Junior Member
I'm 27, and decided I want to stay on, I've never been so happy an able to enjoy as when I'm on, so I've come to the conclusion I want to keep it that way.... Question is .. Is it really that bad to your health? Wouldn't pct be more damaging ? Anybody have experience and could shed some light ??? I've already got 3 kids and not intending to have more
Knowledgeable Member
Yeah why not I mean life is over after 30 anyways right? Ok maybe 40.
Wow if the happiest you have ever been is when on then you really dont have much of a life do you? Why not go out and try living a little before deciding do throw it away?
Really stupid idea wanting to cruise at your age. How about going into the HRT section and ask anyone if they would choose to be on HRT if they had a choice not to and have normal testosterone levers.
While you are at it since some body builders use insulin why not decide to become a diabetic while you are at it so you can be on insulin all the time?
Junior Member
Throw it all away ??? What do you mean by that is this a steroid or heroin forum ??? You know nothing of my life hero , If you don't understand shut ya mouth was after advice not a cop out
Knowledgeable Member
It's a forum of how to properly use steroids, training, diet and focus on health. What you are planning on doing is not use but abuse so it may as well be in the same category as heroin because what you plan makes just about as much sense.
YOU have no idea about life period or you would not be considering cruising. You not willing to listen to anything or reason is the only cop out going on. Lets see who agrees with you and who agrees with me shall we?
FYI throwing it away was referring to your life/future. You can still decide to use the gear responsibly.
Associate Member
I think the question the op was asking was what's the point in running pct if you plan on running another cycle in few mths anyway?I mean he will cruise on a trt dose of test which is fine the blast again when bloodwork dictates it which is theory is no big deal either,many will argue unless your making money of your physique don't do it but if the decision is made to pin for the rest of your life then it's made,pretty certain most people who use steriods have tought about this?!so it's a valid question I think with the only real issue of pinning for the rest of your life.that's just my opinion tho
Junior Member
Exactly mark , chears mate .. Hit the nail on the head .. why go through the depression from the hormone drop afterwards when it may not be much of a risk running a trt cruise ? And a lot of people never fully recover yeah ?? And I have heard doctors say it can be safer just to stay on (within reason) .. I've had mates nearly go blind from clomid ... With everything I've heard and seen , it's sounding better to just stay on ?? But then again I may be wrong? That's why I'm asking ,, id love to hear from people who are currently blastin and cruising and hear their experience
Associate Member
At the end of the day it's self administration of trt,it's your decision to make,most here will say no but educate yourself and go from there,I believe it can be done safely with regular bloodwork just like trt guys do with no issues..
Knowledgeable Member
That's where I disagree especially seeing it pretty much day in and day out for many years. Most do NOT think it out. Yeah they say they do but they think it out about as much as a 6yr old who just HAS to have that toy at the story and not long after it's forgotten or something more important comes up soon after.Originally Posted by mark woods
Life is funny how most every time we are sure what direction we are going it will spin you around on a 180.
Deciding at 27 you are going to cruise on TRT dose between cycles is FOOLISH, not other way to really put it.
Let say you live to the ripe old age of only 80. That means you will need to pin bare minimum 2763 pins of testosterone at HRT levels not counting cycle.
Now lets say you want to have kids some day and not have balls like a 10yr old. You will need to add HCG and thats typically 3x a week so that's another 8290 pins
Oh and there is always the problem of finding a doctor who will give you a rx for either the test or HCG but of course there is always UGL, unless the one you decide to use stops supplying but we all know that never happens now does it?
Hmm and then there is the cost. Well you can figure that out but do you have some kind of guarantee you will always have the extra cash? I mean sure if you have a trust fund or will take over the family business maybe but most people change jobs or careers about every 5 years now.
Then there is also the fact that they are coming down harder and harder on steroids users and you are talking about getting lucky for the next 53+ years ordering online or whatever and if you do get caught I dont think they will be supplying you hrt in prison since it was not scripted.
Let see so at any time you end up running out then you are LOW T, depression, loss of gains and xyz.
Of course there is also and AI that will be needed at all times even on HRT more than likely.
I'm sure I'm leaving out a few things but hopefully (probably not) you get the point. People like to say they have thought it out but 99.99% of the time they have not even thought past next week.
Knowledgeable Member
Wow no issue? I take you you have never spent any time over there. lol I think if there were no issue there would not be 1000s of post with multiple pages per thread. You are really speaking out of your ass also not thinking anything through. The OP is not the only one who needs to do some reading and self educating.
I call BS. No doctor or at least not a legally certified doctor in the US would say that. You have hear a friend of a friends 2nd cousin say this maybe.
Associate Member
You make a few points which I agree with and still stand by mine....its upto to the person to decide for themselves either way it's enlightening!
