Test, tren, deca...how to stack?

[ChestNBack]

Want to run a test, tren , deca stack. What are some good ways to stack this. Thinking about 800 mgs test, 600 mgs deca, 200 mgs tren per week for 12 weeks. This would be my second cycle.

[AlphaMike]

Your first was only test/dbol ?

Not saying you can't stack 2 19-nors but is it really necessary for your second cycle man? really?

[MotoLifter]

^^^^ Excellent point, and one the OP should seriously think about.

[kelkel]

Your first was only test/dbol ?

Not saying you can't stack 2 19-nors but is it really necessary for your second cycle man? really?

Concur. More is not always the answer.

[MuscleInk]

Concur. More is not always the answer.

True, only one thing I can think of where more may be better

[kelkel]

Jackie Ciles - YouTube

[Bert]

Advanced, so it would work.

[fit2bOld]

Youhad quite a few issues with test and dbol cycle. How about a straight test only cycle, that would really be your best bet.

[ChestNBack]

Yea fitt not going to happen. I want to compete. I'm not doing this to be beach ready. I seriously want to be a top competitor one day. Trust me there is tons more gear ad other things that I can use. I'm keeping it with aas for now. I'm only going to run tren at 300mgs a week. Was thinking deca at 600mgs week and test bettween 600-800mgs a week

[Back In Black]

Stats?

[sawyer86]

I cam see something going seriously wrong here.

[Bert]

Yea fitt not going to happen. I want to compete. I'm not doing this to be beach ready. I seriously want to be a top competitor one day. Trust me there is tons more gear ad other things that I can use. I'm keeping it with aas for now. I'm only going to run tren at 300mgs a week. Was thinking deca at 600mgs week and test bettween 600-800mgs a week

What are other things you can use?

[Igifuno]

Stats?

copied from profile:

Age:31
Height:5'7
Weight:190
Body Fat:18%
Training Experience: 2 years

those are some aggressive goals, being a top competitor. I would never discourage anyone from seeking out their goals but don't be fooled by the notion that more is always better, especially as it relates to good health. Are you prepared to face certain consequenses associated with the amount of gear the pros do? Have you competed yet?

[songdog]

Bro you are only going to grow so much each cycle no matter how much to take.You are forgetting the #1 thing in a cycle and the most important one.DIET! you work on this more and quit relying on mass amounts of aas you will have better results.Diet is key bro!

[0kriz]

Yea fitt not going to happen. I want to compete. I'm not doing this to be beach ready. I seriously want to be a top competitor one day. Trust me there is tons more gear ad other things that I can use. I'm keeping it with aas for now. I'm only going to run tren at 300mgs a week. Was thinking deca at 600mgs week and test bettween 600-800mgs a week

if you want to be huge i would recommend to start at lower and/or milder doses. grow in to your doses, its cheaper healthier. you only live once.

[tdoe11]

On a second cycle test is really all that is needed. And 500mgs/wk should most definitely be enough.

If you are dead set on tren or deca IMO deca is a much better choice for a second cycle. I would recommend a lower test higher deca cycle. Keep the test low and keep the sides low with correct use of an AI which is absolutely mandatory.

Try 250 test/450 deca weekly. Like I said an AI is a must. Keep your estrogen in check and automatically it will help keep your prolactin in check. Have some caber on hand in case you need it.

Keep the test low and let the deca do what it does best. I personally get amazing strength from deca and have zero sides. Deca is an amazing compound if your diet and training are in check.

Good luck bud. Research research research. There's more than one way to skin a cat you know.

[Back In Black]

Don't forget guys, he wants to be a pro.

[fit2bOld]

He only wants to hear what he wants and that's it.

[Jim3432]

Got a buddy on his 2nd cycle. 600mg test e, 600mg deca and 800-1000g of tren a and igf-1 and some other pep. Hes got 2 weeks left on his 14 weeks and he hasn't gained as much as I did my last test and dbol cycle. Now he's got decent but not impressive gains while building a tolerance for high doses of shit he shouldn't be close to using because he wants to be pro. All you guys man, (Bostin Loyd Copy Cats) Don't be dumb, build it slow, get a very nice solid base then run high doses of shit once you've ran low doses and figured out what works for you and doesn't.

[kelkel]

if you want to be huge i would recommend to start at lower and/or milder doses. grow in to your doses, its cheaper healthier. you only live once.

This sums it up.

