Planning My First Cycle!!!

[Nick4551]

Hello everyone! I'm new to the forums, I'm 19 years old, I have done 2 prohomones stacks recently. First stack was 10mg Trenavar, 15mg Hexadrone, 4.5mg Methlystenbolone, 25mg Max LMG Daily. Second stack was 20mg Trenavar, 15mg Epistane, 100mg Hexadrone Daily. I went from 170lbs to now 205lbs at 12.5% BF. Now I'm looking to do a more serious stack, I was thinking and doing some research and came up with this, please feel free to criticize and suggest different doses/alternatives/options. I love getting advice and could use it!


Testosterone Propionate
Week 1-8 : 300mg/week

DBOL
Week 1-6 : 30-50mg/day

AI - Arimidex
Week 1-6 : 0.5mg/day

Week 9-10 OFF!!!

PCT - Nolvadex
-Week 11: 40mg/ED
-Week 12: 40mg/ED
-Week 13: 20mg/ED
-Week 14: 20mg/ED

[Back In Black]

http://forums.steroid.com/anabolic-s...ffect-you.html

Welcome & Read this^^

You have already caused yourself potential permanent damage, no need to add to that.

Visit our diet and workout sections for some advice to get the results you want.

Good luck.

[Nick4551]

read that post, so I'm a little confused...what exactly are you trying to say here..lol

[CharlesThe4th]

read that post, so I'm a little confused...what exactly are you trying to say here..lol

He is saying you are too young. You will not get advice here other than hold off on cycling until you are atleast 23-25 years old. Your risking a lot cycling at a young age, life long risks. Hold off young grasshopper.

Example: Scroll down this section until you see the thread 20 year old still no wood or libido. This is what can happen. You want a limp ass d!ck the rest of your life?

[Nick4551]

well I appreciate your honesty and opinion but I'm very hard headed and I'm going to start cycling anyway, I'm only a few years off your recommendated age, but anyway I plan on cycling anyway once I'm done my PCT from my PH, so with you guys knowing that I'm going to cycle regardless I could definitely use advice and opinions on the cycle I have laid out and anything else I'm missing in my cycle but I really do appreciate the honesty and concern

[Back In Black]

well I appreciate your honesty and opinion but I'm very hard headed and I'm going to start cycling anyway, I'm only a few years off your recommendated age, but anyway I plan on cycling anyway once I'm done my PCT from my PH, so with you guys knowing that I'm going to cycle regardless I could definitely use advice and opinions on the cycle I have laid out and anything else I'm missing in my cycle but I really do appreciate the honesty and concern

You are 6 years off an age recommended here. And if you think you should start cycling as soon as you finish PCT you have a lot to learn. You will shut your natural test down for a long time making recovery exceptionally hard, not to mention the potential damage you will cause in your HPTA development.

The best advice is the advice you have, don't cycle and fix your diet and workouts.

Out of interest can you post a photo so we can see your level of development so we can best advise you?

[Blaz Kavlic]

A nolva only PCT 2 weeks after your last pin of test P? You got a lot more learning to do young fella.

[Nick4551]

picture is posted and yeah its hard to get good answers on pcts, it's like when I'm looking stuff up its just people running circles with their words and can't find an exact answer, what else should I use in a pct with nolvadex?

[Back In Black]

picture is posted and yeah its hard to get good answers on pcts, it's like when I'm looking stuff up its just people running circles with their words and can't find an exact answer, what else should I use in a pct with nolvadex?

Where did you post your pic?

[Nick4551]

and this is why I'm here, to learn and get all the knowledge on what to use during and after my cycle and make sure the doses are correct, any help is appreciated!

[Nick4551]

I just read that I could be taking up to 600mg/week of test p and that for my pct it should start 3 days after my last pin and it should consist of nolvadex and clomid, sound right? any opinions on that?

[marcus300]

There isn't an exact age were we all stop developing and growing because this is determined by our genes and DNA, we are all genetically programmed individually and we inherit our genes from our parents. To give an exact age we stop growing would be incorrect because everyone's genetic blueprint is different.The main development of our bodies is up to the age of 21yrs of age but this can vary between individuals. There are parts of our bodies what carry on developing and adjusting slowly up until the age of 25yrs old, an example of this is the brain. The Endocrine system is a part of the brain what is very complex and keeps our bodies in a homeostasis state. Our testosterone levels start raising and roughly peak around 25yrs old and then start to slowly decline, so even though some of us may have stopped growing at the age of 21yrs old, others may still be developing up until the age of 25yrs old.