Knowledgeable Member
I agree with lovbyts 1000%. I'm on TRT and it's a MAJOR PAIN IN THE ASS. Always remember to pin twice a week, take 3 shots of HCG per week, Anastrole, and get bloodwork several times per year. Oh, and you also need to donate blood to keep your Hematocrit levels at a safe level. It's very expensive in most cases and whenever you go on vacation it seriously complicates things. You need to make sure you get a hotel with a fridge so you can store your HCG so it doesn't go bad etc etc etc. You might feel great when you're on a cycle but your body will get used to it and you will level off. Going from a blast back to a TRT dosage still sucks the life out of you. When you drop back down you still go thru the same downs that you do during PCT. I would love not to be on TRT and have normal test levels again but that's not going to happen.
Associate Member
And let's no forget if you reach 80 you will be the biggest leanest 80yr old around?!?!
Knowledgeable Member
Yeah sure you will. lol There are a LOT of people on trt at 80 and 95% of them are NOT big, muscular and only just maintaining.
Like I said, you never know what life will throw at you and for most people it's never what you think it will be.
I'm in OK shape, better than most people my age but not huge by any means. I still plan on gaining more size and leaning out by getting in the gym 5x a week asap but life does not always work out as planned. I'm 52. Ive got a daughter who is 21 and another one who is 9. I am on wife #3. #1 and #2 are both deceased. I have had 2 back surgeries. L3 & L4 2005 and L5/S1 2007 and extensive shoulder surgery repair 2011. 11 surgeries on my right eye and the list goes on...
Do you think any of that was in the game plan? No not everyone will have all that but I can guarantee it will not go as planned. It's always best to have a fall back plan and be more conservative or should I say realistic.
Associate Member
I agree fella most stuff in life never does I'm no spring chicken myself 36 2 kids and with same women all my adult life,it's an interesting topic that is always flat out NO DON'T DO IT but I'm certain everyone who uses hormones has tought about it and many have..
HRT Specialist ~ AR-Platinum Elite-Hall of Famer ~ No Source Checks
So what you're really saying here is that you don't want to risk losing anything you've gained, right?
You made a reference to heroin and you're correct, but to people with addictive personalities it's still a risk.
Don't drug addicts say "they've never been so happy" as when they're on?
Are there any other internal working parts of your body you're willing to shut down permanently for vanities sake?
I know no one on TRT who would not rather have their own HPTA up and running normally.
TRT is not to be taken lightly nor should it be self administered, unless your knowledge level is close to on par with a doctor....
-*- NO SOURCE CHECKS -*-
VET
Believe me, running a blast when you've not had any of your natural levels tested can and will be very dangerous on your health! I don't have normal T levels and am in the process of seeing a HRT specialist!
However I would RATHER have normal T levels! I absolutely agree 100% w/Kel, LB/Pistol! Run a poll in the HRT section and I guarantee you everyone of them(including me) will tell you the same!
Your life will surely throw you a curveball just when you've think you've nailed this! It surely has happened more than once in my experience!
Really think about this! This can and will affect your life in many ways! We treat everyone the same regarding safe advice! And if you have no intention on going through a doc, I know you could have much trouble on your hands!
I strongly urge you to run a proper pct and then if things aren't so good w/your levels then see a doc! GL!
Knowledgeable Member
I started trt at 28. It was from prescription drugs that caused my body to almost completely shut down testosterone production. I needed to be on said drugs for a few more years, after finding the low test levels. My TT level was 89 on laborp's scale. Which I beleive is 348-1198. This is at one year older than you are now. Trt was great to make me feel normal again, but I would love to have my natural levels be normal. Blasting and cruising is dumb unless you have a chance to make a living from your body, or your already on trt.
Young people now are to self absorbed. Your willing to risk long term health to keep some gains. Your 27, and have 3 children. You can not take risks with your health, that could possibly leave your children without a dad. Trt is monitored regularly to ensure the patient stays healthy. Hkw often are you going to do bloodwork? Can you read said bloodwork?
All the people I see that say they blast and cruise dont. They blast, and super blast. When on trt the goal is to use as little test as possible to keep you at the top end of the range. I see people your age saying there cruising on 500mg of test a week, because on a typical trt dose they were loosing there gains.
Why ask for advice when you already know what your going to do? When told by knowledgeable members its not a good idea, you still try to justify it. Thats not asking for advice. I notice this the most with people 18- late 20s. You guys are not looking for advice, your looking for someone to tell you to go for it.
Knowledgeable Member
Where did the sixx go? Come on, I told/warned it that you would not get the response (bar 1) you were looking for. That being said it doesnt mean to just ignore everyone and go away. Stay, listen and learn and take it one step at a time. Who knows, it may still be what you decide to do in the future but it should not be done without a LOT of consideration over time and a little experimentation doing a few or several basics cycles first. Who knows, you may decide that your results are plenty good once you start doing cycles correctly with more education and putting a lot more work/emphasis into diet.
