, negative feedback/PRL issues are the least of my concerns if one chooses not to run hCG.

[kelkel]

It's normally used in the presence of progestins (deca-tren) as a safety net for estrogen issues. Nothing to due with test at all doc.

[austinite]

It's normally used in the presence of progestins (deca-tren) as a safety net for estrogen issues. Nothing to due with test at all doc.

Yes, and it's short term use in very small, yet effective doses. Jimmy's protocol with prami works perfect for me, with no issues whatsoever. Ramp up, before bed, wth food, done. Great blood work.

[docdoc]

Yes, but we also recommend hCG on cycle to prevent atrophy. You see, we can come up with 100 scenarios. But if we discuss the safe cycle methods that we use, you shouldn't have any issues. Beyond that... all sorts of issues arise. Frankly, negative feedback/PRL issues are the least of my concerns if one chooses not to run hCG.

True, but frankly after seeing what I have seen.. You would think the way I do as well. As far as I'm concerned, my brain is off limits. I'm so against all drugs that work in the CNS that I didn't even take pain killers when I had kidney stones. To this day I have never in my life taken ANY pain killers besides NSAIDs. Restoring a proper balance of neurotransmitters is a very difficult process for which people do a 3 year fellowship to learn. I know there are a 100 different scenarios where in theory it SHOULD work. At first it would look like its working.. but thats not want we want to worry about. We want to worry about the long term effect.

So like I said.. I'm gonna do some research on this and share my views after that.
I'm trying to get an endocrinology fellowship myself.. so this is right up my alley.

[docdoc]

It's normally used in the presence of progestins (deca-tren) as a safety net for estrogen issues. Nothing to due with test at all doc.

Yup, It makes sense now.. I just get scared when things involve neurotransmitters

[docdoc]

I was just wondering why people are taking DAs

[docdoc]

It's normally used in the presence of progestins (deca-tren) as a safety net for estrogen issues. Nothing to due with test at all doc.

At first I thought people were taking it to increase their natural test production… I'm seeing the use now

[kelkel]

True, but frankly after seeing what I have seen.. You would think the way I do as well. As far as I'm concerned, my brain is off limits. I'm so against all drugs that work in the CNS that I didn't even take pain killers when I had kidney stones. To this day I have never in my life taken ANY pain killers besides NSAIDs. Restoring a proper balance of neurotransmitters is a very difficult process for which people do a 3 year fellowship to learn. I know there are a 100 different scenarios where in theory it SHOULD work. At first it would look like its working.. but thats not want we want to worry about. We want to worry about the long term effect.

So like I said.. I'm gonna do some research on this and share my views after that.
I'm trying to get an endocrinology fellowship myself.. so this is right up my alley.

In that vein, what are your thoughts on Selegeline for life extension purposes?

[austinite]

lol. Your brain is off limits? You might want to stop eating food as well!

Joking aside... it is rare that someone avoids all the mentioned, so your situation is unique. I can respect that. But there's far too many clinical trials and observational conclusory to dismiss the benefits in smart doses. Many previously hypogonadal men were able to be restarted with drugs that affect clusters in the brain. (Even though the pituitary is not part of the brain). Sure beats being married to a needle early in life.

Looking forward to your research, always intriguing to hear different views.

[kelkel]

lol. Your brain is off limits? You might want to stop eating food as well!

Joking aside... it is rare that someone avoids all the mentioned, so your situation is unique. I can respect that. But there's far too many clinical trials and observational conclusory to dismiss the benefits in smart doses. Many previously hypogonadal men were able to be restarted with drugs that affect clusters in the brain. (Even though the pituitary is not part of the brain). Sure beats being married to a needle early in life.

Looking forward to your research, always intriguing to hear different views.

It's close enough in my book!

[austinite]

It's close enough in my book!

lol agreed.

[Lunk1]

Jimmyinkedup said AAS in some situations cause an increase in PRL… everyone knows that exogenous use of anabolic steroids would cause testicular atrophy.

Testicular atrophy is not a given. It is common but not everyone experiences atrophy!

[austinite]

Testicular atrophy is not a given. It is common but not everyone experiences atrophy!

Not true lunkster. Everyone experiences atrophy. Some are just not as noticeable. No one is defying laws.

[Lunk1]

Not true lunkster. Everyone experiences atrophy. Some are just not as noticeable. No one is defying laws.

I have never notice so much as a millimeter difference and I measure my junk all the time lol. Honestly I have never seen a noticeable difference but I get what you are saying.

[jdpeters]

If you don't start hcg from the get go can you introduce it mid-cycle?

JP

[austinite]

If you don't start hcg from the get go can you introduce it mid-cycle?

JP

Yes. prefer beginning though.

[Igifuno]

Great thread.. looking forward to hearing more on this..

[kelkel]

Great thread.. looking forward to hearing more on this..

On Lunk's testicals?

[Lunk1]

On Lunk's testicals?

Pics sent per your request. Enjoy

[austinite]

Filthy members.

[MuscleInk]

Hey everyone,
I saw a few threads talking about taking prolactin inhibitors. My question was.. WHY THE HECK ARE PEOPLE TAKING IT?!

