Areas of confusion for me, so far

**bloodchoke** · 07-12-2015, 10:38 AM

Hey there Guys and Gals. This is my first post outside of my intro.
I’m a 44 yo man and have completed one short cycle of Test-E (500 / wk). I’m currently focused on getting my bf in the range of 15% before I begin my next cycle. I’m currently around 20%. I’m 5’8 and weigh 200 lbs. I have lifted weights off and on for 24 years. I’ve cleaned my diet up and am running ~500 calorie deficit. I’ve switched up my routine to super-setting moderate weight (hitting failure around 15-18 reps) AND adding an actual cardio session 3x /week (before this, I’ve always said anything over 6 reps is cardio

).

I’ve been reading steroid profiles and sample cycles / stacks and am planning my next one. I have will continue studying as getting around 15% bf is going to take me some time. So far, this is the cycle I’m thinking about. It is my second cycle and I suspect that many will advise against using Tren -A. It will be my first time stacking, too, and I feel like these doses are lower for that reason. The cycle is 4 weeks of bulking and 8 weeks of cutting:

Wk 1-4: Test-C 300mg, Dbol 30 mg ed
Wk 5-12: Cutaxyl 150, 150 eod (average 175mg / week of Test-P, Tren-A, and Masteron )
Wk 1-12: AI .25 ed
PCT: 40/40/20/20 Nolv

I have several questions:

1) how does look?
2) should I run caber at 1 mg/ wk after week 5? Should I start AI after week 2? HCG during or after?
3) liver support after week 5? Milk Thistle?
4) Does the choice between Nolv / Clomid vary as preference or is one better for certain cycle (a Tren cycle, say). Run both?
5) Blood tests, do you guys (in the states) have these done at a LabCorp type place?
6) I have a right shoulder that need full joint replacement. My dr wants me to wait till I’m 60 to have it done since I will most certainly need to have it replaced again in 15-20 years if I do it now. Would adding a low, therapeutic dose (100-150 mg/wk) of deca benefit me in that regard, at least as far as comfort?

These are the questions were I’ve found a lot of conflicting information. I am still reading through the sticky posts on here, but it's going to take a while to get through them all. I appreciate any input and thanks in advance for sharing your experience.

**Mr.BB** · 07-12-2015, 12:48 PM

So this is your 2nd cycle?

You are not ready for tren . Was your test cycle unsucessfull? If it was a sucess why do you think you need so many compounds?

If you want to add compounds add just one, like dbol . Furthermore, just because its called Cutaxyl does not means its going to shed fat ?!? Thats diet pal.

Your PCT is weak and you should have HCG in cycle.

**bloodchoke** · 07-12-2015, 06:54 PM

Originally Posted by Mr.BB

So this is your 2nd cycle?

You are not ready for tren . Was your test cycle unsucessfull? If it was a sucess why do you think you need so many compounds?

If you want to add compounds add just one, like dbol . Furthermore, just because its called Cutaxyl does not means its going to shed fat ?!? Thats diet pal.

Your PCT is weak and you should have HCG in cycle.

I'm not married to the idea of doing Tren. The fact the Cutaxyl is pre-stacked is interesting, is all. I don't expect the Cutaxyl shed anything, I just wanted to clean up the gains from the dbol. That's why I'm asking. As far as my PCT being weak, do you have any suggestions? Nolvadex and Clomid?

**redz** · 07-12-2015, 07:24 PM

Run both for pct, HCG is good to add too.

**thephoenix25** · 07-13-2015, 12:05 AM

1) Too early for Tren being second cycle IMO, no HCG ? PCT requires Clomid
2) Most keep it in hand and use caber if/when symptoms present because anti prolactins have sides too.
AI should be from week 1 till PCT
HCG from week 1 till 3 days before PCT
3) Milk Thistle is good but NAC, Liv52 are better (from what I've read), use them throughout the cycle and PCT
4) It is recommended to use both Clomid and Nolvadex for any cycle as they work synergistically during PCT
5) Don't know
6) This is a problem as you may end up injuring yourself further, be careful. Whilst deca may help, its quite a big step to include this in your second cycle. If it were me, I'd not use it.

From reading your post, I'd be far more concerned about doing further damage to your shoulder. Even with test and dbol you'll experience significant rapid strength increases that will take their toll on it. For what its worth, if it were me, I'd cut down to sub 15% then run another good ol' test only cycle, whilst being very aware of your shoulder. Piling it on too quickly will cause the weakest link to break, which in this case will be your shoulder. Injury mid cycle is crap, trust me.

**bloodchoke** · 07-13-2015, 08:18 AM

Thanks for answers; I know I asked a lot of questions.
I probably will just run Test again, maybe add dbol at 30mg / wk x4. There's so much conflicting information out there. Even this (parent) site recommends using hCG only in PCT and running Nolv *or* Clomid.

