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  1. #1
    Tropomyosin is offline New Member
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    Cycle thoughts, help

    Hi, this will be my 3rd cycle previous two were test only cycles, both were a success, I'd like to know if what I'm planning would be any good, this would be in preparation for an amateur bjj competion nothing big. However I've been vacant for quite a while with no training or whatsoever (been busy in medical school) total prep time would be 12 weeks 1st for would be without gear so as to just get a feel of getting back.
    Here are my stats: (when i started already on wk3 no gear yet)
    27 yr old
    185 lbs
    5'9
    20% bf

    Goal:
    - build quality muscle while getting down to 160lbs
    - reach 6-8% bf
    - increase str and endurance

    For the cycle:
    Wk 1-4: as i've mentioned no gear (feeling it out period, acually on wk3, bf 18%, 180lbs as of the moment)
    Wk 5-12: a mix of 250mg Test cyp/250mg test en
    Wk 8-12: Stanozolol 50mg ED
    Wk 5-6: ON clenbuterol work from 20mcg to 80mcg
    Wk 7-8 OFF clenbuterol
    Wk 9-10: ON clenbuterol 80mcg ED
    Wk 9-12: cytomel 50mg (depends on how much weight I'll be losing)

    Pct standard pct for 4 wks (clomid and nolva)

    I'll be running 2500 kcal for the whole duration
    30% protein
    55% Carbs
    15% Fats
    Last edited by Tropomyosin; 06-19-2016 at 10:53 AM.

  2. #2
    charger69's Avatar
    charger69 is online now Knowledgeable Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tropomyosin
    Hi, this will be my 3rd cycle previous two were test only cycles, both were a success, I'd like to know if what I'm planning would be any good, this would be in preparation for an amateur bjj competion nothing big. However I've been vacant for quite a while with no training or whatsoever (been busy in medical school) total prep time would be 12 weeks 1st for would be without gear so as to just get a feel of getting back. Here are my stats: (when i started already on wk3 no gear yet) 27 yr old 185 lbs 5'9 20% bf Goal: - build quality muscle while getting down to 160lbs - reach 6-8% bf - increase str and endurance For the cycle: Wk 1-4: as i've mentioned no gear (feeling it out period, acually on wk3, bf 18%, 180lbs as of the moment) Wk 5-12: a mix of 250mg Test cyp/250mg test en Wk 8-12: Stanozolol 50mg ED Wk 5-6: ON clenbuterol work from 20mcg to 80mcg Wk 7-8 OFF clenbuterol Wk 9-10: ON clenbuterol 80mcg ED Wk 9-12: cytomel 50mg (depends on how much weight I'll be losing) Pct standard pct for 4 wks (clomid and nolva) I'll be running 2500 kcal for the whole duration 30% protein 55% Carbs 15% Fats
    I do not recommend cycling above 15% bodyfat.
    I also do not recommend shutting down your system to get the results that you want. Proper diet and exercise will get you that.
    Everyone is different however i would lose more by decreasing carbs and increasing protein.

  3. #3
    Tropomyosin is offline New Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by charger69 View Post
    I do not recommend cycling above 15% bodyfat.
    I also do not recommend shutting down your system to get the results that you want. Proper diet and exercise will get you that.
    Everyone is different however i would lose more by decreasing carbs and increasing protein.
    I got the diet and training program down, thats why 1-4 wks will be without gear i'll get down lower than 15% down by the time i start 5th week, i run 5 miles a day every morning do my weight training at night, plus training for jiu jitsu, but i do get the concern

  4. #4
    numbere is offline RETIRED- Knowledgeable member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tropomyosin View Post
    I'll be running 2500 kcal for the whole duration
    30% protein
    55% Carbs
    15% Fats
    Quote Originally Posted by Tropomyosin View Post
    I got the diet and training program down...
    You're cycle is poorly planned, but more importantly if you plan on eating 2500 calories for the whole duration then you don't have the whole diet down.

    You should create a new thread in the diet forum so members can help get you on the right track.

  5. #5
    Tropomyosin is offline New Member
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    Any insights as to why it is poorly planned that way i could make some adjustments, will be posting in the diet forums tomorrow

  6. #6
    charger69's Avatar
    charger69 is online now Knowledgeable Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tropomyosin
    Any insights as to why it is poorly planned that way i could make some adjustments, will be posting in the diet forums tomorrow
    I know my body, but i am not a diet expert. I think that 2500 is actually quite a bit to cut however i do not know your exercise regime. I do know that martial arts training can be pretty intense.
    Running 5 miles, working out and jui jitsu can burn quite a few calories. The real experts are in the diet section as stated by number.

  7. #7
    MMA_Influenced's Avatar
    MMA_Influenced is offline Associate Member
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    Lol.. hes 185 and wants to get down to 160 and wanrs to know what we think of his 12 week cycle.

    Well for one my friend at 2 pounds of weight loss per week you could lose 24 pounds and be 161 pounds in 12 weeks natural. (Your goal was 160)

    Dont need a cycle to do that. Now it probably will help to maintain muscle while cutting. Maybe youll lose some muscle while cutting natural though.

  8. #8
    WordToPass is offline New Member
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    I'm not an expert, but I've also heard that it is not good to cycle above 15% body fat as charger said.

