VETS! Major Weightloss - Surgery or AAS?

[DrewZ]

Quick history;

Teetered on being morbidly obese from late teens to about 26 years old.
Decided to do something about it, lost the majority of it in 6 to 12 months by eating right and exercise.

I have never used AAS, or PH.
Lifting 6 years, 32 years old, 5'7. Pics are @ 160lbs.
Feel like gains are very very slow now

Love this lifestyle, I want to get huge and would like to compete.

Question is;
Do you think it would be possible to fill out and tighten up with the assistance of AAS or am I inevitability going to need to do the "nip/tuck" surgeries?

[king6 II]

Looks like you have accomplished a lot in the last 6 years, congrats to you on all of your hard work. You have a pretty solid frame to build on. A test only cycle could help fill you out and help add muscle.

[Armykid93]

Holy hell man good work, you look like your 200lbs shredded. Honestly though @160 you could put on weight easily without aas. You've obviously got the experience and knowledge but you can make more gains naturally for sure at that weight

[king6 II]

Just for clarification, you mentioned surgery in the title but did not mention it in your post. What kind of surgery are you asking about?

[DrewZ]

Thanks for the replies guys.

Just for clarification, you mentioned surgery in the title but did not mention it in your post. What kind of surgery are you asking about?

Woops, surgery to remove excess skin and tighten me up.

Updated OP - thanks

[king6 II]

In looking at your pictures, I think you will benefit from body contouring. It is a surgical procedure specifically geared towards removing excess skin from rapid or major weight loss. I don't think AAS can tighten you up enough to deal with the loose skin as it is mainly in your lower abs. If you are considering surgery I would definitely do that before running AAS.

[derekkpapa1]

Wow great job u looking good how much weight you loose

[Lunk1]

You are definitely going to need plastic surgery to get rid of the excess skin fold from being obese. You are in great shape and quite lean but that excess will never go away without surgery. Roughly $5K give or take.

[Java Man]

Amazing body reconstruction. truly.

Unfortunately, The skin left at your waistline won't go away on it's own. I think I see a line of it under your pec too but that actually may fill in when you gain more muscle. Picture 190lbs of muscle on you, and I think the skin everywhere except your lower ab area will be nice and tight. The problem with abs is they don't really get bigger so the only way to fill that skin is to get fatter or cut it off.

[adrenaline99]

holy shit man! you did that completely naturally? that's amazing u kept all the muscle u had while cutting all that fat. ****ing crazy man

[DrewZ]

Thanks again for all the replies and kind words.

Wow great job u looking good how much weight you loose

I am unsure really - I would guess I lost 100lbs of fat, while gaining muscle. I avoided stepping on the scale when I was at my biggest.

In looking at your pictures, I think you will benefit from body contouring. It is a surgical procedure specifically geared towards removing excess skin from rapid or major weight loss. I don't think AAS can tighten you up enough to deal with the loose skin as it is mainly in your lower abs. If you are considering surgery I would definitely do that before running AAS.

You are definitely going to need plastic surgery to get rid of the excess skin fold from being obese. You are in great shape and quite lean but that excess will never go away without surgery. Roughly $5K give or take.

Amazing body reconstruction. truly.

Unfortunately, The skin left at your waistline won't go away on it's own. I think I see a line of it under your pec too but that actually may fill in when you gain more muscle. Picture 190lbs of muscle on you, and I think the skin everywhere except your lower ab area will be nice and tight. The problem with abs is they don't really get bigger so the only way to fill that skin is to get fatter or cut it off.

^
Confirming my thoughts, appreciate it.

With my understanding about fat cells I probably have a lot more of them than the average person.

When I'm not as lean and dry as these pics I tend to get soft just above the waste/love handle area while my arms and legs still look vascular and lean.

I was thinking that might also be an issue when running AAS prior to having that skin/fat removed, Thoughts?

[DrewZ]

holy shit man! you did that completely naturally? that's amazing u kept all the muscle u had while cutting all that fat. ****ing crazy man

Yep, totally natural. Unless you consider my 5g of creatine a day half-natty

It's been a long journey with its ups and downs, always learning!

I still think I'm pretty wet behind the ears w/ lifting and nutrition.

Consistency is key.

[Brett N]

Nah, that's 100% natural IMO. Creatine is just a supplement, I would never consider that anything but natural. Impressive results, I hope wahatever you choos that it works out great for you. All that work, you deserve it man.

Your legs make me jealous, quads are impressive. Keep up the good work.

[Sgt. Hartman]

Amazing job bud congrats.

As already said you'll unfortunately need surgery to get rid of the skin at your abs. GL.

[Oki-Des]

Great work!