[Java Man]

True, only one thing I can think of where more is definitely better

Fixed

[Java Man]

((Massive doses)(multiple compounds)) / little experience != big gains

You need to master training and eating. IMO you shouldn't be cycling anything yet until you have the other tools sharpened. Youre setting yourself up for early TRT, hypercholesterolemia, CHF, hypertension, fatty liver, connective tissue injury, enlarged prostate, kidney failure... There's a lot more I could list but that comes to mind immediately.

Youre already over 30 with 2y experience. Top competitors in the pro ranks have been training all their lives. Don't believe the crap you read about ramy only training for 3 years. He might have decided to make.training his professional vocation 3y ago but nothing would make me believe he looked like Steve Buscemi in 2010.

You need to think real hard about wanting to be a pro. I'm not saying this to put you down. I'm worried about this choice. All the gear on Earth won't make you the next Olympia if you only have that aspect covered. You'll bloat up and develop massive side effects, not massive muscles.

[ChestNBack]

Okay. Second cycle I will stick to test deca but I'm still not sure at what amount I should run this. Some is saying low test higher deca. Just worried about my tool not working if the test isn't high enough. Going to throw some hcg in towards the end of cycle. Staying away from dbol this cycle. Didn't like the sides from it. Although I ran dbol at 50mgs a day. By week three I had back pumps and a shot appetite and by week 4 I was having random nose bleeds because of the elevated bp from the dbol. So test deca only. I ran 600mgs week of test first cycle. Not sure if I should lower the dose of test. Anyone with test/deca cycle who made quality gains please chime in.

[Times Roman]

what i have found through experience primarily, is this.

Suppose you cycle with 500mg test/week. and you get result X

if you were to do a second cycle, but this time go with a full gram of test, you would not get a result of 2X. it doesn't work that way. You may get 2X the sides, but not 2X the benefit.

At best you can hope for, is slow incremental improvements over time. And then when the 500mg of test no longer gives you that incremental improvement, then it's time to consider increasing your dose/cycle.

just my .02

[Java Man]

HCG should be taken throughout cycles and stopped 3 days before pct begins. The idea is to not shut down at all by keeping your LH high thereby continuing to signal your testes to produce test even though its though the roof already. PCT is much easier this way. I cycled for many years with no AI and no pct. Why? It was the early to mid 90's and things weren't nearly as easy to get as they are now. I was also kind of reckless. That's why I feel so strongly about some of the things I see people doing. I didn't read this stuff. I made the mistakes and paid for it. Hopefully I can educate others so they do it right and get a 20y head start.

Stop deca 1 week earlier than test. It takes longer to clear than test.

IMO a good dose for you is 500 test and 600 deca. No dbol . I don't personally have any sides like nosebleeds and headaches, high bp, etc. from it but you proved that you do so probably not wise to take it. Each individual tolerates these things fdifferently.

On 500 test you should be at around 3000 or better free T if its pharma grade or even very good ugl. That's plenty at your level based on the history posted above. Numerous clinical studies have shown the optimal dose of deca for mass gain to be 600/wk. I've done more, I've done less. I like 600. More just seemed to increase sides. Less and I didn't feel I was getting the best results.

I personally think you can get just as much growth from test/deca as with tren . Tren really messes up my lipids and I'm 43 so I don't like that. I get frequent blood tests so this is a fact. I wasn't guessing. Many other people have confirmed to me that tren did that to them too. There are no human studies on tren since its not approved for human use and there are no plans to do so, so I can only go by what I've seen it do in me and others I trust. You should read everything you can find about it before making that jump IMO. I would, I did.

[ChestNBack]

Wow thanks java and everyone else who gave decent advice

[spiralkut]

copied from profile:

Age:31
Height:5'7
Weight:190
Body Fat:18%
Training Experience: 2 years

those are some aggressive goals, being a top competitor. I would never discourage anyone from seeking out their goals but don't be fooled by the notion that more is always better, especially as it relates to good health. Are you prepared to face certain consequenses associated with the amount of gear the pros do? Have you competed yet?

If those are your stats then sorry to be the bearer of bad news but you will never be a top competitor, you're already 31 and your stats are no where near the guys even winning nationals in Aus. Probs get flamed for this but be realistic its impossible to make up that much ground.

Let me just clarify, im not saying this to destroy someones dreams im saying this because if his reason to take big amounts of steroids is that goal then im saving him from wasting his health for nothing.