I have recently spoken to my Endo regarding this matter and he tells me that the HPTA is very sensitive and as many pathways how it regulates the human body, he states steroids disrupt the normal balance of hormones in the body which can cause reversible and irreversible changes at any age but risks are far more if you administrate exogenous androgens during development, this will put you in a very unnatural environment at a crucial time and your hormones should be treated with care especially in the early stages of maturity. The adverse effects can be erratic behaviour of the HPTA and potentially therapy when your older.

I did ask him what age he would think would be the safest as far as risk to damages and he said many endocrinologist suggest full maturation is reached by 25 years of age and this would also give the HPTA time to be established with your natural hormone balance and patterns. I personally feel 24-25yrs old would also be ideal starting point to get bloodwrok drawn to see exact what your natural levels are before starting any kind of cycles and waiting till you have reach your testosterone peak would be a good starting point, for me there is to much evidence over the forums and what I've seen personally over the last 25yrs I've been bodybuilding. Obviously it isn't going to be all 19- 21yr old bodybuilders who suffer side effects what are irreversible but I am edging on the side of caution what age I advice to the newbies.
Marcus

[davidtheman100]

205 lbs 12% bf? If you're under 6 feet i'm gonna call bullshit

[Nick4551]

good post marcus, thanks for the advice and knowledge, still like I said before I'm going to cycle regardless, there's always a few dumb hard headed teens like me, I already started messing my body up with prohormones so it's not that big of a deal to me, I just want opinions and suggestions on the stack I have planned and laid out

[marcus300]

good post marcus, thanks for the advice and knowledge, still like I said before I'm going to cycle regardless, there's always a few dumb hard headed teens like me, I already started messing my body up with prohormones so it's not that big of a deal to me, I just want opinions and suggestions on the stack I have planned and laid out

You should listen to people who know because your plan isn't the best option at your age. How will you feel when you can't get a hard on and all your gains go because of low test. If you can't reach your goal at your age without steroids then you really need work on your training and diet.

I've looked at your picture and I'll be honest you don't look like you train. Your nowhere near steroids no matter what age. Build a base and learn how to do it naturally then you'll have something special when you do start cycling.

You really need to listen to people who know and not what you think is right. After all your here asking the experts

[thisAngelBites]

there's always a few dumb hard headed teens like me, I already started messing my body up with prohormones so it's not that big of a deal to me,

You sound like a nice kid, whereas a lot of people throw their toys and cry when we don't help them.

I wonder how you are smart enough to know that this is a dumb, hard headed attitude, but not care about making childish choices.

The world needs less dumb, hard headed teens who think they are grown up, but make decisions like children. Discounting the future (thinking that any problems are too far away such that they are not worth bothering about) is a bad mistake - to which many older men here who took that path can attest.

It's not the case that you are a dumb, hard headed teen. You are choosing to be a dumb, hard-headed teen. It's as simple as making a better choice.

[Nick4551]

I posted the pic as my profile picture, I can't see it on the app but I can o the actual website, and I'm 6'1 205lbs 12.5%BF, lol

[Nick4551]

[Mr.BB]

Do you swim a lot?

looks like you do

[thisAngelBites]

I just heard an interesting discussion by a neurosurgeon (not about testosterone) in which he claimed that the brain does not stop maturing until about 25. Just interesting to have yet another input backing up this thinking (and of course the many posts we see from young men who have lost libido and wood due to steroids).

[Nick4551]

haha damm, Marcus straight flaming me saying I don't train lol, I lift 5 days a week, some times 6 days, I have been for the past 2 years training hard, I may not diet the best but I diet decent, idk why but I always had a hard time gaining muscle, I take preworkout before, used to use creatine but stopped, I drink protein shakes everyday after the gym, I eat decent I would say, and about 6 meals a day, my buddy is a trainer, he says I'm doing it all right and I know I am, idk why but I really have a hard time gaining muscle which is why I did prohormones and which is why I'm going to cycle steroids, I used to be a lot smaller, I used to be like 150 lbs, now that I'm up to 205 at 12%BF I feel pretty good, I don't think I'm big at all but definitely came a long way, I need to start taking test regardless, I just don't gain muscle well at all

[marcus300]

haha damm, Marcus straight flaming me saying I don't train lol, I lift 5 days a week, some times 6 days, I have been for the past 2 years training hard, I may not diet the best but I diet decent, idk why but I always had a hard time gaining muscle, I take preworkout before, used to use creatine but stopped, I drink protein shakes everyday after the gym, I eat decent I would say, and about 6 meals a day, my buddy is a trainer, he says I'm doing it all right and I know I am, idk why but I really have a hard time gaining muscle which is why I did prohormones and which is why I'm going to cycle steroids, I used to be a lot smaller, I used to be like 150 lbs, now that I'm up to 205 at 12%BF I feel pretty good, I don't think I'm big at all but definitely came a long way, I need to start taking test regardless, I just don't gain muscle well at all