I get that prolactin inhibits GnRH.. so inhibition of prolactin would cause uninhibited production of GnRH and increased GnRH will cause increased synthesis of LH and FSH (giving you more testosterone cause of increased LH).

LH will give you more test
FSH will give you more Andrgen-binding protein and Inhibin.

If there is too much production of test.. Inhibin will go back to your anterior pituitary and tell it to shut down the production of test! so what's the point of taking prolactin inhibitors? body never allow itself to naturally over produce something unless there's a functional tumor or something.

And another thing... Decreasing prolactin will decrease dopamine!! you need dopamine for a lot of things! Why are people ****ing around with this system at a young age? They're asking for neurological problems.. from the top of head parkinsons and depression.

Why aren't people just sticking to anabolic steroids like the good old days? or am I missing something? As a doctor I always tell my patients to stay clear of any medication that messes with neurotransmitters in your brain. Because once you start messing with it, it's VERY hard to get it back to normal.. if possible. Those meds are strictly for people with sever psychological illness or certain brain tumors.

You left off hallucinatory and delusional symptoms, paranoid ideations as well as impulsivity due to excitation of medial prefrontal cortex and posterior cingulate cortex due to pramipexole exposure.

[kelkel]

Pics sent per your request. Enjoy

Reported. And posted on the internet.

You left off hallucinatory and delusional symptoms, paranoid ideations as well as impulsivity due to excitation of medial prefrontal cortex and posterior cingulate cortex due to pramipexole exposure.

Was gonna say that......

[AD]

True, but frankly after seeing what I have seen.. You would think the way I do as well. As far as I'm concerned, my brain is off limits. I'm so against all drugs that work in the CNS that I didn't even take pain killers when I had kidney stones. To this day I have never in my life taken ANY pain killers besides NSAIDs. Restoring a proper balance of neurotransmitters is a very difficult process for which people do a 3 year fellowship to learn. I know there are a 100 different scenarios where in theory it SHOULD work. At first it would look like its working.. but thats not want we want to worry about. We want to worry about the long term effect.

So like I said.. I'm gonna do some research on this and share my views after that.
I'm trying to get an endocrinology fellowship myself.. so this is right up my alley.

an anti-spasmodic might have helped.

[MuscleInk]

Reported. And posted on the internet.

Was gonna say that......

My bad. Should have let you go first.

[docdoc]

In that vein, what are your thoughts on Selegeline for life extension purposes?

Funny that you mentioned selegeline… It's a drug used during depression or in parkinsonian type illnesses. It's used along side with other drugs.. As far as medical use goes, Yes it does increase the longevity of your life. But ALL drugs that work in your CNS have to be cycled. And even after cycling theses drugs you can never go back to the same drug.. or if you do go back, you're going to have to take a very high dose for it to work. I'm talking high doses the will give you messed up side effects!

Check out a patient that has parkinson's disease.. And check out how many d rugs that poor patient has gone thru. All CNS d rugs eventually stop working and you have to increase the dosage to get the desired result.

If people on AAS are taking DAs cause they've started to lactate then I understand. But they should know this… If, god forbid, one of these people who are taking DAs at such a young age are prone to developing parkinson's, they're really going to have to start off with a high dose… decreasing their survival.
The "d rug holiday" theory is absolutely true BUT what they don't tell you is that its not true for all receptors in your body.

[docdoc]

lol. Your brain is off limits? You might want to stop eating food as well!

Joking aside... it is rare that someone avoids all the mentioned, so your situation is unique. I can respect that. But there's far too many clinical trials and observational conclusory to dismiss the benefits in smart doses. Many previously hypogonadal men were able to be restarted with drugs that affect clusters in the brain. (Even though the pituitary is not part of the brain). Sure beats being married to a needle early in life.

Looking forward to your research, always intriguing to hear different views.

Would you be able to send me a link of these clinical trials? I'm intrigued. My pharmacology professor always told us to be very careful with these d rugs… maybe that's why I'm so anal when it comes to these classifications of meds. You say there are clinical trials that concluded that smart doses are helpful.. BUT what about the patients I've seen during my psych rotations? The doctors gave them smart doses yet it didn't help.

the smart doses WILL help with hormone imbalance and that is proven. I'm with that. But there hasn't been any conclusive study done that says that NEUROTRANSMITTERS can be restored back to its original norm.

Neurotransmitters like Norepinephrine, Epinephrine CAN be restored but I haven't read anything about others. Because even a slight increase/decrease in levels of NTs like Dopamine, Ach.. WILL present as a pathological condition.

[dixieflatline]

I think muscleInk posted his similar response to these drugs but I'll repost mine too. I may not be an experienced member or a doctor myself, but I'm inclined to agree with the doctor. I had an absolutely horrible and very scary response to pramipexole and I think many steroid users focus so much on the steroids being the "main" thing that they are taking, that they begin to take these other things on the side almost as if they were vitamins or something you'd get at GNC. Things like prami are drugs in their own right and to be totally honest, I might rather deal with some of the worst possible long term side-effects of steroids over the equivalent effects caused by a dopamine agonist...You can really mess your brain up with that stuff if you're not careful and like doc said, it ain't always easy getting neurotransmitters back in line.