[king6 II]

Nah, that's 100% natural IMO. Creatine is just a supplement, I would never consider that anything but natural. Impressive results, I hope wahatever you choos that it works out great for you. All that work, you deserve it man.

Your legs make me jealous, quads are impressive. Keep up the good work.

Second this, your legs are fuggin nuts. I didn't accomplish that even after two cycles. Good work.

[ickythump]

Excellent work, you DEFINITELY look like you weigh more than 160 that's awesome!

[Java Man]

Thanks again for all the replies and kind words.


I am unsure really - I would guess I lost 100lbs of fat, while gaining muscle. I avoided stepping on the scale when I was at my biggest.







^
Confirming my thoughts, appreciate it.

With my understanding about fat cells I probably have a lot more of them than the average person.
Maybe, maybe not. You might just be, or have been in the past, more prone to storing calories as fat. You have in all probability changed your metabolism dramatically over what it was 6 years ago.

When I'm not as lean and dry as these pics I tend to get soft just above the waste/love handle area while my arms and legs still look vascular and lean.
That's normal for your body type. I'm the same way. Many people are. belly fat/handles is the hardest to lose and last to go. Also first place it fills in if you gain any fat back.

I was thinking that might also be an issue when running AAS prior to having that skin/fat removed, Thoughts?
IMO aas aren't a factor here. You don't have to gain fat or "water" if you eat clean and use proper ancillaries to control it. They aren't fat gainers. Food controls fat, drugs or not.

I would talk to your doctor about your metabolism, insulin sensitivity, glucose sensitivity, possibility of you having a greater number of fat cells than average, possibility of removing some of those fat cells while they're in there cutting anyways, why not run the old lipo probe in there? Etc.

Maybe someone with more knowledge about that will chime in here. I'm not sure if there are any negatives to liposuction healthwise.

[Lunk1]

The nice thing about a tummy tuck or even a mini. They cut out not only the skin but the fat in the area as well. You could also get some lypo as a package deal and suck out even more fat. This is the ONLY way to get rid of fat cells.

[kelkel]

Outstanding work DrewZ! You should be very proud of what you've accomplished.

[Igifuno]

Amazing Drew.. Outstanding work.

[reporich]

Nice dedication brother!

[tdoe11]

Wow man. You look great. Congrats

[bass]

Inspiring! Congratulations man.

[GirlyGymRat]

Drew. awesome and inspirational. nicely done.

The skin at abs seems very similar to my gf from pregnancy. Some ppl don't have as much elasticity, collagen, etc.. Surgery is about the only option and i completely understand wanting to get getting that removed. one of my gf had tummy tuck about year ago, she is very lean and is very pleased with the results. recovery was tough, but she said totally worth it! Good luck.

[DrewZ]

Thank you all again, a search for the right doctor begin now!

[Lunk1]

Thank you all again, a search for the right doctor begin now!

If you have any questions about the procedure, let me know. I am pretty familiar with it.

[DrewZ]

If you have any questions about the procedure, let me know. I am pretty familiar with it.

Thanks Lunk,
I will keep you in mind when the time comes closer, appreciate it!


Would like to find the best one obviously, looking in the LA/Hollywood area. - Any other parts of the Country I should be looking to find a brilliant surgeon?

From a lot of the examples I've seen, I'm unimpressed with the results. Then again, none of the guys tend to be in great shape either.

[Lunk1]

Thanks Lunk,
I will keep you in mind when the time comes closer, appreciate it!


Would like to find the best one obviously, looking in the LA/Hollywood area. - Any other parts of the Country I should be looking to find a brilliant surgeon?

From a lot of the examples I've seen, I'm unimpressed with the results. Then again, none of the guys tend to be in great shape either.

Your absolutely right, In most cases (with men anyhow) it's do to morbid obesity and they have lost so much weight that a doctor has deemed the excess skin a health risk and insurance covers it. These ppl are not in the great shape that you are..as not as fat as they used to be.

No doubt yours will be much more successful although at the same time, much less dramatic. You may fair well with what is called a mini tuck vs the full procedure that leaves a scar from hip to hip. The mini leaves a scar approx. 6" just above the pubic area. Easily hidden unless you wear a banana hammock everywhere lol.

I'm not in your area but in my experience it's a common procedure and most plastic surgeons are very capable of performing it but I agree. Find someone you are comfortable with and is going to do more than just pick your pocket. The lipo hurts like a bitch after

[diesel101]

OP very impressive transformation!

[adrenaline99]

just curious...how much weight did you lose?

[SEOINAGE]

Can I offer a different opinion?