  9. #9
    Staynattybruh is offline New Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tropomyosin View Post
    Hi, this will be my 3rd cycle previous two were test only cycles, both were a success, I'd like to know if what I'm planning would be any good, this would be in preparation for an amateur bjj competion nothing big. However I've been vacant for quite a while with no training or whatsoever (been busy in medical school) total prep time would be 12 weeks 1st for would be without gear so as to just get a feel of getting back.
    Here are my stats: (when i started already on wk3 no gear yet)
    27 yr old
    185 lbs
    5'9
    20% bf

    Goal:
    - build quality muscle while getting down to 160lbs
    - reach 6-8% bf
    - increase str and endurance

    For the cycle:
    Wk 1-4: as i've mentioned no gear (feeling it out period, acually on wk3, bf 18%, 180lbs as of the moment)
    Wk 5-12: a mix of 250mg Test cyp/250mg test en
    Wk 8-12: Stanozolol 50mg ED
    Wk 5-6: ON clenbuterol work from 20mcg to 80mcg
    Wk 7-8 OFF clenbuterol
    Wk 9-10: ON clenbuterol 80mcg ED
    Wk 9-12: cytomel 50mg (depends on how much weight I'll be losing)

    Pct standard pct for 4 wks (clomid and nolva)

    I'll be running 2500 kcal for the whole duration
    30% protein
    55% Carbs
    15% Fats

    The posts about not using aas above 15% bf are completely bro science. The argument is you'll not "healthy" enough. Like high BP and such. But there's plenty of high bf people taking gear. Look at half the powerlifting community. And are fine. It's pretty hypocritical considering when I was heading into a show I'd be very unhealthy but no one talks about that.

    BUT. I do agree with the others about your main problem is dieting. Aas aren't magic plus 185 lbs and 20% bf..... that's pretty bad no offense. That sounds like you have no Fondation of muscle. You are obviously looking for shortcuts when you clearly aren't even training right.

  10. #10
    Tropomyosin is offline New Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by MMA_Influenced View Post
    Lol.. hes 185 and wants to get down to 160 and wanrs to know what we think of his 12 week cycle.

    Well for one my friend at 2 pounds of weight loss per week you could lose 24 pounds and be 161 pounds in 12 weeks natural. (Your goal was 160)

    Dont need a cycle to do that. Now it probably will help to maintain muscle while cutting. Maybe youll lose some muscle while cutting natural though.
    Alright I'm pretty sure I can get down to 160 without any gear, the problem, is by the time i reach 160 on the 12 week period i would have lost a good amount of muscle, which translates to less power and performance hence I need a bit of an edge, the cycle i've proposed so far is pretty much for performance enhancement, 185-160 is two weight classes down from my weight, which doesnt translate much to power

  11. #11
    Tropomyosin is offline New Member
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    Thank you for that 15% fact, no problem bro, as stated on the article i am on my 3rd week of training, 11st 4weeks will be without gear as to build a foundation, and already on 18% bf by the end of the 4th week i'll be on 15% maybe less, cycle starts at week 5, i wouldnt say it's a short cut more of a short competition prep time, 12 weeks in total and will be competing again a month after that

  12. #12
    numbere is offline RETIRED- Knowledgeable member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tropomyosin View Post
    Any insights as to why it is poorly planned that way i could make some adjustments, will be posting in the diet forums tomorrow
    My bad for the late response, it's been a hectic week.

    You should get your bf down to 15% or below before starting.

    There's a lot more to cycling at low bf than bro science.

    IMO you should just use test, winny and clen .

    T3 seems to reduce my strength quite a bit.

    Plus, if you're anxiety prone t3 will be counterproductive before a competition.

    I think you should use winny for the last 6-8 weeks, it's dht based and should give you a nice boost in strength.

    If you use clen then either take it two weeks on two weeks off or use it for the entire duration along with ketotifen to reset your beta two receptors.

    You should take 1200mg of NAC while you're using and 1800-2400mg while on winny.

    It would also be a good idea to incorporate 250IU of hcg from day one until 2-3 days before PCT.

    What is your plan for PCT?

  13. #13
    Tropomyosin is offline New Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by numbere View Post
    My bad for the late response, it's been a hectic week.

    You should get your bf down to 15% or below before starting.

    There's a lot more to cycling at low bf than bro science.

    IMO you should just use test, winny and clen .

    T3 seems to reduce my strength quite a bit.

    Plus, if you're anxiety prone t3 will be counterproductive before a competition.

    I think you should use winny for the last 6-8 weeks, it's dht based and should give you a nice boost in strength.

    If you use clen then either take it two weeks on two weeks off or use it for the entire duration along with ketotifen to reset your beta two receptors.

    You should take 1200mg of NAC while you're using and 1800-2400mg while on winny.

    It would also be a good idea to incorporate 250IU of hcg from day one until 2-3 days before PCT.

    What is your plan for PCT?
    Thank you! By the 4th week i'll get it down to 15%, will throw t3 out of the equation, I've got hcg on hand as well, pct will be clomid 70/50/50/50 nolva 40/20/20/20 ( would this be all right?), lastly, ketotifen? How and when should i take it? thanks for the input, I appreciate it a lot!

  14. #14
    MMA_Influenced's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Staynattybruh View Post

    The posts about not using aas above 15% bf are completely bro science. The argument is you'll not "healthy" enough. Like high BP and such. But there's plenty of high bf people taking gear. Look at half the powerlifting community. And are fine. It's pretty hypocritical considering when I was heading into a show I'd be very unhealthy but no one talks about that.

    BUT. I do agree with the others about your main problem is dieting. Aas aren't magic plus 185 lbs and 20% bf..... that's pretty bad no offense. That sounds like you have no Fondation of muscle. You are obviously looking for shortcuts when you clearly aren't even training right.
    Its 100% true. All bro science bullshit. Bro science also says that you should be over 200 pounds to start a cycle. These are idiots. Its well known that most natural body builders at competition only weigh between 145-175 depending on height. These men are at their genetic max. Says 200 pounds says nothing about body fat percentage or height. Someone whos 5"6 versus someone whos 6 foot at 200 pounds will look completely different.

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