Cutting Cycle

[hgdw86]

Hi All!

First of all my stats:

28 years old
105kg
+- 12% body fat

Goal:

110 - 115kg
6% body fat

I am currently getting ready to run a cycle(not my first but has been over a year and a half) and would like some assistance on the cycle please, like i said currently at 12% body fat, I have started clen this week and will only start the cycle once at about 9%.

Week 1 - 16 - Test E - 400mg a week
Week 1 -16 - EQ E - 400mg a week
Week 4 - 9 - Tren E - +- 200mg a week (would really like advice on the tren)
Clen - 2 weeks on 2 weeks off for the entire cycle

I was thinking of taking some dbol for the first 4 weeks just for the push start, any opinions or alternatives on this would be apprciated.

I will be running Arimidex .25 EOD for the 16 weeks.

Then 4 weeks Clomid PCT as per usual (Should i add anything else to my pct, was thinking nolva for the first week of PCT, just to assist with a possible rebound of the arimidex.

My current blood work

Total test - 20.7
Free Test - 349.5
Progestorone 0.9
SHGB - 48.3

All advice will be appreciated.

[hgdw86]

PCT

Day 1-30- .25mg L-dex + 100mg Clomid + 20mg Nolva?

[Gaspaco]

Hey buddy!

You want to lose 6% bf and want to be 5-10kg heavier at the same time?

What is your height btw?

[hgdw86]

Hey Buddy!

Yeah my goal seems tough on the cycle but main purpose is to get to 6% body fat, not too concerned about the weight can always pick that up after the cycle as well, but im luckily in the sense that i normally lose fat and gain quality mass. I'm 1.93m

[Back In Black]

Cycle history?

Why eq?

Why only 5 weeks on tren E?

[hgdw86]

I have done 3 cycles previously.

First cycle was a test e cycle only 400mg/week for 12 weeks, was amazing!!!
2nd cycle was test e at 400mg/week and deca 200mg/week, used it to assist with some joint pain. 12 weeks
3rd cycle was test prop 300mg a week, eq at 400mg and winstrol tabs, didnt enjoy the prop at all, the EQ gave me the best pumps i ever had and veins were bursting which makes me want to take it again (motivation), i know a lot of people not so into EQ but personally i loved it, Tren will be for 6 weeks, I have read that the sides of tren are really bad and 6 weeks is all that is needed and prefferably mid cycle?

[SteveUK]

Hi All!

First of all my stats:

28 years old
105kg
+- 12% body fat

Goal:

110 - 115kg
6% body fat

I am currently getting ready to run a cycle(not my first but has been over a year and a half) and would like some assistance on the cycle please, like i said currently at 12% body fat, I have started clen this week and will only start the cycle once at about 9%.

Week 1 - 16 - Test E - 400mg a week
Week 1 -16 - EQ E - 400mg a week
Week 4 - 9 - Tren E - +- 200mg a week (would really like advice on the tren)
Clen - 2 weeks on 2 weeks off for the entire cycle

I was thinking of taking some dbol for the first 4 weeks just for the push start, any opinions or alternatives on this would be apprciated.

I will be running Arimidex .25 EOD for the 16 weeks.

Then 4 weeks Clomid PCT as per usual (Should i add anything else to my pct, was thinking nolva for the first week of PCT, just to assist with a possible rebound of the arimidex.

My current blood work

Total test - 20.7
Free Test - 349.5
Progestorone 0.9
SHGB - 48.3

All advice will be appreciated.

If your gonna run EQ do 600mg+ or drop it completely, More trenE 350-450mg 10wks, Something to think about EQ is not as good as test so I would recommend doubling your test first before adding EQ to a stack, or you might find it a waste of money. If you where running a 800-1gram+ of test then what I find is EQ is a good addition over adding more test in a stack.

[hgdw86]

Really dont want to increase my test over 400mg a week, wouldnt mind taking the tren at 400mg for 10 weeks tho, maybe from week 3 - 12 of the 16 week cycle, what would you replace the EQ with, maybe winstrol or anavar?

[Back In Black]

Don't replace it. Just run test and tren, as it's your first go with the latter. You'll then know exactly what it does for you.