First off you look amazing. Very lean and muscular, and seem larger than you look. Are you interested in competing in non drug tested shows? Are you interested in really getting huge? I would wait on the surgery if you answered yes to both of those questions.

If you plan on putting on another 30 lbs of muscle with the help of AAS. Realistically you could put on some weight naturally but if you are talking about competition ready and being huge it would be a bit different. But depending on your goals I would wait till after you put on the size that you want. You should be able to gain a lot of weight without additional stretch marks etc, and need less skin removed in the end. if you get trimmed now and then gain a lot of weight I think the end result would be worse.

If you want to just look great and maintain your lifestyle looking great like you do now then I would go ahead with the surgery. If you plan to stay naturally and maybe slowly over the years gain another 10 lbs of lean mass and maintain how lean you are then get the surgery now, but don't do any massive bulks after imo.

I think you just need to evaluate what your goals are, almost always it is best to do plastic surgery after you are at a body weight you plan to be stable at.

[DrewZ]

just curious...how much weight did you lose?

I am unsure really - I would guess I lost 100lbs of fat, while gaining muscle. I avoided stepping on the scale when I was at my biggest.

Can I offer a different opinion?

First off you look amazing. Very lean and muscular, and seem larger than you look. Are you interested in competing in non drug tested shows? Are you interested in really getting huge? I would wait on the surgery if you answered yes to both of those questions.

If you plan on putting on another 30 lbs of muscle with the help of AAS. Realistically you could put on some weight naturally but if you are talking about competition ready and being huge it would be a bit different. But depending on your goals I would wait till after you put on the size that you want. You should be able to gain a lot of weight without additional stretch marks etc, and need less skin removed in the end. if you get trimmed now and then gain a lot of weight I think the end result would be worse.

If you want to just look great and maintain your lifestyle looking great like you do now then I would go ahead with the surgery. If you plan to stay naturally and maybe slowly over the years gain another 10 lbs of lean mass and maintain how lean you are then get the surgery now, but don't do any massive bulks after imo.

I think you just need to evaluate what your goals are, almost always it is best to do plastic surgery after you are at a body weight you plan to be stable at.

Thank you for another view point! Here are my thoughts & concerns;

I should not run AAS when I have this excess skin/adipose tissue due to Aromatase
Even if I were 10% bf, my body would still have a lot more Aromatasing(new word?) power. - Not good
If I do surgery at my smallest, and then pack on a good amount of lean muscle, everything will be even tighter.
When I bulk in the future, I will do them slow, staying lean. Marathon not a sprint
No more massive caloric surpluses for me. I've learned my lesson learned here.

Immediate goals would be to feel comfortable with the shirt off at the beach, pool, and with the GF.

Competing at any level really is definitely a goal that I want to achieve by the end of the year.

Thanks again.

[SEOINAGE]

I think if you have your head on straight like you say, you'll have good results. Maybe even some natural bulking would go a long ways, but keep yourself lean and do it slow like you mentioned. Of course you don't want to go overboard and abuse AAS or you might just swell up too fast.... Good luck with your goals, hope I can be as lean as you soon.

[Cuz]

fvck dude, no sauce? You make alot of us juiceheads look like chit. hard to believe man, you look outstanding. Id never thought you weighed 160 that's nuts man. You look between 8-10%bf at minimum. Man im impressed.

Good look with the excess skin removal, I don't know much about it so I cant help you.

[DrewZ]

Thanks!

As with everything, its a learning experience.

Been "bulking" for a while now, and it has been fun!
Chalking up the bad food choices to bulking.
Currently 190lbs, and stronger than ever too.
Definitely learned first hand you cannot out work a bad diet.
I will not be dirty bulking anymore.
In my opinion this is stupid, especially for someone like me.


When I took those pictures in April, I had just completed a 12 week challenge where I went from 185lbs to 160lbs.

I am doing it again now, will post my results before I make any decisions on my next step.

Any and all advise is welcome.

Thanks again!

[SEOINAGE]

Thanks!

As with everything, its a learning experience.

Been "bulking" for a while now, and it has been fun!
Chalking up the bad food choices to bulking.
Currently 190lbs, and stronger than ever too.
Definitely learned first hand you cannot out work a bad diet.
I will not be dirty bulking anymore.
In my opinion this is stupid, especially for someone like me.


When I took those pictures in April, I had just completed a 12 week challenge where I went from 185lbs to 160lbs.

I am doing it again now, will post my results before I make any decisions on my next step.

Any and all advise is welcome.

Thanks again!