Most gains are lost from inadequate diet and training, not gear. People tend to really focus on training and diet, while on cycle and as soon as it's over they let it all slip or drop it completely. If you focus more on diet and training you will more than likely find you keep a lot more of your gains as well as gaining a lot more on and off cycle.
Associate Member
for all the bodybuilders/guys out there that has ben on blast/cruise for so many years do when they get elderly? that just dawned on me. what the hell happens do they come off?
Junior Member
Still here just taking it all in..., after reading it all I think I'm going to go a pct, and if that doesn't work, I'll get back on, problem is I'm about 25 weeks in ... I was on 200mgtest e (for 22weeks)+ dbol 10mg-20mg for first 6 weeks ..,, and the last 5 weeks I'm on 500mg test e + 10mg dbol ... Because of this I'm sketchy as on the pct ,, my past has been extremely sketchy , and since this cycle I've changed my whole life around, I hate to say this but I suffered trauma and depression .. But now I feel it's gone , I'm able to finally enjoy life and live like a normal person haha... I don't want to sound like I'm justifying or anything , It's just if you's were in the position I am you's would be thinking the same.., it's like either pick happiness and enjoy my life , or go through the whole downs again and be a man and take it on the chin when I don't really have too ? I understand that it sounds stupid but im not a stupid person and have weighed all this up, but when it comes to this predicament it's extremely hard ... Also I'm looking at my mates that have been on for 15 years strait, and there bloods are coming up fine , few little things are a bit high but not any harmful levels ... And they have no regrets ?
Junior Member
And someone said they're on hrt pinning twice a week... I thought its once a week/fortnight??
Knowledgeable Member
You can try a standard PCT and just extend it 2 weeks.
Clomid 75/75/50/50/50/50
Nolva 40/40/20/20/20/20
Yes a lot of people are pinning test 2x a week now to help reduce E2 spikes. It seems to help with most people but a small amount of AI is still needed for a lot of people. A lot about HRT has changed over the last couple of years just like no long ago no one used HCG. It's a LOT more complicated than just pinning some test once a week. It always sounds good and easy until you actually have to start doing it. Typically it take 1 - 2 years for people to even get there HRT dialed in so they feel normal.
A lot of people think that more is better and try to keep their test levels at or near the top but after extended time most everyone starts to feel like crap and of course some people try to use more to combat it but it makes it worse. No it's not just estrogen related. It seems keeping your levels to high to long just has an adverse effect on your body after time and the only solution is to drop your hrt down to mid or lower hrt levels. A lot of people feel much better long term with mid or below levels.
This is why it's good to only cycle and let your body recover naturally if at all possible and go with the rule time on = time off. 12 week cycle would be 18 weeks off. 12 weeks cycle + 2 weeks wait time before PCT and then 4 weeks PCT.
If you are doing cycle or hrt blood work is always critical. Doing HRT alone it's best to have blood work at least 2x a year, full hormone panel with Sensitive E2 and free Testosterone as well as several other.
This and a lot other stuff we have not even talked about yet is why I jumped on you and said No you have no thought it through. I understand and have been there also. You think you know what is at risk and what you need to do until you actually start to do it and then once you really find out it could be to late. A lot of people end up never being able to cycle again and after battling side effects, health issues they are happy just to be or feel normal again and the days of lifting and getting big are forgotten.
if you search you can find 1000s of post from people having problems and looking for help. 99% never come back or get back into the game of lifting again after or if they get straighten out.
Sorry if I seemed like I was being a dick but it's what we call Tough love around here and try to help people not make the same mistakes as many many many before you.
You wont find many if any other forums like this one because 95% of them are more concerned about pushing product or being a source board. Your lucky you stumbled onto this on.
Last edited by lovbyts; 05-20-2015 at 02:27 AM.
Junior Member
All good , and yeh I do understand , last few days I've been weighing the pros and cons .., is there anyone out there that doesn't mind hrt??? It's just as I said , I've been that low before that'd id pay any amount and put up with anything (pinning twice a week) just to feel this good .. As I said I've never felt so in control and happy as of lately (even on small doses) ... But yeah will try pct to see how I go but if I come crashing down im gonna get back an stay on regardless,, it's just human nature to want to feel this good .,, and being that low i think is way more bad on health etc than hrt ... Time will tell
Knowledgeable Member
Most people dont mind HRT because the consequences without suck and can be debilitating. The question is asked all the time if anyone would choose to be on HRT vs having a normal healthy test level and you would be hard pressed to find anyone who would say hes except for someone very young and new to it who decided to go on like you were thinking of doing. Ask them again after being on for a few years and most likely you will get a different answer. You can go here and give a shout out and ask for yourself.