[ironbeck]

I have done 3 cycles previously.

First cycle was a test e cycle only 400mg/week for 12 weeks, was amazing!!!
2nd cycle was test e at 400mg/week and deca 200mg/week, used it to assist with some joint pain. 12 weeks
3rd cycle was test prop 300mg a week, eq at 400mg and winstrol tabs, didnt enjoy the prop at all, the EQ gave me the best pumps i ever had and veins were bursting which makes me want to take it again (motivation), i know a lot of people not so into EQ but personally i loved it, Tren will be for 6 weeks, I have read that the sides of tren are really bad and 6 weeks is all that is needed and prefferably mid cycle?

Those best pumps you ever had was likely do to the winni tabs not the EQ.
I would raise the EQ to 6-800 to be effective and run the Tren E at 4-500 a week for (8 WEEKS) and Dbol will give you bloat instead of a "cutting" effect try Tbol

[hgdw86]

Yeah that actually makes a lot of sense, thanks very much!

So the cycle would look like this:

Week 1 -16 - Test E 400mg/week
Week 3 - 12 - Tren E 400mg/week
Clen 2 week on 2 weeks off - total of 8 weeks
Arimidex at 0.25 EOD for the full 16 weeks

Week 17 - only arimidex 0.25mg

PCT

Day 1-30 - 0.25mg arimidex + 100mg Clomid + 20mg Nolva

Do you think i could take DBOl for the first 4 weeks to kickstart?

[hgdw86]

Would like to use TBOL instead of DBOL, but it is extremely hard to get hold of, yeah the DBOl will definitely cause too much water, any other opinions - and thanks to all for the assistance, much appreciated!

[ironbeck]

why not? go ahead and use the dbol, you will drop the water when the tren kicks in.

[hgdw86]

yeah something i will definitely think about - seeing that im not starting very soon atleast have some time to think about it and try get my hands on some TBOL, if i really cant will do DBOL

[SteveUK]

Would like to use TBOL instead of DBOL, but it is extremely hard to get hold of, yeah the DBOl will definitely cause too much water, any other opinions - and thanks to all for the assistance, much appreciated!

The Ai will keep most of the water off from the DBOL, the Dbol will also give you the pumps you want. Cycle looks a lot better now, Make sure your diet is in check and i wouldn't go too low on the calories until the tren kicks in.

[hgdw86]

K awesome, i can definitely get the TBOL so will use that for the first 4 weeks!

I am currently on the atkins diet just to shred some fat fast but will go on the following diet when i start my cycle. What you guys think?

Time Meal
5.30am Cardio Blackcoffee, x1CLA,Lcart,Fatburn
6.30am Meal 1 100g oats
50g mixed berries
300ml eggs whites

9.30am Meal 2 Lean Beef mince 200g

100g Broc/Cauli

12.30pm Meal 3 150g sweet potato
Lean Beef mince 100g
100g Broc/Cauli

3.30pm Meal 4 100g basmati rice
100g Broc/Cauli
200g Chicken Breast

5.00pm TRAIN Pre, then during 5g Glutamine,
5g Creatine, 10g BCAA

6.30pm Meal 5 POST 50g carbs
20g vitargo on leg days only


7.30pm Meal 6 Chicken Breats 200g
100g Broc/Cauli

8.30pm Meal 7 100g Broc/Cauli
200g lean beef mince

9.30pm Meal 8 fry them like an omlete
10 LGE egg whites
2 whole egg
Before bed 2000mg flaxseed,
2000mg fishoil

[SteveUK]

Macro's?

[Back In Black]

Are you running HCG?

I wouldn't run clen on cycle either if you are going to use tren.

100mg of clomid every day for 30days is over kill.

Clomid 100/50/50/50
Nolva 40/20/20/20

You could run the nolva an extra week or 2 if you feel the need.

Do NOT run your AI in pct.

[hgdw86]

I have never run HCG before i read that a dose of 250iu to 500iu everyday (ed) for 2 to 3 weeks is good during PCT? I can definitely get that as well.

Please see macros below, really hope it comes out alright?