No Nick I wasn't flaming you I was telling you the truth which is hard to swallow from your side. Your inexperience is shinning through now, why do you think its hard for you to gain muscle tissue? what do you think will happen once you stop taking steroids? you are building a house on no foundation and if you cant gain muscle at your age with your high testosterone naturally then you have zero chance of ever maintaining any muscle gained from steroids, your going to end up staying on cycle to keep gains and your going to experience some serious sides.

I don't really want to waste my time writing to someone who isn't going to listen so I will leave you to your cycle but I could make you gain far more than any cycle steroid cycle and keep all the gains. Yes that does sound cocky doesn't it but its the truth and once you discover how to do this it will be to late.

Just think about it, your here on the biggest steroid site on the internet with the best knowledge asking guys what you should do. Guys who have been cycling longer than you have been alive and when you hear their advice you disregard it and do what you was going to do anyway. You ask experts what you should do and you don't listen. Its like we are wasting our time and effort but I guess we must try because some younger newbs do listen and end up being serious monster..

Best of luck you'll need it

[boisebeast]

No Nick I wasn't flaming you I was telling you the truth which is hard to swallow from your side. Your inexperience is shinning through now, why do you think its hard for you to gain muscle tissue? what do you think will happen once you stop taking steroids? you are building a house on no foundation and if you cant gain muscle at your age with your high testosterone naturally then you have zero chance of ever maintaining any muscle gained from steroids, your going to end up staying on cycle to keep gains and your going to experience some serious sides. I don't really want to waste my time writing to someone who isn't going to listen so I will leave you to your cycle but I could make you gain far more than any cycle steroid cycle and keep all the gains. Yes that does sound cocky doesn't it but its the truth and once you discover how to do this it will be to late. Just think about it, your here on the biggest steroid site on the internet with the best knowledge asking guys what you should do. Guys who have been cycling longer than you have been alive and when you hear their advice you disregard it and do what you was going to do anyway. You ask experts what you should do and you don't listen. Its like we are wasting our time and effort but I guess we must try because some younger newbs do listen and end up being serious monster.. Best of luck you'll need it

Amen. Marcus is one of the most knowledgeable members on the board and just like everyone else, we just want to keep you safe. Sometimes it may be really frustrating or seem like overkill but you have no idea of some of the horror stories we get on here from new guys who think they know better than the vets... Good luck in making the right choice

[Back In Black]

You're not 12.5% buddy. Nowhere near.

Regardless we aren't going to advise you how to fvck yourself up further. Listen to the advice given and follow it. Take note that not one person has suggested you run any kind of cycle, what do you think that suggests?

[davidtheman100]

You're not 12.5% buddy. Nowhere near.

Regardless we aren't going to advise you how to fvck yourself up further. Listen to the advice given and follow it. Take note that not one person has suggested you run any kind of cycle, what do you think that suggests?

Agreed you would be alot tighter at 12% than you are now and you don't have any lines showing which would be starting to come in around that BF percentage depending on where you hold most of your fat i'd say to say you're 15% would be very kind in your picture and at that bodyweight 15% is not impressive or shows anyone that you're ready

[pitweiler]

If your having a hard time gaining muscle then there's something wrong with your diet , training or both. You say that your diet is decent I think that it could be better. Why not try having a strict diet and workout regimen and see what kind of results that you get. Taking steroids isn't magic. You may gain some muscle while on a cycle but if your diet isn't on point. Your going to loose your gains. I'd at least tighten up your diet first and see what kind of results you get

[Nick4551]

well according to my guy that's a trainer, his BF caliper says I'm 12.5% but okay I guess I'm 15????? lol I'm running the cycle regardless, I'll let ya guys know how it works out, thanks for the help👌👌

[Back In Black]

well according to my guy that's a trainer, his BF caliper says I'm 12.5% but okay I guess I'm 15????? lol I'm running the cycle regardless, I'll let ya guys know how it works out, thanks for the help����

Probably 18%.

Good luck.