Hormone Replacement Therapy - Low Testosterone Treatment, Anti-Aging
You can also ask about the euphoria feeling. Guess what, it goes away and no matter how much you use after a while you just feel normal, no more high/GOOD feeling. It's not much different than drug users, after a while they are just chasing the high trying to get that feeling back. Thats another reason to cycle so you can keep getting that feeling vs trying to feel normal and not bad/sick if you screw things up or your body chemistry changes.
With proper diet and training there is not reason to come crashing down as you put it. Usually that is because people just quit training and diet and dont try to re adjust their pct if needed.
Another way to look at the feeling good part is this, did you ever watch smallville or superman? Did Clark walk around like he felt GREAT most of the time? No, it was just normal for him right? Even if you had everything dialed in perfect 24/7 eventually you would just feel normal. Good normal but normal. Again though, pretty much anyone who tries to stay at HIGH levels crash and take a few months to recover, if they are lucky.
Last edited by lovbyts; 05-20-2015 at 04:39 AM.
Junior Member
Sorry I've got 1 quick question, when u said pin HCG 3 times a week when on TRT I'm a little confused, what's the total does for all 3 pins?
I'm asking coz my doctor only told me to pin twice a week at 250iu each pin, is she wrong?
Knowledgeable Member
No, I think I misspoke and most do it 2x a week. Yes you could do three but then also have to cut back on the mg and who really wants to pin more if they don't need to.
Associate Member
I feel where you're coming from. I followed a very set plan for my first cycle. It felt amazing and the temptation for me to "just go a couple more weeks" was huge. It was something I was not prepared for. Then the feeling of loss when you go off and try to tell yourself that is only a couple weeks until you get back to normal. That was surprising to me and something I wasn't ready for.
I understand your questioning/desire to go on trt. I think everyone has thought about it in a theoretical sense. My only advice is remember that the side effects are not only sexual (they are really down the list ). Your heart/circulatory health can be greatly impacted before you realize it.
*I have a buddy that was on forfar too long and ended up with some pretty serious and scary complications.
Junior Member
What do you mean sexual side effects ? Small balls ? Haha I don't really care bout that,, makes ya cock look bigger anyway ... And what happened with your mate? Was he on mega doses ? Is he all good now?
Junior Member
Also if I was too blast cruise.. I'd never go overboard ... 500mg test e max .. Down to 200mg for cruise ... Maybe add another compound but also at small dose , never run more than 3 at a time
Junior Member
Also how long were you shut down for ? How long on average are people shut down for ??
HRT Specialist ~ AR-Platinum Elite-Hall of Famer ~ No Source Checks
First, the majority of people do not blast and cruise for years. When your natural production of testosterone drops to sub-optimal levels you find a good doctor and begin a TRT protocol.
-*- NO SOURCE CHECKS -*-
HRT Specialist ~ AR-Platinum Elite-Hall of Famer ~ No Source Checks
Consider running a pct and then getting full BW as in the Finding A Doc sticky thread in the HRT Forum. Then evaluate it with an astute doctor. Maybe there's something going on that's holding your endogenous T levels down a bit that could be corrected. May make a world of difference for you.
-*- NO SOURCE CHECKS -*-
Knowledgeable Member
LOL, I'm quite sure he is talking about ED. Most people dont worry to much (they should) about shrunken balls but a LOT of people end up with ED, erectile dysfunction, limp dick. Thats a very common side effect of high E2, low E2 or just hormone imbalance. No you dont hear guys in the gym talking about that but most all of them doing long cycles have experienced it temporarily or longer.
Junior Member
Yeahh heaps of wiked advice ... Not looking forward to a pct at all
Associate Member
Good luck with whatever happens!
Knowledgeable Member
He's thinking now and listening so thats a good thing and there is still hope.
PCT might go fine so dont worry until there is a problem, just make sure to plan it out properly and focus on training and diet. If you freak out and stop training then things will go bad.
Junior Member
Chears , nah won't stop training or eating ,, always trying to push myself in all areas
Associate Member
Exactly. It's not always easy to keep E2 in balance. It seems like if you're not doing frequent BW it can easily get out of whack. You can't always tell even if it's too high or too low (or if it's something else) by feel. ED isn't much fun and the fox isn't always obvious.
My buddy was on a moderate dose, 500mg to 750mg total (test and other) for too long. When he came clean to his dr, his blood was too thick and his blood pressure was dangerously high (like could die). His blood lipids were really messed up and I'm sure they're was more issues as well. It took a while, lots of Dr visit's and med to get it mostly straightened out.
This thread seems about done, but up just add that it was a good lesson for me. Test is a powerful hormone, and not only in the gym.
Neurologically Intact
Do your own research
You're already trying to take the step of taking shots pretty much for life
There's a lot to learn if you're looking into staying "on"
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