I can only imagine what a drag injuring yourself on cycle is. During my first cycle, I wouldn't even run and was paranoid when I would take my dogs hiking that I would roll my ankle. I wasn't clear about this, but considering deca wasn't to improve gym performance. My shoulder problems have been with me for decades and I'm clear about what motions I can and cannot perform. It's weird, I can do light overhead lifts and moderate front, lateral, and rear delt raises without problems, but removing my sweatshirt often involves sobbing.

The deca would more for general comfort, not healing.

The wisest thing to do is, as suggested, add no more than one new compound at a time, if only for troubleshooting purposes if I experience harsh sides. Thanks again for your thorough reply.

**jdc91gt** · 07-13-2015, 09:10 AM

Certainly a lot of questions are way better than too few! I see a lot of thought went into this cycle. First, I agree with redz and add the hCG unless you are on TRT (unlikely given your other statements). Second, clomid an nolva are best used together. I deviate somewhat and use a lower level of clomid as I have a bit of problem tolerating the higher doses in first week. Three, ditch the tren for later. Aside, glad to see you are working your bf down before plunging ahead. Fourth, if you are going to cut, I would stay away from the dbol in the first four weeks. If you have some tbol, maybe that. Folks can certainly disagree with me on that. Fifth, the shoulder injury. I've had both of my shoulders operated on for labrum tears and cuff tears in last 7 years. My theory was fix them sooner rather than later (I'm now 54) because recuperative powers diminish with age.

Also, the hCG is for keeping you ready for PCT. It is for on-cycle. Read the stickie thread by Austinite (I think is the author).

Lastly, best of luck and keep us posted!

**bloodchoke** · 07-13-2015, 09:53 AM

Certainly a lot of questions are way better than too few!

Thanks! That's how I feel, too. Thanks very much for your input re: gear and shoulder health. I badly dislocated my right should in 1988, had it fixed in 2005 (anchors are why I have such limited range of motion), and jacked it up a year ago swinging kettlebells around. I do have a cuff issue, but the joint is so arthritic that no one will fix the tendon/ligament issue without also replacing the joint. No one wants to polish a turd, I guess. I'll decide in September if I'm going to have the operation done in December or wait. My options seems to be have it done now, and have it done again when I'm 60-65. Or have it done when I'm 60-65, once. First-World problems. I've read that hCG stickie thread just yesterday! Thanks again and I plan to stay active on here when I start my next cycle. Cheers!

**bloodchoke** · 07-13-2015, 08:25 PM

Also, if I were to run tbol, would you recommend 4, 6, or 8 weeks and at what dose? Would I hold the test-e at 500/wk x12?

**michael30** · 07-14-2015, 02:11 AM

Originally Posted by jdc91gt

Certainly a lot of questions are way better than too few! I see a lot of thought went into this cycle. First, I agree with redz and add the hCG unless you are on TRT (unlikely given your other statements). Second, clomid an nolva are best used together. I deviate somewhat and use a lower level of clomid as I have a bit of problem tolerating the higher doses in first week. Three, ditch the tren for later. Aside, glad to see you are working your bf down before plunging ahead. Fourth, if you are going to cut, I would stay away from the dbol in the first four weeks. If you have some tbol, maybe that. Folks can certainly disagree with me on that. Fifth, the shoulder injury. I've had both of my shoulders operated on for labrum tears and cuff tears in last 7 years. My theory was fix them sooner rather than later (I'm now 54) because recuperative powers diminish with age.

Also, the hCG is for keeping you ready for PCT. It is for on-cycle. Read the stickie thread by Austinite (I think is the author).

Lastly, best of luck and keep us posted!

Jdc91gt I just wanted to give you a heads up. Hcg should be used on cycle even if you are on trt. Hcg is a important part of trt. I learned the hard way. As I was on trt for several years before I started Hcg. When I started there was a big difference. It helps me with my libido alot. If you wanted to look it up and not just take my word for it. You can Google Dr. MICHAEL SCALLY TRT or PCT. He is one of the leading Dr when it comes to AAS and trt/pct

**bloodchoke** · 07-15-2015, 11:50 PM

So I've decided to quell my curiosity and just run another test only cycle. On this next cycle, I will experiment with front loading (enanthate ) and I'll switch to test-p during the last four weeks of the 12 week cycle. I'll wait to introduce an oral or try masteron in my third or fourth cycle. This time, I'll run hCG and an AI throughout and add Clomid to PCT. I've gotten my food really dialed in over the past month. The soonest that my bf will be < 15.1% is Sept 1, but it will probably be more like Sept 15. I was too heavy during my first cycle (~26%). I'll start a thread in that section of the forum before I start so you guys/gals can critique my food, etc. Thanks for your suggestions.