[davidtheman100]

well according to my guy that's a trainer, his BF caliper says I'm 12.5% but okay I guess I'm 15????? lol I'm running the cycle regardless, I'll let ya guys know how it works out, thanks for the help����

also realize that this is the nicest board around...If you posted a pic like that on gb or something you'd be putting a red marker on your forehead

[Nick4551]

nah don't really swim a lot, was getting a new bathing suit because I was going down the beach lol, and I agree this is a nice board, wasn't any ball busters and I'm not calling any of you guys a-holes or anything, I honestly don't care what people think, I know how to read a scale, it says 205, I know my height is 6'1 and I know my friends BF caliper said 12.5 % but if yous think that's wrong maybe it is, all I know is what the caliper said, I appreciate everyone's good luck and recommendations of not doing the cycle but I'm going to anyway, I got decent gains off prohormones so I wanna step it up to the next level

[uhit]

nah don't really swim a lot, was getting a new bathing suit because I was going down the beach lol, and I agree this is a nice board, wasn't any ball busters and I'm not calling any of you guys a-holes or anything, I honestly don't care what people think, I know how to read a scale, it says 205, I know my height is 6'1 and I know my friends BF caliper said 12.5 % but if yous think that's wrong maybe it is, all I know is what the caliper said, I appreciate everyone's good luck and recommendations of not doing the cycle but I'm going to anyway, I got decent gains off prohormones so I wanna step it up to the next level

Wish you all the best and look forward to the 'gains' you will make

Also, can you get bloodwork before you start and then 6-8 weeks post pct bloodwork? It would be benefit alot of people to see if your hormones recovered or not after the cycle.

[Nick4551]

absolutely, I'm on my pct from my prohormone now, once it is finished in about 3 weeks I will get blood work done, it's probably still going to be out of whack, I got my blood work done when I was on my last cycle while I was taking the prohormone and my test levels only came to 90, I'm pretty sure the doc said average test levels for my age are 600? not 100% sure but I'm pretty sure that's what he said, but anyway I'll get my blood work done both times and post them, wish me luck!!!

[Nick4551]

I'm not saying I know more than either of you guys, btlyt I already messed up my test levels and trained hard naturally, I wasn't happy with the results so I started prohormones and got a lot better results so now I want more and more and prohormones aren't cutting it, I understand what you guys are saying but understand my point of view of constantly training my as$ of and still not getting good enough results, I train great and eat and diet pretty good, I tried like 3 different ways of eatting, from healthy greens and stuff, to high protein and fatty foods, to high carbs, everything, I tried doing the macros, it's like nothing works to help me gain weight, but prohormones did, and I'm going to assume steroids will, and I didn't lose weight from the prohormones after my cycle, lost some water weight but that's all, I really appreciate that you guys care and yous are looking out for me, most people would just laugh and be like this kids going to eff himself up, I didn't come on the forums to ask whether I should do it or not, not trying to sound like an a-hole, but I came on the forums for advice on my cycle and for yous to help me with a good first cycle with everything I need, my mind has been set on doing the cycle and I doubt it's going to change because nothing works for me, maybe I'll do one cycle and hate it and never do it again or maybe I'll cycle for years who knows, but this is what I'm going to do fellas, maybe yous can help out and tell me everything I should need and do to lessen the probability of getting side effects, I know this is going to damage my body and I'll probably get some side effects but I would really appreciate the recommendations of what else to add into this cycle and if I should add any other products in...

[marcus300]

You didn't understand anything I said in my previous post.

Clearly I'm wasting my time


I'm out

[Nick4551]

i understood Marcus and I appreciate everything you said, I just don't listen

[NACH3]

Sorry but from reading youve not trained hard a day in your life! I used to think I trained hard lol - then I came here and found the real deal(FREAKS OF NATURE - MONSTERS WALKING THIS EARTH) - o can honestly say that everything that man(Marcus)has taught/showed it shared w/me(us) has had an impact on lifting and growing obviously - but real life shit as well!!

Your 19 and not one person has mentioned to you - to cycle!!! Don't you think that ought to tell you something! Your no where near ready(knowledge wise) or physically! Steroids won't do anything for you except hurt yourself! Listen up kid your outta your league!

[Nick4551]

thanks for yur input, but I guess we will see, I'll post progress pics and blood work results, I'll be your guys lab rat I guess

[Back In Black]

thanks for yur input, but I guess we will see, I'll post progress pics and blood work results, I'll be your guys lab rat I guess

Definitely not our lab rat, you are doing this to yourself.

[davidtheman100]

hmm interesting if you can't gain size with normal T levels i can't imagine how disappointed you're going to be when your test levels don't recover...Maybe you'll stop taking it for granted then? who knows?

[Nick4551]

I know I'm doing it to myself and if my T levels don't bounce back I'll keep cycling hahahahahahahahahahaha