I've been dieting since last march, down 50 lbs counting water weight etc. But I'm also trying to lose 25 lbs in 12 weeks, which would be extremely fast for me, and so far seems like I'm starving myself. Basically eating carbless, but with two carb ups per week. For someone that has done that, got any tips? It will be 210 down to 185. And I'll be honest the hardest part with it recently has been controlling my temper, I might be dropping the grean tea, days I drink it it seems I want to blow up more by evening. Don't have these problems if I eat enough, but 2 lbs a week is cutting calories really low, on top of extra cardio. Look forward to seeing your results. Make sure you get a before and after photo.

[DrewZ]

I've been dieting since last march, down 50 lbs counting water weight etc. But I'm also trying to lose 25 lbs in 12 weeks, which would be extremely fast for me, and so far seems like I'm starving myself. Basically eating carbless, but with two carb ups per week. For someone that has done that, got any tips? It will be 210 down to 185. And I'll be honest the hardest part with it recently has been controlling my temper, I might be dropping the grean tea, days I drink it it seems I want to blow up more by evening. Don't have these problems if I eat enough, but 2 lbs a week is cutting calories really low, on top of extra cardio. Look forward to seeing your results. Make sure you get a before and after photo.

Sure, I will lay out for you exactly what I did.

Nutrition;
First thing in the morning,
pre-breakfast; spinach, mixed greens, small piece of a beet, couple of broccoli florets, cucumber with cold water, black pepper, and 5g micronized glutamine.

Breakfast; 2 whole eggs + 6-8 whites, + 1/2 cup oatmeal.

I prepped dozens of pre-made meals to have on hand with whatever lean meat/carb combo 3-4oz meat, 3-4 oz brown rice or beans.

Pre-workout; Preworkout of your choice, Creatine, Glutamine, +L-Carnitine, Green Tea Extract, Yohimbine HCl (at 175+lbs I can take 12.5mg, lighter than that I take 10mg) - Please read all about yohimbine before you take it, some people just shouldn't take it.
For me if taking a little too much it definitely gave me some wicked anxiety for a couple hours.

Bedtime; Casein shake with 5g Glutamine, ice, water, and sometimes with a few frozen strawberries.
I never let more than 3 hours pass without either having a small meal or a protein shake with 3-4 strawberries & unsweetened almond milk.
I take my fish oils, and multivitamins 3 times a day.
Sometimes I would have another green drink in the evening after a good session, I felt this aided in recovery.
I would drink 4-5 servings of a popular BCAA drink through out my day. (1-1.5 gallons of water)

Training;
For the entire 12 weeks I did some variation of this -
Day 1) chest/tri's - protein shake+glutamine, creatine, and then 20 mins of light cardio, later in the day again - 20 mins of light cardio
Day 2) back/bi's - protein shake+glutamine, creatine, and then 20 mins of light cardio, later in the day again - 20 mins of light cardio
Day 3) legs - protein shake+glutamine, creatine, later in the day again - 20 mins of light cardio
Day 4) 2 sessions of 20-30 mins light cardio

^rinse repeat^

I would often sub a light cardio session for doing the Ab Ripper X video at home, 2-3x a week.
Randomly would do core & shoulder work whenever I felt like it.
Shoulders got done a lot of times on leg day, and core work whenever.

I do cardio 2x a day, 7 days a week except on leg day - and when I say light I mean 125-140 bpm
I think a well functioning cardiovascular system is key for fat oxidation and building muscle.

Recap;
Glutamine and breakfast right when I wake up.
Eat every 3 hours - small meal or a shake.
Weight training 6 days a week
Light cardio 2 times a day every day except leg day.
Casein shake with Glutamine right when I go to bed.

The last 3-4 weeks I started limiting my carbs(oats/rice/beans) to in the earlier part of the day, and replacing them with veggies in the evening(broccoli, cauliflower, green beans)

That's everything I can think of off hand.

I don't know how much of what I did is "bro-science" but it worked for me.

This time around I am tweaking my supplements with a lot of what I've been reading from Austinite's write-ups in the stickies.
So far so good, having powerful days!

Best of luck,

Drew

[SEOINAGE]

Thanks for the write up. Do you have an average of your daily caloric intake or your macro break down? Even if you didn't count everything at least an estimate? I know with my training and dieting I had to select cardio that was easier to recover from, but I'm still doing intense stuff fairly short, but not nearly as frequent as you. I really want to add something like a bike to my garage gym, so I can easily do more cardio.

[DrewZ]

I would say I was 2200-2500 calories daily throughout. I tried to shoot for 40/40/20 Protein/Carb/Fat

Oh yeah, I forgot to add; The last 3-4 weeks I started limiting my carbs(oats/rice/beans) to in the earlier part of the day, and replacing them with veggies in the evening(broccoli, cauliflower, green beans)