[ChestNBack]

Excuse me. Top competitor can come in many forms. Age has nothing to do with anything. A 20 year old has a better chance of being better than me because they are younger. I might not ever get a pro card but I sure as hell ain't going to let someone like you tell me it can't be done. As far as weight 199 for my height is pretty jacked. Shawn Ray never competed over 215 and he was a top pro and right around my height. You don't even know what I look like. Numbers don't mean shit

[Live for the PUMP]

If those are your stats then sorry to be the bearer of bad news but you will never be a top competitor, you're already 31 and your stats are no where near the guys even winning nationals in Aus. Probs get flamed for this but be realistic its impossible to make up that much ground.

Let me just clarify, im not saying this to destroy someones dreams im saying this because if his reason to take big amounts of steroids is that goal then im saving him from wasting his health for nothing.

Keep this bogus BS to yourself man. Although many times saying someone can't do something makes them want it more and GET IT. He is 31! That is young! 20 yr olds are too worried about partying (most of the time). At his age he has plenty of time to achieve his goals!

[Live for the PUMP]

Excuse me. Top competitor can come in many forms. Age has nothing to do with anything. A 20 year old has a better chance of being better than me because they are younger. I might not ever get a pro card but I sure as hell ain't going to let someone like you tell me it can't be done. As far as weight 199 for my height is pretty jacked. Shawn Ray never competed over 215 and he was a top pro and right around my height. You don't even know what I look like. Numbers don't mean shit

That is so fn true! My stats are not that impressive, but I look impressive. Unless people are lying to me.
Most people think I weigh 20lbs more than I actually do. For me it's just cause I have small bones, but have lots of meat on them. A lion's day in heaven.. If he can catch me.

[ChestNBack]

Thanks @Live

[spiralkut]

Excuse me. Top competitor can come in many forms. Age has nothing to do with anything. A 20 year old has a better chance of being better than me because they are younger. I might not ever get a pro card but I sure as hell ain't going to let someone like you tell me it can't be done. As far as weight 199 for my height is pretty jacked. Shawn Ray never competed over 215 and he was a top pro and right around my height. You don't even know what I look like. Numbers don't mean shit

wow seriously? he was your weight at 3% BF not 18%bf, instead of throwing a tantrum why dont you clarify what you mean by top competitor. Top competitor means you want to be at the top and its fact that the excuse you gave for taking endless amounts of oil instead of a "beach body" amount is a joke.

EDIT

why dont you clarify your stats for us, because the way you're talking you dont sound 18% BF

[spiralkut]

My whole point is his reasoning for taking huge cycles is invalid, and if he wants to compete and win the small comps that can be done on his version of a "beach body" cycle

[spiralkut]

That is so fn true! My stats are not that impressive, but I look impressive. Unless people are lying to me.
Most people think I weigh 20lbs more than I actually do. For me it's just cause I have small bones, but have lots of meat on them. A lion's day in heaven.. If he can catch me.

Mate you got rocks in your head if you believe BF% doesn't mean shit, also i cant sense weather you're being serious over the internet but if you believe you have "small bones" then you are as delusional as obese people saying they are big boned.

[ChestNBack]

My bodyfat is right around 15 percent and would be acceptable for off season diet. Lee priest was well into the 20 percent range off season. To can throw the argument that your body doesn't respond well to high levels of bf and far as growth is concerned. But 12-15 percent isn't bad at all. That could easily be dropped to 5 percent with the right contest prep.

[Live for the PUMP]

Mate you got rocks in your head if you believe BF% doesn't mean shit, also i cant sense weather you're being serious over the internet but if you believe you have "small bones" then you are as delusional as obese people saying they are big boned.

Where did I say this...? lol.

Your ignorance and stupidity having me lmao. Then again you are just a 21yr old kid who thinks he knows it all. I was 21 before, don't worry I understand.

BTW you probably should of learned this at the age of 7..but it's ok I will teach you.
Bones vary in size, everyone doesn't have the same size bones in other words.

[tattoo449]

Excuse me. Top competitor can come in many forms. Age has nothing to do with anything. A 20 year old has a better chance of being better than me because they are younger. I might not ever get a pro card but I sure as hell ain't going to let someone like you tell me it can't be done. As far as weight 199 for my height is pretty jacked. Shawn Ray never competed over 215 and he was a top pro and right around my height. You don't even know what I look like. Numbers don't mean shit

Not trying to be rude but there is a big difference between 199 lbs / 18% bf and 215 lbs / 3% bf. A big difference. !! Sometimes numbers do matter. But good luck to you.

[Jonnyg419]

I wouldn't run that kind of stack unless I had serious aspirations to win a Sandow.