Do I need steroids for these?

[JohnnyJim]

So here are my "relatively short term goals".



Squat (Olympic style), 455 pounds for 1 rep

Squat (Olympic style), 315 pounds for 30 reps (I want extreme endurance)

Power clean, 245 pounds for 10 reps



All of the above I wish to do at less than 240 pounds in bodyweight.



Realistic if natural?

Or you think I need to juice?

[swolehead]

age and stats that your at now

[Oki-Des]

If you are asking if anyone who lifts could possibly do that amount at 240 pounds without steroids , then yes it is totally possible. But, if you are asking us if you could do it, we need more information about you. For example what can you do now? And, how much time are you giving yourself to reach this goal?

[JohnnyJim]

Age: 23

Background: I powerlifted when I was 17 (205 pounds in bodyweight, lots of excess fat). Best "hip squat" was 405 pounds, best conventional deadlift was 455 pounds, and best bench press was 275 pounds. I did some Olympic lifting when I was 19 (190 pounds in bodyweight), but never competed. Best clean+jerk was 205 pounds and a 315 ATG front squat.

I achieved the 405 squat and the 455 deadlift in about 6 months worth of training, starting from novice to whatever level that was. I achieved the 205 jerk and 315 front squat after about 8 months of training, starting from being 170 pounds and not jerking over 135 pounds...



So there ya go...

And right now, I'm attempting 275 pounds one rep max for an Olympic squat after being a deconditioned person with a less than 225 pounds in squat. 5 weeks of training so far.

[JohnnyJim]

If you are asking if anyone who lifts could possibly do that amount at 240 pounds without steroids, then yes it is totally possible. But, if you are asking us if you could do it, we need more information about you. For example what can you do now? And, how much time are you giving yourself to reach this goal?

I would like to accomplish these naturally before my 30th birthday. I'm 23 right now.

[The Deadlifting Dog]

So here are my "relatively short term goals". Squat (Olympic style), 455 pounds for 1 rep Squat (Olympic style), 315 pounds for 30 reps (I want extreme endurance) Power clean, 245 pounds for 10 reps All of the above I wish to do at less than 240 pounds in bodyweight. Realistic if natural? Or you think I need to juice?

You don't need sauce for those lifts.

Although you do need your head examined. I have no idea why anyone would want to squat 315x30.

[JohnnyJim]

You don't need sauce for those lifts.

Although you do need your head examined. I have no idea why anyone would want to squat 315x30.

I figured that if I can squat that much for 30 reps, I should be able to put on a third of that weight in a backpack and go hiking 5 miles deep into the woods to go hunt for a grizzly bear with a bow and arrow. I'll have a .44 magnum by my side just in case. The endurance and speed will allow me to easily navigate the place with little exhaustion while still carrying lots of necessities in my backpack.

Of course, I need ridiculous upper-body strength if I'm gonna be able to pull an English longbow with a 200-pound draw weight.

[JohnnyJim]

Yes, I'm serious...

[Oki-Des]

Well, it seems like you have given yourself plenty of time to reach your goals. But, on a side note, I have always found that performing the tasks I am trying to accomplish by practicing those tasks work better than simply working out. If I were you, I would start with lower weights and do a lot of hiking to build up your cardio and stamina; instead of trying to simply lift weights. For example, I have tried to work out all of my muscle groups, but when I do something new, such as water skiing, I find myself sore the next day. It is basically because I am using muscles that apparently I was not hitting in the gym; even though I thought I was.
If you are going to be messing with grizzly bears, I would choose to be confident not only in the gym, but navigating the forest with the ability to man handle all my gear. I would spend more time hiking and practicing shooting the bow to reach your goals; whith some gym work on the side. I think practicing aiming with both the bow and gun should be your primary concerns! Ha ha.

[DawgHouse]

So here are my "relatively short term goals".

Squat (Olympic style), 455 pounds for 1 rep

Squat (Olympic style), 315 pounds for 30 reps (I want extreme endurance)

Power clean, 245 pounds for 10 reps

All of the above I wish to do at less than 240 pounds in bodyweight.

Realistic if natural?

Or you think I need to juice?

Absolutely not. Abbbbbbsolutely not. You can do all of this naturally even the 315 for 30 if u train in the correct manner.

If anyone tells you that you cannot do this without juice they are without a doubt incorrect.