Time Meal Protein Fat Carb Calories
5.30am Cardio Blackcoffee, x1CLA,Lcart,Fatburn

6.30am Meal 1 100g oats 17 6.9 67 376
50g mixed berries 0.4 0.2 7.3 28
300ml eggs whites 30 0 3 147
Subtotal 47.4 7.1 77.3 551

9.30am Meal 2 Lean Beef mince 200g 38.2 23.6 0 260

100g Broc/Cauli 3 0.3 6.5 34
Subtotal 41.2 23.9 6.5 294

12.30pm Meal 3 150g sweet potato 2.4 0.1 30.2 120
Lean Beef mince 100g 19.1 12 0 130
100g Broc/Cauli 3 0.3 6.5 34
Subtotal 62.7 36 36.7 544

3.30pm Meal 4 100g basmati rice 2.8 0.2 30 108
100g Broc/Cauli 3 0.3 6.5 34
200g Chicken Breast 43.6 6.4 0 330
Subtotal 49.4 6.9 36.5 472

5.00pm TRAIN Pre, then during 5g Glutamine, 0 0 0 0
5g Creatine, 10g BCAA 0 0 0 0
Subtotal 0 0 0 0

6.30pm Meal 5 POST 50g carbs 50 0 50 160
20g vitargo on leg days only 0 0 20 160
Subtotal 50 0 70 320

7.30pm Meal 6 Chicken Breats 200g 43.6 6.4 0 330
100g Broc/Cauli 3 0.3 6.5 34
Subtotal 46.6 6.7 6.5 364

8.30pm Meal 7 100g Broc/Cauli 3 0.3 6.5 34
200g lean beef mince 38.2 23.6 0 260
Subtotal 41.2 23.9 6.5 294

9.30pm Meal 8 fry them like an omlete
10 LGE egg whites 40 0 0 142
2 whole egg 12 10 0 239
Before bed 2000mg flaxseed, 0 0.2 0 2
2000mg fishoil 0 0.2 0 2
Subtotal 52 10.4 0 385

TOTALS 390.5 114.9 240 3224

[4linked]

I would run HCG on cycle not on pct at 250 iu 2x weekly usually day before the test inj. its easier to keep ur testies going if you can rather than trying to restart them after cycle. also listen to back in black and do not run ai on pct.

[4linked]

also dbol or tbol wont matter wich one water comes off after cycle.

[hgdw86]

Thanks so much for the advise and comments!

K, so after the advice, please give your opinion on the updated cycle below:

Week 1 -16 - Test E 400mg/week (16 weeks)
Week 4 - 13 - Tren E 400mg/week (10 weeks)
Week 1 - 4 - TBOL 20mg ED (4 weeks)
Week 1 and 2 - Clen (2 weeks)
Week 13 - 16 - Clen (3 weeks)
Week 1 - 16 - 2 x 250ui HCG/week before test shots
Arimidex at 0.25 EOD for the full 16 weeks

Week 17 - only arimidex 0.25mg

PCT - starting week 18

Clomid 100/50/50/50
Nolva 40/20/20/20

[SteveUK]

Thanks so much for the advise and comments!

K, so after the advice, please give your opinion on the updated cycle below:

Week 1 -16 - Test E 400mg/week (16 weeks)
Week 4 - 13 - Tren E 400mg/week (10 weeks)
Week 1 - 4 - TBOL 20mg ED (4 weeks)
Week 1 and 2 - Clen (2 weeks)
Week 13 - 16 - Clen (3 weeks)
Week 1 - 16 - 2 x 250ui HCG/week before test shots
Arimidex at 0.25 EOD for the full 16 weeks

Week 17 - only arimidex 0.25mg

PCT - starting week 18

Clomid 100/50/50/50
Nolva 40/20/20/20

I Would double the dosage of Tbol to 40mg, unless 20mg has worked for you in the past, its up to you either way. Cycle looks good, diet looks good to.

[hgdw86]

Thanks Steve!

I have never taken tbol before, guess i could start off at 40mg a day and see how my body handles it.