I can attest to this from my personal experience, at age 21 natural I could hit a 510 lbs squat, never tried 245 for ten but I could max clean 355 and rep 315 for about 4 so I'm assuming I could train for 10 at 245, and even your 315 goal, I have went as high as 18 reps on 315 but I was never training for that kind of endurance so if that is what you train for consistently I am SURE u can do it.

By no means am I saying we are genetically the same, but at age 21 I was fluctuating between 186 and 190 lbs at 5'10.5 ... I was playing college football and I would say at that time I had been training about 7 years.

Your goal is from age 23-30 and in 7 years I am extremely confident with commitment u can train to be much stronger than I was. Especially if ur gonna weigh in at a body weight of 240, nearly 50lbs heavier than I was when I completed those lifts...

And FYI I'm on cycle right now and I couldn't go run up to a squat rack and knock out 18 reps like I did a couple years ago, but that's because I have completely changed my training style. And that's the most important thing u need to research is proper training for that. Another example is back when I was playing ball I could bench 225 for 24 reps... excellent numbers for a defensive back, right now on cycle I'm tapping out at between 16-18 because I have not been training that way.


Long story short you don't need them at all, and if ur goal is to reach those lifts by age 30 at 240lbs that's extremely feasible and don't even waste your time researching juice. Just research the training methods to get there! Good luck man

[JohnnyJim]

Well, it seems like you have given yourself plenty of time to reach your goals. But, on a side note, I have always found that performing the tasks I am trying to accomplish by practicing those tasks work better than simply working out. If I were you, I would start with lower weights and do a lot of hiking to build up your cardio and stamina; instead of trying to simply lift weights. For example, I have tried to work out all of my muscle groups, but when I do something new, such as water skiing, I find myself sore the next day. It is basically because I am using muscles that apparently I was not hitting in the gym; even though I thought I was.
If you are going to be messing with grizzly bears, I would choose to be confident not only in the gym, but navigating the forest with the ability to man handle all my gear. I would spend more time hiking and practicing shooting the bow to reach your goals; whith some gym work on the side. I think practicing aiming with both the bow and gun should be your primary concerns! Ha ha.

I did a search a while ago and ummm... Grizzly bears are endangered, which means they are probably illegal to kill.

... I guess I'm gonna have to settle with moose. lol

And yeah, definitely lots of practice with archery. I don't think I need to practice shooting my magnum AT ALL. I mean seriously, I'll only draw at if the bear gets within 20 feet of me. If I can aim an arrow, I can aim a gun, I think...

[JohnnyJim]

Absolutely not. Abbbbbbsolutely not. You can do all of this naturally even the 315 for 30 if u train in the correct manner.

If anyone tells you that you cannot do this without juice they are without a doubt incorrect.

I can attest to this from my personal experience, at age 21 natural I could hit a 510 lbs squat, never tried 245 for ten but I could max clean 355 and rep 315 for about 4 so I'm assuming I could train for 10 at 245, and even your 315 goal, I have went as high as 18 reps on 315 but I was never training for that kind of endurance so if that is what you train for consistently I am SURE u can do it.

By no means am I saying we are genetically the same, but at age 21 I was fluctuating between 186 and 190 lbs at 5'10.5 ... I was playing college football and I would say at that time I had been training about 7 years.

Your goal is from age 23-30 and in 7 years I am extremely confident with commitment u can train to be much stronger than I was. Especially if ur gonna weigh in at a body weight of 240, nearly 50lbs heavier than I was when I completed those lifts...

And FYI I'm on cycle right now and I couldn't go run up to a squat rack and knock out 18 reps like I did a couple years ago, but that's because I have completely changed my training style. And that's the most important thing u need to research is proper training for that. Another example is back when I was playing ball I could bench 225 for 24 reps... excellent numbers for a defensive back, right now on cycle I'm tapping out at between 16-18 because I have not been training that way.


Long story short you don't need them at all, and if ur goal is to reach those lifts by age 30 at 240lbs that's extremely feasible and don't even waste your time researching juice. Just research the training methods to get there! Good luck man

Thanks bro.

[qscgugcsq]

Possible maybe depending on genetic I know that for.me it would be impossible...

315 for 30 rep is extreme and if you are able to do it you will probably hit 500 for a 1rep pretty easy IMO...

Like said above i might be possible with yesrs of training with appropriate genetics.

If you can do it natty. If you arent already at 80% of your goal after 3 years of appropriate training chance are very slim that you will ever get there...

And reaching aroung 220-240 natty is pretty hard(depending on your height) if fairly lean...

Possible or not this isnt the question.

The real question is do you want it bad enough that if you need to use gear, youll use.

IMHO 455 squat can be achieved natty by lots of people but 315 for 30... this require excellent genetic. Without considering the rest...

Or you try natty with the possibility to never reach it or you start using gear while still not knowing if youll ever reach it but you are way more likely to do so.

As you wish

[JohnnyJim]

Possible maybe depending on genetic I know that for.me it would be impossible...

315 for 30 rep is extreme and if you are able to do it you will probably hit 500 for a 1rep pretty easy IMO...

Like said above i might be possible with yesrs of training with appropriate genetics.

If you can do it natty. If you arent already at 80% of your goal after 3 years of appropriate training chance are very slim that you will ever get there...

And reaching aroung 220-240 natty is pretty hard(depending on your height) if fairly lean...

Possible or not this isnt the question.

The real question is do you want it bad enough that if you need to use gear, youll use.

IMHO 455 squat can be achieved natty by lots of people but 315 for 30... this require excellent genetic. Without considering the rest...

Or you try natty with the possibility to never reach it or you start using gear while still not knowing if youll ever reach it but you are way more likely to do so.

As you wish

You do make a compelling case.

I'll see where I am at age 26.

[jstone]

If you go hunting grizzly which is legal in alaska IIRC. Your going to want a back up person with you carrying a 12g with Brenekke slugs, or something like 300/338 win mag with a tough expanding bullet or a sollid. Like the trophy bonded bear claw, barnes tsx, or a solid copper flat point.

with the speed that a grizzly has if you let it within 20 ft your likely not leaving the woods. 44mag can get the job done, but if the bear is within 20ft it is more than likely charging you. Stopping a bear mid charge with a 44 mag is not likely.

Especially if your bow hunting make sure you have a back up. Your goals are achievable with just hard work and nutrition. I dont know as much as a lot of these guys when it comes to gear, diet, and body building. One thing I do know is hunting, shooting, and ballistics.

Grizzly bear is the most demanding hunt in north America. Rarely do you see anyone hunting grizzly alone, even if they are rifle hunting. Your better off drawing the bow, and practicing shooting. Making a shot at the range is one thing. Making the shot while one of the largest predators in north America is charging you is a different story. The only place I know in theUS that you can hunt grizzly is alaska, and last time I looked into hunting alaska you have to have a liscensed guide.

You dont get ready for a hunt with olympic lifts. You need to get out hike, and shoot. There are plenty of power lifters that can accomplish those lifts, but when you put weight on there back at altitude there not going to make it long.

edit: the 44mag is a good back up. If you reload get some heavy hard cast lead wadcutters, and load them with a stout charge of win 296/h110. With the pistol you want as much penetration as you can get. Just remember with 44 mag follow up shots are not as fast as something like 10mm, so first shot has to count. I know a couple guys that hunt in alaska, and they carry 10mm, 460 Rowland, 45 super, and a couple other semis that put them in 357mag to 41mag power range. This gives them decent power with faster follow up shots.

[tectime]

.500 s&w that's the only back up handgun I'd trust for grizzly. .44 is great but it big brother .500 is another beast.

[mackbutter]

totally possible . I had to throw a lotta meals at it though.
I was about 27 , no juice. Lots high calorie meals, creatine and protein supps.
I pulled a 550 deadlift, 315 stiff-legged deads for 7 reps, 405 squat single and 315 squats for 15 and 130 lbs incline dumbbells for 7 reps.
Not earthshattering lifts but I was impressed cuz I only weighed 170lbs....so...70lbs less than u.

[jackfrost88]

Without a doubt possible. Plenty of people at my powerlifting gym able to squat 455 at well under 240lbs, some even 170ish. Now getting to 240lbs and looking aesthetic naturally, that's another thing. Unless of course your 6'8 or something then disregard my comment.

Maybe just set those goals (the 315 for 30 reps is a bit ridiculous if you ask me) at whatever weight you can put them up at.

Training intensity, style and diet is more important than than the roids so start there bro