[newguy92]

Everything looks pretty good except for the pct should be started 19-21 days after your last pin

[hgdw86]

Hi New guy

Thanks for that, my understanding is that with Test E u should wait 2 weeks after the last shot to start PCT, so saying that i will be injecting on a monday of week 16 which means 2 weeks after should be the start of week 18, which is when i start my PCT?

[hgdw86]

Any comments on the PCT start time from the above, want to make 100% sure?

[4linked]

14 days after test inj.

[SteveUK]

Any comments on the PCT start time from the above, want to make 100% sure?

Test Enanthate is 14 days after last pin I believe.

[SteveUK]

14 days after test inj.

Snap.

[hgdw86]

Thanks guys!

Do you guys see a massive difference between Test e and test 400 which is

Testosterone Propionate: 25mgs
Testosterone Cypionate: 187mgs
Testosterone Enanthate: 188mgs

My PT said he thinks i should rather use the test 400 instead of just Test E, what are your guys opinion on this?

[Back In Black]

What is his reasoning? Is he your source?

[hgdw86]

Well he said the prop will start working a little faster, which is true, but i mean ill be on Tbol which kicks in pretty fast, so that statement didnt really change my mind but says i wont get as much water with the test 400 as i would with the test e, another thing is he can only get test e 300mg/ml which means ill be using more and they are pretty similiar in price, dont mind paying more if it will be more effective, but just want to make sure that using the test 400 would be a better option? Yes he is my source.

[Back In Black]

Well he said the prop will start working a little faster, which is true, but i mean ill be on Tbol which kicks in pretty fast, so that statement didnt really change my mind but says i wont get as much water with the test 400 as i would with the test e, another thing is he can only get test e 300mg/ml which means ill be using more and they are pretty similiar in price, dont mind paying more if it will be more effective, but just want to make sure that using the test 400 would be a better option? Yes he is my source.

I would never listen to my source about what to take. Take what YOU want. TBH that's such a small amount of prop it'll make no difference, and there is barely any distinction between the esters in cyp and e anyway that it makes little difference too. As for less bloat? That's good old fashioned bull. Test is test, your diet and e2 management will dictate how much you bloat, if at all.

As for 300mg/ml test e you don't have to use more at all. Just draw to .65 of a ml and you have 200mg. So that may work out cheaper?

[hgdw86]

Totally agree with you!

Thanks again!

[hgdw86]

Hi all

Would just like a little more clarity on HCG, I have been some research and a little worried about this research i have found, in my cycle plan, taking 2 x 250iu per week for 16 weeks, Im starting to think maybe i should start taking it the last few weeks of my cycle, please advise, here is some research below:

HCG should be taken for short periods of time and with long interval periods. The reason for this is that HCG can cause desensitization in the testes and this may cause permanent damage.

[hgdw86]

Any advice here?

[Back In Black]

It shouldn't cause desensitisation at the low dose. People run it at that dose forever on TRT. You're good at 250is x 2 pw.

[hgdw86]

Thanks Man!

[hgdw86]

Need some advice again please:

So here is the cycle im going to run:

Week 1 -16 - Test E 400mg/week (16 weeks)
Week 4 - 13 - Tren E 400mg/week (10 weeks)
Week 1 - 4 - TBOL 40mg ED (4 weeks)
Week 1 and 2 - Clen (2 weeks)
Week 13 - 16 - Clen (3 weeks)
Week 1 - 16 - 2 x 250ui HCG /week before test shots
Arimidex at 0.25 EOD for the full 16 weeks

Week 17 - only arimidex 0.25mg

PCT - starting week 18

Clomid 100/50/50/50
Nolva 40/20/20/20

I was wondering, I have 8ml of eq 300 lying around from a previous cycle, i really dont need to use but was thinking of using it at 600mg a week for the first 4 weeks or just throwing it away, would it be beneficial at all or just be a waste or damaging, I also have winstrol 50mg tabs that i was thinking of using the last 2 weeks, once again waste of time or beneficial?

Last thing regarding hcg, I have never used it and was wondering how to inject it, could i use and insuline syringe and inject into my stomach as you would with growth or does it have to be intermuscular?

Thanks!